How much SPL do I need, how loud are bars and parties

[kflw935641]

Hey,

I have seen the usual lists like https://www.hearingconservation.org/assets/Decibel.pdf about how loud various sounds are.

But I'm having a hard time to understand how loud music would be with those numbers. What I'd really love to see is a table showing the SPL levels for music (especially electronic dance music, with a lot of power going into the bass).

A table that maps various different scenarios like

- Quiet music
- SPL of music while being easily able to talk to other people
- Music in a non-crowded living room that requires you to raise your voice a bit
- Music in crowded bars in which you'll have to raise your voice
- Electronic music with bass that you can feel in your body
- The usual Techno club that would already require earplugs for protection

to dB with mean and standard deviation would be really cool I think.

Ultimately, I want to put these numbers into one of the many calculators (https://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html and https://geoffthegreygeek.com/calculator-amp-speaker-spl/) to figure a sane amplifier wattage for house-parties and jam sessions out.

Though it probably also heavily depends on how deep the sub goes. So maybe it wouldn't really be comparable to what I would consider for home usage.

Any Idea? I don't have an SPL meter so I can't make those measurements myself by collecting data over time when going out.

Thanks a lot!

 

[anotherhobby]

Just buy a UMIK-1. It's only $79 and REW is free and there are dozens of write ups on how to use it. Once you can measure SPL and hear it at the same time, it becomes much easier to reason about. IMHO it is the single most important device to getting high quality audio, and it has uses far beyond just measuring SPL. It is an ABSOLUTE BARGAIN at it's price.

 

[Grotti]

Just buy a UMIK-1. It's only $79 and REW is free and there are dozens of write ups on how to use it. Once you can measure SPL and hear it at the same time, it becomes much easier to reason about. IMHO it is the single most important device to getting high quality audio, and it has uses far beyond just measuring SPL. It is an ABSOLUTE BARGAIN at it's price.

I agree but to get absolute SPL you have to calibrate REW first: otherwise SPL is only relative. Since a good SPL meter (recommended!) is quite expensive you should try to rent one for a day....

 

[abdo123]

I agree but to get absolute SPL you have to calibrate REW first: otherwise SPL is only relative. Since a good SPL meter (recommended!) is quite expensive you should try to rent one for a day....

No you dont. The sensitivity data of the UMIK 1 calibration file should ‘calibrate’ REW.

 

[abdo123]

Quiet music : 0dBFS = 65 dB
Easily talk to other people 75 dB.
And then you keep adding 7.5 to 10 dB for each one of your levels.

 

[f1shb0n3]

I don't have an SPL meter so I can't make those measurements myself by collecting data over time when going out.

You might have one in your pocket already - if you have iPhone, get this CDC recommended app:

Sound Level Meter App | NIOSH | CDC

The NIOSH Sound Level Meter app combines the best features of professional sound levels meters and noise dosimeters into a simple, easy-to-use package

www.cdc.gov

When listening to loud music I always have it running for reference. Check out what I measured at Soulfly’s concert in Seattle last week:

 

[steve59]

Install a db meter on your smartphone and read what ambient levels are at different times and add spice accordingly

 

[DVDdoug]

I have seen the usual lists like https://www.hearingconservation.org/assets/Decibel.pdf about how loud various sounds are.

I think the problem is, music volume varies a LOT.

to dB with mean and standard deviation would be really cool I think.

That's tricky too because musical dynamics very so much. I think a symphony can reach 110 or 120 dB on the peaks. They are heard as "loud" but since those peaks are very temporary it doesn't seem overly-loud like a 120dB rock band. I think the standard A-weighting includes some short-term averaging. When trying to estimate amplifier power. clipping is related to the actual peaks (no averaging).

Though it probably also heavily depends on how deep the sub goes. So maybe it wouldn't really be comparable to what I would consider for home usage.

Since our ears are less-sensitive to bass, deep-pass adds more to the "feeling" of loudness than the actual A-weighted loudness. Pro woofers/subwoofers used for live performance and in clubs are usually tuned/optimized down to about 40Hz. That's low enough to get bass you can feel in your body and the lowest note on a standard bass guitar is about 40Hz. To go lower (with enough power for a large venue) starts requiring a LOT more power and more & bigger woofers. And if you tune the woofer so it goes down to 20Hz, it's usually weaker at 40Hz (than it would be if it were optimized for 40Hz).

