How to elevate a floor standing speaker for higher tweeter axis while keeping it pretty?

[anphex]

Lately I am a happy owner of a pair of KEF Reference 3 Meta.
They replace my Nubert NuVero 170, which had a higher tweeter axis.

It's not that I absolutely need a high tweeter axis again, but the axis of the KEF Ref. 3 Meta is really pretty low on about 90cm even with spikes. I'd love to have them at least at the center of my tv (110cm) or half room height (125cm).

So I need a kind of socket with at least 20cm height.

What I considered so far:
- Raw block of wood/timber: Pretty affordable, would do its job, looks kind of okay and could be further colored by oil/wood stain.
- Dedicated floorstanding speaker raiser: can't be found anywhere, you mostly find the regular bookshelf speaker stands
- Granite block: Expensive, hard to find in higher-than-normal-plate-heights, and if you find it, difficult shipping

So my favourite so far is a block of wood with the same wooden texture and color.

What do you think? Can you think of different options?

 

[digitalfrost]

Given that these are 205 x 462 mm at the base, it'll probably be hard to find something that just fits.

Since you are in germany: https://www.liedtke-metalldesign.eu/

These guys will surely make any custom design that you need, but it will be expensive

 

[anphex]

Given that these are 205 x 462 mm at the base, it'll probably be hard to find something that just fits.

Since you are in germany: https://www.liedtke-metalldesign.eu/

These guys will surely make any custom design that you need, but it will be expensive

Thank you! It wouldn't need to fit 100 %, it could be very well a little larger than the base.

Then again a custom made base for elevation that maybe even fits spikes itself would be nice. I am gonna make an enquiry there. Considering the custom made elevations would be sold somewhere down the line (if at all) with the speakers, a price of about 500 € per base pair would be feasible.

 

[Paffi]

I would take something based on stone material. several stacked "gehwegplatten" for cheap (could be painted) or something serious from the local "steinmetz". Nice polished granit or something. Could then even have some screwholes at the bottom for optional rolls. I think only hard material like stone makes sense, otherwise the spikething is pointless.

 

[AlmaAtaKZ]

• DIY block of cement
• stack of cut plywood, MDF or any other sheet material glued together and finished to your liking
• a resin cast artistically filled with an endless choice of options (e.g. vinyl records, old cassette tapes, CDs ...)
• untreated railway sleepers cuts
• a few cork yoga blocks glued together
• any structure that can also work as a 2x2 or 3x3 wine rack

 

[SteveC]

Not sure how top heavy they are, but you could try just leaning them back. Put a spike or a door jam or whatever under the front. At the very least it might tell you if getting the tweeters higher would make a lot of difference.

 

[anphex]

I would take something based on stone material. several stacked "gehwegplatten" for cheap (could be painted) or something serious from the local "steinmetz". Nice polished granit or something. Could then even have some screwholes at the bottom for optional rolls. I think only hard material like stone makes sense, otherwise the spikething is pointless.

They need to be smooth to not damage the floor or anything, that's why "soft" wood or smooth granite/marble are the only options that come to mind.

• DIY block of cement
• stack of cut plywood, MDF or any other sheet material glued together and finished to your liking
• a resin cast artistically filled with an endless choice of options (e.g. vinyl records, old cassette tapes, CDs ...)
• untreated railway sleepers cuts
• a few cork yoga blocks glued together
• any structure that can also work as a 2x2 or 3x3 wine rack

- Cement, really?
- Layered MDF is something I can get behind. This gave me the idea to inquire at my local woodworker and show them the KEF wooden finish and maybe he can reproduce a fitting base?!
- This also is an insanely cool option, nice idea!
- So, wood in another form?
- Cork bloks - I'd be scared of them crumbling over the time due to the weight. The KEF are about 55Kg
- Wine rack utility - pretty but risky considering potential lack of stability

Not sure how top heavy they are, but you could try just leaning them back. Put a spike or a door jam or whatever under the front. At the very least it might tell you if getting the tweeters higher would make a lot of difference.

This is a stellar idea. I geniouly didn't think of this. The KEF have adjustable spikes, although I am not sure if they are meant to be not-be-tightened. But are you sure it's a valid simulation? The radiation cone would just fire upwards, right?


