How to improve Hi Res music listening on Denon AVR 3700H + Klipsch RP 8000F

[Sal1950]

Now I understand Audyssey cuts out the bass to get a flat frequency response.

Yes, but it will mostly do whatever you tell it to do with the app.
Looking at your "before" graph shows the low bass to be quite exaggerated in the 40-100hz range to the tune of almost 10+ db.
Because of subwoofer settings or what I'm not sure but I would think it could sound a bit boomy like that.
Many of us would dial in a room curve to have a bit of extra bass down there but not to that extent and not with those large peaks but more of a smooth climb.

I haven't used Apple Music because I had other subscriptions. I will get it and experience Multichannel music and Atmos music as well.
I did not know about HDMI being used for audio listening, will spend some time experimenting with this as per your suggestion.

If you decide to try Apple Music, I would highly recommend getting a Apple TV 4k box and just connect it directly to your Denon using a HDMI cable. HDMI will deliver whatever source you use in a accurate digital stream manner allowing the playback of their multich/Atmos files with
no sweat or problems.

is there an alternate for UMIK ?

There are, but REW and umik are kind of designed to work together, with the umik coming with a calibration file that REW will ask for and get you all setup and running in a no-grief manner.

 

[Marc v E]

Because of the earlier post by @FrantzM I just realised that buying the Audyssey app may also give you all the tools you need. I'm not familiar with the app, but it appears to give you the ability to set eq and compare with results and -even better- adjust the frequency curve.

 

[AdamG]

Thank you for the warm welcome, been reading the forums for a long time and was shy to ask questions earlier and it took a lot for me to step out of my shell and reach out for help.

Its a small apartment living room W19" x L 12", no Accoustic treatment on the walls since its rented, I have a rug and a few cheap acoustic foam panels on the walls. It has a full glass balcony door on the right and plenty of open space on the left. (attached are some pictures)

The speakers are placed in an equilateral triangle from the listening position, and the the FR speakers are toed in and a feet from the back wall.
I am using the PB1000 as sub for movies, for music listening I prefer without the sub because the bass sounds very bloated and not tight and punchy, music sound lot better in my cars stereo system than in my room, so I assumed that there's something wrong with my setup.
I read somewhere since this is a ported sub and its good for movies but not as good for music listening a sealed sub is preferred, I made this decision consciously when purchasing the RP8000 thinking I will not be using a sub for music listening and hence I opted for the PB1000.
I have the Audyssey app not sure if I have used it correctly, followed a YouTube video and setup it up based on that, not sure if I have done that correctly.
I also have a second sub with is a very old pure acoustics sub, was not sure if that would match with the PB1000 so I have not connected that as a second sub.

Two words: Toe In!

Just a primer: https://uturnaudio.com/pages/speaker-placement

toeing in speakers - Google Search

 

[Sal1950]

Because of the earlier post by @FrantzM I just realised that buying the Audyssey app may also give you all the tools you need. I'm not familiar with the app, but it appears to give you the ability to set eq and compare with results and -even better- adjust the frequency curve.

Yes, the best $20 you'll ever spend.

 

[Sal1950]

Two words: Toe In!

Excellent basic primer Adam!
I would only add that the crossover axis will sometimes give the best imaging if made slightly in-front of
the listeners head. Many manufacturers suggest this toe-in angle including Dr Hsu of HSU Research.
The listener can try a few alternatives to find which give the best focused image..

 

[Chrispy]

Thanks for pointing about HDMI I was under the wrong impression that HDMI is used only for movies and not for serious audio listening. I agree that have been totally distracted with hi res music, bitrates etc.. lot of learnings here Thank you

HDMI is the most capable digital connection at this point. Serious audio listening means what? You been reading those silly "audiophile" magazines and blogs? Hi res music is of limited value, too. Don't get hung up on the bit depth/sampling frequency....the actual recording means more (if you even get provenance for that).

 

[fubarnow]

The most valuable tools I use in playback is Listening, Trusting yer own taste in sound.
Thinking about the best way to make it better, then taking action to reach that goal.
Everyone has their own taste and a computer inside my AVR does not set my sound
to the way I think it should be. Personally, I do a much better job that my sound processor
but I'm a Hands On type of guy because it's always been that way for me.
Street Smarts

 

[Chrispy]

The most valuable tools I use in playback is Listening, Trusting yer own taste in sound.
Thinking about the best way to make it better, then taking action to reach that goal.
Everyone has their own taste and a computer inside my AVR does not set my sound
to the way I think it should be. Personally, I do a much better job that my sound processor
but I'm a Hands On type of guy because it's always been that way for me.
Street Smarts

uh huh

 

[Sal1950]

The most valuable tools I use in playback is Listening, Trusting yer own taste in sound.
Thinking about the best way to make it better, then taking action to reach that goal.
Everyone has their own taste and a computer inside my AVR does not set my sound
to the way I think it should be. Personally, I do a much better job that my sound processor
but I'm a Hands On type of guy because it's always been that way for me.
Street Smarts

The human brain and hearing are the most unreliable tools to use for system tuning
if accurately reproducing what's on the source is of any real importance in your goals.
Science and measuring tools are at the ready for you needs.