You can get an SPL meter for less than $100 USD. Or, there are SPL meter phone apps but different phones have different microphone-sensitivity so I don't know how good they are. Maybe if you have a certain iPhone model the sensitivity is fairly constant but I don't know...

Of course the other issue with an SPL meter is it tells you how loud you are now but you still have to guess/estimate how much louder you want to go.

 

[Kvalsvoll]

Hey,

I have seen the usual lists like https://www.hearingconservation.org/assets/Decibel.pdf about how loud various sounds are.

But I'm having a hard time to understand how loud music would be with those numbers. What I'd really love to see is a table showing the SPL levels for music (especially electronic dance music, with a lot of power going into the bass).

A table that maps various different scenarios like

- Quiet music
- SPL of music while being easily able to talk to other people
- Music in a non-crowded living room that requires you to raise your voice a bit
- Music in crowded bars in which you'll have to raise your voice
- Electronic music with bass that you can feel in your body
- The usual Techno club that would already require earplugs for protection

to dB with mean and standard deviation would be really cool I think.

Ultimately, I want to put these numbers into one of the many calculators (https://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html and https://geoffthegreygeek.com/calculator-amp-speaker-spl/) to figure a sane amplifier wattage for house-parties and jam sessions out.

Though it probably also heavily depends on how deep the sub goes. So maybe it wouldn't really be comparable to what I would consider for home usage.

Any Idea? I don't have an SPL meter so I can't make those measurements myself by collecting data over time when going out.

Thanks a lot!

Like this:

This table represents rough estimates for SPL and listening volume:

Loudness	Master volume	SPL	SPL peak
Full volume	0dB	90dB	110dB
Normal “hifi”-loud	-10dB	80dB	100dB
Low volume – still hear everything well	-30dB	60dB	80dB
Very low volume – for late night relaxed listening	-40dB	50dB	70dB

This is taken form the last article I wrote on the subject. This is something I have studied, I have done measurements, I have done observations on listeners. The article has information about what loudness is, shat it means for our perception, and measurements of loudness from several music examples.

This is how it is. That does not mean you need to play at 110dB peak level to enjoy music. Your living room is not a noisy bar, you will still be able to hear everything at low volume, and it is relaxing to enjoy music for hours at comfortable, low volume.

 

[abdo123]

Like this:

This table represents rough estimates for SPL and listening volume:

Loudness	Master volume	SPL	SPL peak
Full volume	0dB	90dB	110dB
Normal “hifi”-loud	-10dB	80dB	100dB
Low volume – still hear everything well	-30dB	60dB	80dB
Very low volume – for late night relaxed listening	-40dB	50dB	70dB

This is taken form the last article I wrote on the subject. This is something I have studied, I have done measurements, I have done observations on listeners. The article has information about what loudness is, shat it means for our perception, and measurements of loudness from several music examples.

This is how it is. That does not mean you need to play at 110dB peak level to enjoy music. Your living room is not a noisy bar, you will still be able to hear everything at low volume, and it is relaxing to enjoy music for hours at comfortable, low volume.

80 dB Peak SPL for ‘low volume’ is quite the stretch honestly. Even for pop music with a decent crest factor.

 

[Kvalsvoll]

80 dB Peak SPL for ‘low volume’ is quite the stretch honestly. Even for pop music with a decent crest factor.

20dB difference between peak and rms-mean is representative for a lot of content, as a very rough estimate. Slightly too much for typical pop music, but even a production measuring 10dB crest will usually measure much higher crest when played back in a room, due to phase shift. When you rotate phase on a peak limited signal, the peak level goes up.

 

[FrantzM]

Hi

I am in flight. I chose the TCZ IEM over the Sony WMX1000 ANC headphones. Lesson learned. The TCZ or perhaps any other IEM are no substitute for any serious NC headphones such as the Sony ,, Bose et al.
This is the noise level in the cabin while I type this. It was well over 107 db at take off.

The Sony ANC had made me forgot how loud airplanes are. Inside and out.


Peace.

 

[AnalogSteph]

What kind of plane? Their sound levels do vary. An A350 or A220 should be substantially quieter than a rickety old 737 or - heaven forbid - just about any turboprop. (Even if a Q-series Dash 8 is pretty cool in that it basically uses ANC.)

As a aside, that spectrum looks like there would be substantial differences between different weightings (Z, A, C).