High quality DAC (Topping D90SE): Pre-amp neccessary and what about USB or TOSlink cable length

[rubin]

High ASR,

I'm new to this forum. Am setting up this new audio system:

Topping D90SE
Benchmark AHB2
Revel F226BE

I have two questions:

1. I read that the Topping D90SE has a pre-amp; is that sufficient to drive the Benchmark AHB2?
2. I've read an article here (https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...s/do-usb-audio-cables-make-a-difference.1887/) that explains that with a ****** DAC, yes, length makes a difference, but which (for all intents and purposes) disappears with a better DAC. I therefore presume it doesn't matter too much with the Topping D90SE, but to what length can I go? Is 15 meters (~50 feet) very long? What physics am I fighting in such a case?

Much kind regards!

 

[abdo123]

15 meter is insanely long for a USB cable. In such situation i would recommend buying a Pre-amp and have that 15 meters be an XLR cable instead.

the Topping Pre-90 should be great! And it can offer 10 volts of output so it would drive the ABH2 at its lowest gain levels.

If you’re opposed to the idea of a pre-amp then buy an optical usb cable that is not effected by length.

 

[antcollinet]

I have my dac on the end of 13 ft of usb and it works fine. Length is not an issue for audio quality (with a good dac) until digital signal distortion stops it working altogether.

I doubt 15m is viable, though you can get active / boosting / repeater cables. It might be worth trying one of those, if you don't want to go down the analogue XLR approach suggested above.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Officially USB is good to 5 meters or 16.5 feet. It may work a bit longer, but for 15 meters you'll need an active USB extender cable.

 

[rubin]

Alright, thanks for the pointers all, I suppose I could also put the Topping close to the computer upstairs (say 1m USB) and then do 2x 15m XLR to the Benchmark downstairs, or I could add some small device that acts as a bridge (something like Roon Nucleus or a Raspberry Pi or something) and play audio from there.

Another thing I'm willing to try out: A while ago I bought these Digi AnywhereUSB / Ethernet bridge devices (https://www.digi.com/products/netwo...ment/usb-connectivity/usb-over-ip/anywhereusb), they're pretty cool. Essentially, they provide a device on the Ethernet network and you install a special driver in Windows which sets that up as a local USB hub device. It would be interesting to measure performance using that (So the Anywhere USB would be 1.5ft USB cable to the Topping, Anywhere USB connects to ethernet, Computer upstairs thinks the Topping is attached "directly").

What kind of device could I use to measure performance of cables?

 

[abdo123]

Just keep in mind that the ABH2 has no volume control.

 

[Willem]

Alternatively, use a Chromecast Audio as a source.

 

[Count Arthur]

Could you not get a second computer for music?

It need not be anything particularly powerful or expensive, you could get a used business type PC for not much: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/27391315...cvjIuvsBoOLCLlfqaqqM|ampid:PL_CLK|clp:2047675 and use it with something like JRiver: https://www.jriver.com/

Alternatively, you could use a Raspberry Pi together with a USB hard drive or SSD and Volumio, which would allow you to operate it from a phone or tablet:

https://thepihut.com/
https://volumio.org/

 

[DHT 845]

Best (for unrivalled sound quality) is no USB cable at all (!), just $35 uptone adapter, At the rear of the DAC just add pure Raspberry Pi 4B board
USPCB A>B Adapter – UpTone Audio
Do USB Audio Cables Make A Difference? | Audio Science Review (ASR) Forum

 

[antcollinet]

That Uptone adapter is $35 of snake oil, as indicated in the article you link. Any $2 usb cable you already have will work just as well.

 

[DHT 845]

That Uptone adapter is $35 of snake oil, as indicated in the article you link. Any $2 usb cable you already have will work just as well.

"The Uptone stub does even better, producing the cleanest output I have seen from Schiit Modi 2".

 

[Blumlein 88]

https://www.amazon.com/Alxum-Extens...ension+cord&qid=1630844643&sr=8-11&th=1&psc=1

These work because they have active buffers. Good to even 50 ft in this case.

 

[antcollinet]

"The Uptone stub does even better, producing the cleanest output I have seen from Schiit Modi 2".

Right - but as is pointed out -
1 - Even then any benefit is lost in the noise floor - inaudible.
2 - The modi 2 is a bad dac, chosen deliberately because it is able to exaggerate any differences - and as such is suseptible to noise - any decent dac doesn't show any benefit - see the section "Graphs Lie" where (with pretty much any other DAC) the graph shows the stub (yellow) to be actually worse then the long cable (red) but in any case neither result anywhere near audible.


"As we see, there is no difference between the worst performing USB cable (long and generic) and the shortest one (USB stub)."

 

[Harmonie]

High ASR,

I'm new to this forum. Am setting up this new audio system:

Topping D90SE
Benchmark AHB2
Revel F226BE

I have two questions:

1. I read that the Topping D90SE has a pre-amp; is that sufficient to drive the Benchmark AHB2?
2. I've read an article here (https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...s/do-usb-audio-cables-make-a-difference.1887/) that explains that with a ****** DAC, yes, length makes a difference, but which (for all intents and purposes) disappears with a better DAC. I therefore presume it doesn't matter too much with the Topping D90SE, but to what length can I go? Is 15 meters (~50 feet) very long? What physics am I fighting in such a case?

Much kind regards!

@abdo123 also informed me in some past this:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...d90-balanced-usb-dac-review.10519/post-749877

 

[MCH]

+1 raspberry pi (the zero w costs 11 euros and i think it is everything you need. + you can add dsp with moode for free)

 

[sq225917]

Matey locally to me has smsl400 into topping pre90 into benchmark. Its sublimely good, run it with long xlr cables, no issue.