HQplayer - do I need it?

[gvl]

Thanks for clarifying. I agree with you and apologize for replying out of context. In that specific case, synchronization would require that the recovered SPDIF clock be exposed to an external output (BNC) and used to drive to the master clock input on the USB DAC. If that capability is unavailable, contiguous playback cannot be guaranteed.

If you use the RME ADI-2 DAC for spdif capture and also for playback it will clock it’s USB input by spdif clock if sampling rates match, so everything will run nicely synchronized. I suspect many professional USB interfaces that have spdif inputs and offer concurrent capture and playback through its DAC should do the same. OKTO DAC8 Pro does it s as well.

 

[Music1969]

There may be a way to route an spdif input to this WDM driver through some sort of virtual cable and have rate detection working, but I haven’t tried.

Yes that's what we've been discussing with RME + HQPlayer

I'm not sure if @Keith_W is saying this is possible or not with JRiver

I can use the official Tidal, Apple Music, Qobuz , Spotify , Soundcloud apps and don't need to pay 3rd party

The official apps have superb features that 3rd party don't, especially recommendation algorithms

 

[gvl]

I can use the official Tidal, Apple Music, Qobuz , Spotify , Soundcloud apps and don't need to pay 3rd party

JRiver has rich DSP capabilities with reasonably friendly user interface, that’s the use case here.

 

[Music1969]

JRiver has rich DSP capabilities with reasonably friendly user interface, that’s the use case here.

That's the use case for yourself you mean? In terms of using those apps I mentioned via 3rd party app

Not the use case for everyone in this thread surely?

I've demonstrated a few things HQPlayer can do that JRIver can not.

It's up to each individual to see if any of those things apply to them - cannot generalize.

 

[bogi]

About automated input rate switching when playing from external sources - this is relevant to your discussion: https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/19715-hq-player/?do=findComment&comment=1236613

Without automated input rate switching I am able to send sound of any app to HQPlayer directly without Windows mixer/resampler being involved. For example just now I am listening from Firefox Youtube source through VAC

In Windows Settings of Win11 you can set output device of any app separately. So I set Line1 of VAC as output device for Firefox.

In HQPlayer I have set Line1 as WASAPI input device:

During playback, HQPlayer shows input and output bit depth and sample rate (so I am going from 48k to 48k based DSD256):

During that playback, when going to Windows sound settings, it shows that Line1 is set to 44.1k (despite I am playing 48k content).
When I change volume in Level tab, nothing happens.

When I attempt to change Windows sample rate setting, a warning appears pointing to exclusive use of audio device by an application.

That demonstrates WASAPI exclusive in function.

 

[Music1969]

Without automated input rate switching I am able to send sound of any app to HQPlayer directly without Windows mixer/resampler being involved. For example just now I am listening from Firefox Youtube source through VAC

Thanks.

Just to be clear, auto rate switching does not work with this method

You have to manually change sample rate before exclusive mode takes over

 

[bogi]

Just to be clear, auto rate switching does not work with this method

You have to manually change sample rate before exclusive mode takes over

Yes, I need to stop playback in HQPlayer, select other URI line for audio input and start playback again. VAC adapts automatically within sample rate range which is configured in VAC Control Panel.

According to Miska automated rate switching on Windows can work with ASIO only. Since HQPlayer does not provide ASIO proxy input device, a virtual cable product with ASIO support would be needed. I don't know about such. So currently only hardware based solutions work with HQPlayer, for example with RME HDSPe AIO card or with RME ADI-2.
For example: https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/19715-hq-player/?do=findComment&comment=1236576

 

[Music1969]

Yes I already use the RME method.

And no Windows at all in my daily listening.

And no 3rd party apps. All official iPadOs apps (Apple Music Hires, Tidal, Spotify, Soundcloud, anything really)

I use headless HQPlayer Embedded

All controlled from an iPad

Never had a single audio dropout - HQP does big buffer to make it practical non-issue.

 

[Keith_W]

As I reported earlier in this thread, I have a HQP 3.x license. Or rather, I had one. I suffered a catastrophic HDD failure, and I went to HQP's website to download another copy. It turns out that you can't. I emailed Jussi requesting reactivation of the license. This is the response:

So, we have software that costs USD$261. Use it for 2 years, and your license goes poof. If you don't have a backup of the setup .EXE file, you are SOL.

Let's put this in context: if you buy two HQP licenses, you are paying more than a Roon lifetime subscription of $500 before they raised their price to $830. Everyone agrees that HQP has an awful interface, so it needs other software to make it useable. My only use for HQP is as a convolution program, and even then JRiver costs $60 and offers you 10 activations, and Hang Loose Convolver costs $130 and offers you 6 activations.

Why do I want to reactivate my HQP license? Because I paid for it! I can understand if he won't let me download v4.0 for free, but at least make the old version available for license holders!

