Hypex NCx500 Class D Amplifier Review

[1200W]

Once the damping factor is above 30 or so it makes no difference if it is higher.

So do most amps have a damping factor above 30?
I was reading a review on the Hegel H400 and it had a damping factor of 4000. So these high numbers mean nothing really?

 

[peng]

???

I wouldn't call that silly:

View attachment 499528
(link)

I mean, at all!

To some extent it is a matter pof opinion. In my opinion, those so call autoformers are extra parts that add cost and likely don’t add value to a lot of the the Mc amp owners. Their marketing info can be misleading, in claiming that they allow the users to get all the power they paid for, something like that…..

I wouldn’t call that 100% silly either, but if I were to get a Mc I would try to get one that skipped the autoformers though that would no doubt limit my choices.

 

[Jim Taylor]

So do most amps have a damping factor above 30?
I was reading a review on the Hegel H400 and it had a damping factor of 4000. So these high numbers mean nothing really?

An in-depth discussion is here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...standing-of-amplifier-output-impedance.22380/

 

[Julf]

So do most amps have a damping factor above 30?

Yes.

I was reading a review on the Hegel H400 and it had a damping factor of 4000. So these high numbers mean nothing really?

Indeed.

 

[Julf]

An in-depth discussion is here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...standing-of-amplifier-output-impedance.22380/

For those who don't want to read the whole thread, "It is a forgone conclusion that the great majority of modern amplifiers have output impedance below the threshold where it would affect the loudspeaker’s performance. But this is not likely true for all amplifiers currently in production"

 

[Endibol]

So do most amps have a damping factor above 30?
I was reading a review on the Hegel H400 and it had a damping factor of 4000. So these high numbers mean nothing really?

No, not really, see here a link to my post on “damping factor”:

Benchmark AHB2 Review (Updated Measurements)

If you adopt a basic investment perspective and assuming you bought the unit for $3k in 2014, you could easily sell it today nearly 10 years later for $2k, so the real cost is only $1k or $100 a year (plus inflation), less than a media/ streaming subscription. That's the upside of buying...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[antcollinet]

In order of likelihood of problems:
1. Room
2. Loudspeakers
3. Power Amplifier
4. Preamplifier / DAC

Hearing is tricky : depends on age, health, exposure to noise, etc.

I would put mood/frame of mind quite close to the top of that list. Sometimes my system sounds crap - except it hasn't changed.

 

[Julf]

I would put mood/frame of mind quite close to the top of that list. Sometimes my system sounds crap - except it hasn't changed.

I have also found that half a bottle of decent red really improves the sound quality.

 

[peng]

???

I wouldn't call that silly:

View attachment 499528
(link)

I mean, at all!

By the way, would you know if Erin used the Autoformer's connections for 2,4, 8 ohms to match his test loads accordingly for each of his 2.4.8 ohm tests? I didn't want to bother you so I paid up and joined the Patreon memembership hoping to see more details but found none so I posted there and asked him but I wonder if you have quicker answer for me. Thanks regardless for the links.

 

[peng]

It looks like it is dominated by THD.

Excellent. So which Mcintosh is this? Only some of them have output transformers.

That might have been the case long time ago, but unfortunately I think most if not all of them have the Audoformers. I went to one of their dealers a couple years ago and asked for one that might be within my budget (say low output version for under $6K, and they only had one, a demo unit, and was an integrated rated 100 or 125 W (just by memory) so I left without one.

I don't always agree with Paul McGowan, but he has an interesting take on McIntosh transformers.

That would be rare lol...

 

[antcollinet]

I have also found that half a bottle of decent red really improves the sound quality.

So does a good Whiskey. Speaking of which.....

Cheers.

 

[Sokel]

By the way, would you know if Erin used the Autoformer's connections for 2,4, 8 ohms to match his test loads accordingly for each of his 2.4.8 ohm tests? I didn't want to bother you so I paid up and joined the Patreon memembership hoping to see more details but found none so I posted there and asked him but I wonder if you have quicker answer for me. Thanks regardless for the links.

I know as much as you do, but if I were to guess I would think he didn't, by the power figures he states at the beginning alone.
If we were to believe Mc (and other tests say that we should) , these figures would be the same or close.

I would also guess that he tested it by the 4 Ohm tap where power seems more, hence the 1.2kW result with his complex load.

 

[peng]

I know as much as you do, but if I were to guess I would think he didn't, by the power figures he states at the beginning alone.
If we were to believe Mc (and other tests say that we should) , these figures would be the same or close.

I would also guess that he tested it by the 4 Ohm tap where power seems more, hence the 1.2kW result with his complex load.