And thank you all for your inputs!

 

[SteveC]

They need to be smooth to not damage the floor or anything, that's why "soft" wood or smooth granite/marble are the only options that come to mind.



- Cement, really?
- Layered MDF is something I can get behind. This gave me the idea to inquire at my local woodworker and show them the KEF wooden finish and maybe he can reproduce a fitting base?!
- This also is an insanely cool option, nice idea!
- So, wood in another form?
- Cork bloks - I'd be scared of them crumbling over the time due to the weight. The KEF are about 55Kg
- Wine rack utility - pretty but risky considering potential lack of stability



This is a stellar idea. I geniouly didn't think of this. The KEF have adjustable spikes, although I am not sure if they are meant to be not-be-tightened. But are you sure it's a valid simulation? The radiation cone would just fire upwards, right?


And thank you all for your inputs!

Tilt back will affect both the image height and dispersion. I think what you're trying to achieve is an image that sounds like it it "level' with the middle of the picture on your TV. I think tilting them back will give you an idea of how much difference getting them higher will make in this alignment. If it doesn't make a difference in the height of the image then raising them higher might not make a big difference either. In any case it's an easy experiment to try. Just try to have someone on hand to make sure you don't accidently tip the speakers off of the stands. As they say in Ghostbusters, that "would be bad".

 

[CPTX]

My first thought is a large cube end table.
Not sure what your price range is.
These are also a relatively easy DIY

 

[CPTX]

^^^^^These are available from multiple brands and in multiple sizes and finishes.

If you like the look of stone, but want a soft material (like wood)......Just prime with a gray primer, then spray on the Stone Rustoleum, and then finish with several coats of clear.

 

[DonH56]

I used concrete (cement) pavers from a hardware warehouse wrapped in black felt from a hobby store (or Amazon, I forget). You can get felt in many colors to suit your décor. I used a full wrap to protect floor and speaker whilst hiding the bricks.

 

[kemmler3D]

I'm just going to be "that guy" -

At 20cm high you can 3D print such a stand in 1 or 2 parts per side for about $20-40 in materials, fill it with concrete, plaster, or sand, and paint it however you like.

It would be pretty easy to design them with a place for the spikes, for the exact footprint of the speaker, or however you want.

Of course as you are in Germany and I'm in California I can't reasonably offer to take this one on, but there should be local 3D printing services who could do the print for you, the design is maybe another question.

 

[CPTX]

Oh, I see you just need to raise them ten inches
I’d buy some tile of your preference, cut it to cover concrete blocks, and then adhere it to the blocks…..could just use cut to shape untreated railroad ties and cover them with the tile of your liking.

 

[Mnyb]

Acoustically this should not be necessary with the kefs ? How close to ear hight are they when you’re sitting down ?

Changing the hight from the floor may have some other consequences for the sound.

But by all means try then you know .

 

[audiofooled]

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[Blumlein 88]

How about synthetic granite in Corian. Check with a local cabinet maker who does countertops. Often in the size you want they will have left over pieces. Might have to stack a couple or four depending, but they can be glued together so they don't move. I would suggest if you stack them, maybe one fits the base, the next layer a little larger and then a little larger.

Also don't discount the spray on Rustoleum granite on MDF (or other material). I've done that for shelving and TT bases. Might practice spraying it on a few scrap pieces, but done well they'll look like granite unless one does a really close inspection or give them a knuckle rap.

 

[anphex]

Thank you everyone, many great suggestions in there. I thought about it for a while.

@Mnyb The tweeter axis of the KEF Reference 3 Meta is currently a litle below ear level when sitting upright. But since no one ever sits upright on the couch and you mostly become a knot of human limbs slouching on the couch the ears are below tweeter axis, I rather consider this the real "listening axis" . Additionally there is lots of stuff in between this path. A table, thick couch, wide open wall gap for the right speaker, left speaker has acoustic panels on the wall right next to it...

So I have very little early reflections and I guess I ... want to have those? And my plan is getting those more (or more evenly) by raising the speaker to room height middle.

Compared to my Nubert 170 where all this room damping made sense due to the extremely wide almost 90° horizontal dispersion, maybe the KEFs dispersion is just too controlled and actually needs less damping? Could that be it and I am on the wrong path here with the speaker elevation?