The other reason is because I am suffering from latency issues with JRiver (see my other thread) and I am trying different convolution engines to see if they are faster. In any case, I downloaded the trial version. If anything, latency in HQP is even worse than JRiver and it requires third party software and complicated workarounds (like VB Audio Cable) to make it work as a convolution engine. On my i9-9900, CPU overhead is reasonable for 8 channel PCM convolution, about 5-6%. But if I try DSD convolution, it shoots up to 80% and I start hearing stuttering.

 

[Music1969]

If anything, latency in HQP is even worse than JRiver and it requires third party software and complicated workarounds (like VB Audio Cable) to make it work as a convolution engine

Absolutely do not need 3rd party to make HQP work as a convolver.

it is now setup by default to do 128 channels of pipeline matrix processing.

You must be doing something very wrong

Latency is worse because it is made for audio only, not with video use. This is by design.

 

[Keith_W]

Absolutely do not need 3rd party to make HQP work as a convolver.

it is now setup by default to do 128 channels of pipeline matrix processing.

You must be doing something very wrong

It can? You can send Tidal to HQP without using a virtual cable? When I was experimenting last night, HQP did not appear as an optional output for any of my audio software. I'll look again.

 

[Music1969]

It can? You can send Tidal to HQP without using a virtual cable? When I was experimenting last night, HQP did not appear as an optional output for any of my audio software. I'll look again.

Your previous post never mentioned anything about Tidal so it was impossible to know what you are trying to do.

I previously explained how I feed any source into HQPlayer bit perfectly, without any 3rd party app.

 

[bogi]

You can send Tidal to HQP without using a virtual cable?

You can play from Tidal to HQPlayer Embedded via UPnP/DLNA. For example from phone app (mconnect Player, BubbleUPnP).

Qobuz is IMO better option than MQAized Tidal. HQPlayer v4 (both Desktop and Embedded) supports streaming from Qobuz and HRA Streaming service natively without need of any other device or 3rd party app.

 

[Keith_W]

Thank you, I will have a look at it.

 

[PaperBoat]

Hello,

I have been looking into HQplayer and was wondering if it would benefit me. I currently use Tidal for all my music listening.

My set up config is as follows:

1. Andriod Phone running BubbleUpnp Client (Tidal)
2. PC running BubbleUpnp Server delivering streams to Foobar
3. Foobar playing streams to my DAC
4. DAC connected to Amp and Speakers

Reason I do this is because I like to use my phone to select tracks and get my PC to play them via my DAC. I tried the Cast feature in the Tidal Andriod App to a Chromecast but it didn't sound good. The Tidal Andriod Cast feature doesn't see the Tidal desktop app as a device (if it did I would quite happily forget all of this and use that instead!)

Anyway, the above set up works OK but I'm only getting around CD quality sound and I was wondering if upsampling using HQplayer would provide a benefit rather than having the DAC do it? If so, would it be possible to fit this bit of software into the setup I have above? Perhaps between step 3 and 4 - Something like:

1. Andriod Phone running BubbleUpnp Client (Tidal)
2. PC running BubbleUpnp Server delivering streams to Foobar
3. Foobar playing streams with HQ Player as an output
4. HQ Player upsampling and playing streams to my DAC
5. DAC connected to Amp and Speakers

I appreciate I may be misunderstanding the whole process when it comes to HQplayer! I'm really just asking if this is a viable solution rather than how to do it as I'm sure I could figure it out if it's possible.

I have these DAC's in my possesion

• Chord Mojo
• Topping D10
• Denon 1600NE (has its own internal PCM1795 DAC)

Also have a SMSL Sanskrit 10th MKII on its way.

Any advice would be appreciated!

Yes. You definitely need it.

 

[vkshankar]

I’m a HQplayer big fan as well! I used and App called HouseCurve to do room correction and it was quite fun and easier and
cheaper than Audiolense <yes of course not as good>. I just export values into parametric equalizer on HQplayer and that’s it.

I’m currently using 2 audio Zones as endpoint on HQplayer one with Accuphase DAC-60 DSD256 and the other with Ifi Neo IDSD DSD512x48 both using a Rpi4 NAA as endpoint.

HQplayer NAA is the only option to be able to to reach DSD256 on DAC-60 without having to use a windows ASIO driver, so I’m quite happy because MacOS core audio can do only DoP at max DSD128.

Have fun!

Could you please let me know how you were able to get HQPlayer NAA to output DSD256 to the Accupahse DAC60? I have tried may options but can only get DSD128 (5.6MHz) with DoP enabled in HQPlayer Embedded config.

 

[Moises]

Sure ! It’s one of best kept secrets of HQplayer!