Surprisingly, he responded to my post on Christmas day, he said he did use the connections accordingly, that is 2 ohm load to 2 ohm binding posts etc.
I suspected that, and that's the main reason why I said the autoformers are not a silly thing but the way the marketing info is can be misleading as some or many may assume regardless of the nominal impedance of their speakers, they will get 600 W under the stated conditions (20-20kHz, 0.005% THD+N etc.).

In fact, his measurements show the amp could output a lot more, even when using the matching taps/binding posts.
That means, if someone like me, who would use only the 8 ohms or 4 ohms taps/binding posts, I can expect to get very close to double down outputs such as 1100 W 4 ohms, 1800 W 2 ohms for short duration peaks/transients. In a way, it is also misleading, even wrong for them to claim one of the benefits of the autoformer use is:

Thanks to our unique output Autoformer™ technology, your speakers will receive the full 600 Watts regardless if they have 2, 4 or 8 Ohm impedance, allowing you the ability to use the MC611 to its full potential.

In reality, if one uses the "impedance" taps, they are changing the maximum output voltage (somewhat similar, but not the same, to recent model AVR's impedance settings), thereby limiting the maximum current deliverable to the load. It is a good and safe way, especially for such a powerful amp, but for experienced users who know how to use the volume dial accordingly (to their specific applications, ie listening habit, speaker sensitivity, distance..), they can just use the 8 ohm binding posts without fear of damaging anything and in fact can get the "full potential" in case they might actually have use for the higher short duration peaks that might far exceed the "600 W" rated output. Sorry, if I failed to explain my point clearer. I must admit, I am somewhat biased, against the use of extra parts that are avoidable, especially heavy, bulky and costly parts such as auto transformers.

 

[Sokel]

Surprisingly, he responded to my post on Christmas day, he said he did use the connections accordingly, that is 2 ohm load to 2 ohm binding posts etc.
I suspected that, and that's the main reason why I said the autoformers are not a silly thing but the way the marketing info is can be misleading as some or many may assume regardless of the nominal impedance of their speakers, they will get 600 W under the stated conditions (20-20kHz, 0.005% THD+N etc.).

In fact, his measurements show the amp could output a lot more, even when using the matching taps/binding posts.
That means, if someone like me, who would use only the 8 ohms or 4 ohms taps/binding posts, I can expect to get very close to double down outputs such as 1100 W 4 ohms, 1800 W 2 ohms for short duration peaks/transients. In a way, it is also misleading, even wrong for them to claim one of the benefits of the autoformer use is:



In reality, if one uses the "impedance" taps, they are changing the maximum output voltage (somewhat similar, but not the same, to recent model AVR's impedance settings), thereby limiting the maximum current deliverable to the load. It is a good and safe way, especially for such a powerful amp, but for experienced users who know how to use the volume dial accordingly (to their specific applications, ie listening habit, speaker sensitivity, distance..), they can just use the 8 ohm binding posts without fear of damaging anything and in fact can get the "full potential" in case they might actually have use for the higher short duration peaks that might far exceed the "600 W" rated output. Sorry, if I failed to explain my point clearer. I must admit, I am somewhat biased, against the use of extra parts that are avoidable, especially heavy, bulky and costly parts such as auto transformers.

So I was wrong!
And I'm short of glad about being wrong that I had the chance to see how these famous tap measure.

The Mc philosophy of advertising them is short of "you get this piece of gear and you'll never have to worry again about any of the speaker you drive with it along the way, whatever the speaker will ask for ,this will deliver"
Short of a keeper, for life.

I kind of like that even if Mc's was never my thing (the looks alone... nope!) , OP amp (and Hypex) was never my thing either though (as a DIYer going cheap on components is a sacrilege despite the engineering view ) but I do think they're honest.
Either one represents a value, each at their own way, so...

 

[peng]

So I was wrong!
And I'm short of glad about being wrong that I had the chance to see how these famous tap measure.

The Mc philosophy of advertising them is short of "you get this piece of gear and you'll never have to worry again about any of the speaker you drive with it along the way, whatever the speaker will ask for ,this will deliver"
Short of a keeper, for life.

I kind of like that even if Mc's was never my thing (the looks alone... nope!) , OP amp (and Hypex) was never my thing either though (as a DIYer going cheap on components is a sacrilege despite the engineering view ) but I do think they're honest.
Either one represents a value, each at their own way, so...

Yes, they simply will deliver more than what they advertised, in terms of voltage, current, and hence power but obviously you have pay for it whether you need their high output or not. I like the look, and weight of the smaller units, 200 lbs for a pair is just unacceptable even if offered to me for free lol....