Hypex nCore vs Class A amps

[waltzingbear]

I'm most interested in how he was able to hear all of that with no speakers.
What, he was using speakers but didn't feel it was important to mention what he was using the amp with?

Be thorough, be precise, be accurate, otherwise, don't post on A Science R.

 

[oldsysop]

Here is experience with the Ncore 500 mono blocks. I burned in the amplifier for nearly 300 hours with music and Burnin tones. Here is my verdict of what I hear from this amp. Please don't take my comments as an attack as this is not my intention. I wanted these amps to really be ready for prime time and I am disappointed.

The good
Dynamic
Gutsy
Solid bass
Silent, emits no self noise at speakers or amp
Good imaging

The not so good
Treble and bass seem disconnected most of the time from the midrange
No midrange bloom or emotional expression
Dark sounding contrary to a living presentation or the illusion of
Weird treble and or hard at times
Not a huge soundstage

Mostly sounds that the balance is bass heavy and propped up treble.
I am disappointed that it didn't outplay my class A/B amplifier that runs in class A for the first Watt as I was considering replacing my amplification with NCORE amps. Maybe in the future but not yet. YMMV.

I am posting comments as to help others and not to bash products.

I don't like class D either, but this type of post doesn't help.

 

[ahofer]

I'm most interested in how he was able to hear all of that with no speakers.
What, he was using speakers but didn't feel it was important to mention what he was using the amp with?

Be thorough, be precise, be accurate, otherwise, don't post on A Science R.

Within reason - I don't care what cables he was using, or whether they were elevated. But these guys do:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussi...s-a-little-too-bright-can-a-cable-help-me-out

As for my post, streaming to Cambridge Audio DAC to the two amps, out to Harbeth SHL5+(AE)

 

[DonH56]

Sounds like the OPs original amp interacted with his speakers in a way more pleasing to him than the more neutral class D amplifier.

 

[restorer-john]

The Hypex NCore 400 measured a S/N of 120 dB. I cannot point to many AB amplifiers that improve on that.

I could point to many dozens, perhaps hundreds. I've got several here. Remember, as the power goes up, so does the S/N and there are multi KW class ABs...

 

[Koeitje]

I am not blind to measurements and know that the specifications on the N core are exemplary. I expressed my opinion on what I experienced and this does not mean that these are bad amps. They have huge qualities and may make some systems sing. It just didn't happen for me in my rig and I was truly wishing otherwise. If anyone wants to buy these modules they are for sale. Cost price and I pay shipping.

You probably like the higher distortion in your other amplifiers.

 

[maarten]

Here is experience with the Ncore 500 mono blocks. I burned in the amplifier for nearly 300 hours with music and Burnin tones. Here is my verdict of what I hear from this amp. Please don't take my comments as an attack as this is not my intention. I wanted these amps to really be ready for prime time and I am disappointed.

The good
Dynamic
Gutsy
Solid bass
Silent, emits no self noise at speakers or amp
Good imaging

The not so good
Treble and bass seem disconnected most of the time from the midrange
No midrange bloom or emotional expression
Dark sounding contrary to a living presentation or the illusion of
Weird treble and or hard at times
Not a huge soundstage

Mostly sounds that the balance is bass heavy and propped up treble.
I am disappointed that it didn't outplay my class A/B amplifier that runs in class A for the first Watt as I was considering replacing my amplification with NCORE amps. Maybe in the future but not yet. YMMV.

I am posting comments as to help others and not to bash products.

How can I take someone seriously when he thinks that a solid state amp needs burn-in ? Even Hypex says their amps do not need burn-in, their performance and characteristics simply do not change during the first 300 hours. Luckily, if it did it would be an extremely bad engineered amplifier.

You are NOT helping others when you mention 'burn-in', it's a audiophile myth that solid state amps need burn-in which they don't. So please stop spreading this rubbish.

What might change during burn-in is your brain gets used to the sound and hence your perception of the sound changes.

 

[rgpit]

How can I take someone seriously when he thinks that a solid state amp needs burn-in ? Even Hypex says their amps do not need burn-in, their performance and characteristics simply do not change during the first 300 hours. Luckily, if it did it would be an extremely bad engineered amplifier.

You are NOT helping others when you mention 'burn-in', it's a audiophile myth that solid state amps need burn-in which they don't. So please stop spreading this rubbish.

What might change during burn-in is your brain gets used to the sound and hence your perception of the sound changes.

Only 300 hours of "burn in"? ... I've been burning in my ears for decades!

 

[restorer-john]

Honestly, I'm pretty disgusted by the wave of attacks on @6feet . It's really not friendly and makes ASR look like a bunch of brainwashed Hypex followers at a church gathering.

He's put his money where his mouth is, and purchased Class D amplifiers, something a lot of you keyboard warriors have not done. He's clearly slightly disappointed after his comparisons, and is happy to let them go to someone who wants them at a bargain price. He's an independent thinker and not afraid to speak his mind- something increasingly rare in this group-think driven world.

As Don pointed out, the amplifier and speaker combination he had may be a better match than the Class Ds. Nothing wrong with that- Class D is not a universal panacea.