Buy a Pi 4 (2 GB Ram also ok)
CanaKit Raspberry Pi 4 Extreme Kit - 128GB Edition (4GB RAM) https://a.co/d/itbc7Jh

Download NAA Pi 4 image
https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/naa/images/naa-450-raspberrypi4-holored.7z

Unzip image and use etcher to copy NAA image into NAA memory stick
https://etcher.balena.io/

Booth the NAA connected to a monitor and keyboard

NAA volume fix

1. Login on NAA console as “root”, no password
2. Run “aplay -l” to list devices, take note on card number of the Holo interface
3. Run “alsamixer -c N” where N is the number found on step 2
4. Use arrow keys to adjust volume to 100%
5. Close the mixer by hitting ESC
6. Run “alsactl store” to store these settings for subsequent restarts

Connect the NAA Rpi4 to your network and USB port to your DAC.

HQplayer should be able to detect the NAA with your DAC-60 and setup as my screenshot ( is direct DSD no DoP)

Enjoy

 

[vkshankar]

Sure ! It’s one of best kept secrets of HQplayer!


Buy a Pi 4 (2 GB Ram also ok)
CanaKit Raspberry Pi 4 Extreme Kit - 128GB Edition (4GB RAM) https://a.co/d/itbc7Jh

Download NAA Pi 4 image
https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/naa/images/naa-450-raspberrypi4-holored.7z

Unzip image and use etcher to copy NAA image into NAA memory stick
https://etcher.balena.io/

Booth the NAA connected to a monitor and keyboard

NAA volume fix

1. Login on NAA console as “root”, no password
2. Run “aplay -l” to list devices, take note on card number of the Holo interface
3. Run “alsamixer -c N” where N is the number found on step 2
4. Use arrow keys to adjust volume to 100%
5. Close the mixer by hitting ESC
6. Run “alsactl store” to store these settings for subsequent restarts

Connect the NAA Rpi4 to your network and USB port to your DAC.

HQplayer should be able to detect the NAA with your DAC-60 and setup as my screenshot ( is direct DSD no DoP)

Enjoy

Thanks for the quick response!!! This is very interesting. I have tried with both NAA v4.5.0-57 armhf (for beaglebone black with ARM Cortex A8 and Debian 11) and NAA v4.5.0-57 amd64 (for minnowboard max with Intel Atom SoC and Debian 11) and haven't been able to get more that 5.6MHz (DSD128) and that too with DoP enabled in HQPlayer Embedded 4.5.x running on a 4 core Xeon E3 based Linux (Debian 11) system. I am wondering if there is anything special about the Holo Red NAA image. I believe Holo Red a streamer implementation with RBPi. Nonetheless I am going to give RBPi4 a shot. Also, DAC-60 supports Melco's markerless DSD which can reach DSD256 or Quad DSD. Wondering if NAA image for Holo Red added that support for markerless DSD. Lastly I see your HQPlayer is on Mac OSX. I am not sure if that would make any difference. Again thanks a lot for the pointers. This is all too interesting !!! Will revert after trying RBPi4 NAA with the holo red image.

 

[Moises]

It’s actually the version 4.50 and also compatible with Holo Red. I was actually one of the first that Jussi help to get Accuphase DAC-60 working. You can see all discussion on Roon HQplayer forum.

I know about Melco’s support, I reached on them to share about their DSD to help make the NAA drivers but no response, in the end Jussi figured it out.

You just need also to adjust the volume on the Rpi 4 version as I mentioned. If you use the x64ram version (pc) https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/naa/images/naa-450-x64ramfs.7z you don’t need to adjust the alsamixer.

I currently have 3 NAA with 3 DAC with HQplayer as endpoint on Roon Rock. They are solid and stable.

Reading your reply, it should work with that NAA versions. Can you post a screenshot of your HQplayer settings?

 

[LGD_]

Since no other software contains the same filters and modulators HQPlayer provides (since exactly these are Signalysts authorship & intellectual property) you really can only compare oranges to apples. The only valid A/B test here is to play back PCM bitperfect through HQPlayer and to play back the same PCM transcoded to DSD through HQPlayer - to check whether or not you prefer HQPlayers processing over the DACs internal processing (in case of Sigma Delta DACs).

I for one found and am still finding all my Sigma Delta DACs sound "better" when I feed them with DSD through HQPlayer (I upsample everything to high rate DSD).
For me it really has nothing to do with file formats and recordings available anywhere (PCM, DSD edited or unedited) but solely with the "format" we are listening to anyway when using a certain DAC (almost always Sigma Delta - so "DSD").

Agreed.
However, if upsampling to DSD is all you're after, and since the OP is already running foobar, I suggest that he try this..

With the SACD and DSD Processor components installed in foobar,
I am upsampling all my PCM [ 44.1 > 192 FLACs ] to DSD 256, fed to my SMSL D-6 DAC, in direct DSD (pr-d) mode.
The SQ improvement is very real, even Redbook CD rips sound better. And best of all, it's free

Foobar 2000 for Dummies (Part 2) – Playing DSD – SACD plugin

(Last updated 23-02-2024) For a guide on how to losslessly compress DSD file size by 50% very easily with Wavpack 5.x, BatchEncoder and SACD plugin 1.04 (or later) click –> HERE <&#8211…

diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com