 

[fubarnow]

The human brain and hearing are the most unreliable tools to use for system tuning
if accurately reproducing what's on the source is of any real importance in your goals.
Science and measuring tools are at the ready for you needs.

Thanks for yer input, You use what works for you.
I use measuring tools available with my equipment and while
they do the job that they do and I do use them in some applications
in others I do not.
I enjoy what I have.

 

[tjcinnamon]

Yes, but it will mostly do whatever you tell it to do with the app.
Looking at your "before" graph shows the low bass to be quite exaggerated in the 40-100hz range to the tune of almost 10+ db.
Because of subwoofer settings or what I'm not sure but I would think it could sound a bit boomy like that.
Many of us would dial in a room curve to have a bit of extra bass down there but not to that extent and not with those large peaks but more of a smooth climb.

If you decide to try Apple Music, I would highly recommend getting a Apple TV 4k box and just connect it directly to your Denon using a HDMI cable. HDMI will deliver whatever source you use in a accurate digital stream manner allowing the playback of their multich/Atmos files with
no sweat or problems.


There are, but REW and umik are kind of designed to work together, with the umik coming with a calibration file that REW will ask for and get you all setup and running in a no-grief manner.

My only gripe about the ATV 4K is that it will resample to 48khz no matter what the source is

I love that box. Best streamer around. I’m hoping they will make it work with Apple Music as good as they do with the phones.

 

[fubarnow]

I wonder what "audiophiles" did before the High Tech Business
back in the old days.

 

[Sal1950]

I wonder what "audiophiles" did before the High Tech Business
back in the old days.

Hi Fi people were much more science and measurement oriented.
If you go back on-line and read the old magazines like Stereo Review and Audio and even older, the majority were talking about improved sound from better measurements & and how to get them.
Then came the days of digital recording, the greatest number of audible problems were solved and the snake-charmers came along with fairytale sound problems to spend huge dollars on. Worthless junk like expensive power cords and cables of all type. They also then turned their gear back to types when things had real audible problems to talk about and tweak, things like tube gear and turntables, arms, needles, and all the rest.
I know, I was there.

 

[fubarnow]

Hi Fi people were much more science and measurement oriented.
If you go back on-line and read the old magazines like Stereo Review and Audio and even older, the majority were talking about improved sound from better measurements & and how to get them.
Then came the days of digital recording, the greatest number of audible problems were solved and the snake-charmers came along with fairytale sound problems to spend huge dollars on. Worthless junk like expensive power cords and cables of all type. They also then turned their gear back to types when things had real audible problems to talk about and tweak, things like tube gear and turntables, arms, needles, and all the rest.
I know, I was there.

Gee, thanks for informing me, I guess I know nothing.

 

[FrantzM]

My only gripe about the ATV 4K is that it will resample to 48khz no matter what the source is

I love that box. Best streamer around. I’m hoping they will make it work with Apple Music as good as they do with the phones.

It doesn't matter, you won't (can't) hear the differences brought in by the process.

On a different front:

I am however annoyed by the entire UI from Apple when it comes to interfacing the TV 4K, with Apple Music, and by Apple Airplay in general.
It is interesting that at this point in time, Spotify has Apple thoroughly beaten on the UI side: You choose you Spotify endpoint .. boom your smart devices become the Remote. Try finding the Airplay button, when you are using Apple Music, it is somewhere but not an intuitive fashion ...

Peace.

 

[Sal1950]

Gee, thanks for informing me, I guess I know nothing.

No problem, glad to be of service, any thing you need!

 

[consciousspace]

This is a good starting point:

Thread 'Room Measurement Tutorial for Dummies Part 1' https://audiosciencereview.com/foru...om-measurement-tutorial-for-dummies-part-1.4/

Part 2:
Thread 'Room Measurement Tutorial for Dummies Part 2' https://audiosciencereview.com/foru...om-measurement-tutorial-for-dummies-part-2.5/

Thank you for this, I will start with this