I can't try this tilting experiment only when my KEFs get back who are currently under warranty repair, for 5 weeks now .

What do you guys think? My plan with this new thought would be:
1. Try tilting the KEF first with the spike height adjustment
2. Try removing some acoustic panels and open the think window curtains.
3. If the above don't realy work, try to use a makeshift elevation for first acoustic assement.

One fact is clear: wide horizontal dispersion really makes a speaker sound far more natural and comfortable. Maybe it's a bad description but when I used to KEF first I always felt as if sounds and especially voices were "teleported" to my ears, kind of resembling headphones. I wasn't sure if I liked this. I also read some reviewers stating that KEFs need far less room damping compared to regular speakers and Dappolitos.

 

[CPTX]

I always start with the easiest, lowest cost, completely reversible without any remnants of a trial options first.
In this case that would be minor tilting first.

 

[OldHvyMec]

CPTX hit the nail on the head. Tip them back and when it's right make permeant shims/wedges.

Get rid of the spikes too. I thought everyone stopped coupling speakers. I did in the 90s, never looked back.

Try decoupling the FRONT only with two in the front, and none in the back. Works perfect on my RM30s
and I'm not listening at knee level for the sweet spot. I also turned the tweeter 90 degrees too, It's a vertical
ribbon that is turned horizontal and they use a vertical wave guides. They have LPads to boot. LA Rake, ay? LOL

It works perfect for 21.00 usd. They are on Amazon. From 21-27.00 4 in the box.

 

[audiofooled]

Thank you everyone, many great suggestions in there. I thought about it for a while.

@Mnyb The tweeter axis of the KEF Reference 3 Meta is currently a litle below ear level when sitting upright. But since no one ever sits upright on the couch and you mostly become a knot of human limbs slouching on the couch the ears are below tweeter axis, I rather consider this the real "listening axis" . Additionally there is lots of stuff in between this path. A table, thick couch, wide open wall gap for the right speaker, left speaker has acoustic panels on the wall right next to it...

So I have very little early reflections and I guess I ... want to have those? And my plan is getting those more (or more evenly) by raising the speaker to room height middle.

Compared to my Nubert 170 where all this room damping made sense due to the extremely wide almost 90° horizontal dispersion, maybe the KEFs dispersion is just too controlled and actually needs less damping? Could that be it and I am on the wrong path here with the speaker elevation?

I can't try this tilting experiment only when my KEFs get back who are currently under warranty repair, for 5 weeks now .

What do you guys think? My plan with this new thought would be:
1. Try tilting the KEF first with the spike height adjustment
2. Try removing some acoustic panels and open the think window curtains.
3. If the above don't realy work, try to use a makeshift elevation for first acoustic assement.

One fact is clear: wide horizontal dispersion really makes a speaker sound far more natural and comfortable. Maybe it's a bad description but when I used to KEF first I always felt as if sounds and especially voices were "teleported" to my ears, kind of resembling headphones. I wasn't sure if I liked this. I also read some reviewers stating that KEFs need far less room damping compared to regular speakers and Dappolitos.

I'm only speculating here, but what you may hear is that, with controlled directivity you get different direct/reverberant sound ratio, also less spectral variance in the early reflections, just spectral tilt (so effectively you need less acoustic treatment on the sidewalls). Your new speakers are also controlled in the vertical plane so floor and ceiling bounce would need less treatment also. Psychoacoustic effect would be that you get more direct sound so perceived distance is closer than the loudspeakers are.

Yet, narrow dispersion would give you more spectral tilt if you are listening off axis, be it in the horizontal or vertical plane. I would go with cheapest options and just get rid of excess treatment, also tilt the speakers to be on the tweeter axis. But this may not sound the same as lifting the speakers because of the time alignment of the drivers on a tilted baffle. So trying a cheap but safe solution to determine by how much to actually lift them may be a reasonable option.

What you may also try is play with how far apart you space the speakers, distance to the front wall and toe in or perhaps toe out until the sound is to your liking. But, when you're done experimenting what you may find out is that you want to stay on axis both horizontally and vertically with these speakers and get used to the sound which should be objectively neutral, based on measurements.