Oh, and Welcome to ASR @6feet Rest assured it's a mostly friendly place...

 

[maarten]

Honestly, I'm pretty disgusted by the wave of attacks on @6feet . It's really not friendly and makes ASR look like a bunch of brainwashed Hypex followers at a church gathering.

He's put his money where his mouth is, and purchased Class D amplifiers, something a lot of you keyboard warriors have not done. He's clearly slightly disappointed after his comparisons, and is happy to let them go to someone who wants them at a bargain price. He's an independent thinker and not afraid to speak his mind- something increasingly rare in this group-think driven world.

As Don pointed out, the amplifier and speaker combination he had may be a better match than the Class Ds. Nothing wrong with that- Class D is not a universal panacea.

Oh, and Welcome to ASR @6feet Rest assured it's a mostly friendly place...

Burning in a solid state amp is not proof of an independent thinker, it proofs the opposite. It proofs that you do not think and just follow the bullshit from others...

And yes I own a Ncore NC500 amp... When it was delivered there was a note in the box that the amp needed 250 hours of burn-in.... I was shocked and contacted the builders since I did not had the intention to order an amp that is instable by nature... I contacted Hypex also and they were not happy the builders were telling this BS about amps build with their modules... since the the Hypex amps (and solid state amps in general) do not need burn in....

 

[restorer-john]

Burning in a solid state amp is not proof of an independent thinker, it proofs the opposite. It proofs that you do not think and just follow the bullshit from others...

If you have nothing useful to add to the thread, I suggest you refrain from commenting.

 

[Purité Audio]

I have class A/B, Benchmark, NCore, is there a genuine Class A amplifier , the original Mark Levinson monos 25 watts?
Keith

 

[maarten]

If you have nothing useful to add to the thread, I suggest you refrain from commenting.

That's why i did not refrain. Since my observation is useful. You are entitled to disagree.

 

[restorer-john]

That's why i did not refrain. Since my observation is useful.

Nor did you refrain from editing your post after the fact to drive home some perceived "point" you keep hammering on about. Most of us progressed past being outraged about burn-in claims more than 30 years ago. I see you aren't there yet, but go on, keep at it in every ASR thread you can inject it into, you might save some poor soul from himself and bask in that tiny shaft of reflected kudos.

 

[maarten]

Nor did you refrain from editing your post after the fact to drive home some perceived "point" you keep hammering on about. Most of us progressed past being outraged about burn-in claims more than 30 years ago. I see you aren't there yet, but go on, keep at it in every ASR thread you can inject it into, you might save some poor soul from himself and bask in that tiny shaft of reflected kudos.

You obviously did not get the point.

 

[Julf]

Remember, as the power goes up, so does the S/N

That is news to me. Can you please explain how that works?

Most of the noise comes from the input stages. The noise gets amplified by the gain just as much as the signal, so SNR stays the same, independent of amplifier power.

 

[Matias]

That is news to me. Can you please explain how that works?

Most of the noise comes from the input stages. The noise gets amplified by the gain just as much as the signal, so SNR stays the same, independent of amplifier power.

Just look how most thd+n x power graphs are descending, at least up to a point where they stabilize and finally shoot up at clipping.

 

[Willem]

The social challenge here is to be factual and precise, but also welcoming. The OP cannot help it that he has read so much unscientific nonsense in magazines and on loony websites like Audiogon. So let us persuade him with facts.

 

[q3cpma]

Nor did you refrain from editing your post after the fact to drive home some perceived "point" you keep hammering on about. Most of us progressed past being outraged about burn-in claims more than 30 years ago. I see you aren't there yet, but go on, keep at it in every ASR thread you can inject it into, you might save some poor soul from himself and bask in that tiny shaft of reflected kudos.

Letting your bastion of technological integrity being fouled by people not taking the time to lurk a little bit in the name of Kumbaya virtue signaling isn't "progress" at all, mate. These people should be shamed or at least made a little fun of, unless you want audiosciencereview.com to simply die under the flood of people that don't want to integrate. Or do you want another Eternal September? I've suffered enough from these.
The only real point you make is that it shouldn't take more than one post.

It's really not friendly and makes ASR look like a bunch of brainwashed Hypex followers at a church gathering.

Looks like you drank too much of the relativism kool-aid. But you described it well: atheists at a church gathering (well, except that the gathering is one man strong, here). Fortunately, atheism isn't a belief, same way baldness isn't a haircut.

He's an independent thinker and not afraid to speak his mind- something increasingly rare in this group-think driven world.

That's some wishful thinking here. Anyway, even if this were the case, (real) independant thinking only has value when it's right. Yes, only truth has value, the world isn't fair.


Honestly, I can almost understand the overcocooning, but not putting this guy on a pedestal like he's some kind of Asterix raging against the mean objectivists. Too much TV, maybe.

 

[Julf]

Just look how most thd+n x power graphs are descending, at least up to a point where they stabilize and finally shoot up at clipping.

Yes, but that applies to that specific amp, with fixed gain. Of course SNR improves as you increase the signal. The claim was not that SNR gets better towards the top of the power capability of an amp, but that a more powerful amp (that necessarily has a higher gain for the same input signal) would have lower SNR.