High-end electronics vs high-end audio

[JoachimStrobel]

No sure about all this.
A high end TV with 10 bit comes no way near the real live contrast of at least 16 bit that every body can experience an sunset (and most have a low cost 6bit Panel). The TVs color space and handling is no way close to real live. Almost every stores displays them in a special „Sales” mode with the color temperature set to 10k as it looks so sharp. Sure, go ahead and get a calibrated screen to adjust your photos in LR or PS to be perfect - only that 99% of all viewers will have 8000Kelvin screen with blown out colors. This is like audio engineers would create recordings for an audience consisting 99% of Bluetooth boom boxes.
The Photo world is full of forums where people collaborate on differences between 5 to 10k$ lenses by sending Jpegs in screen resolution around. This is like audio engineers sending recording examples around to be judged via the IPhone’s build in speaker.
Audio captures 95% and reproduces 90% of it. It does not build a soundstage, but then 3D video has just died as people believe that crisper images are closer to the truth. And multichannel audio might not be dead after all...

 

[Xulonn]

But buying an expensive car, by example, doesn't automatically becomes you a "competitive driver".

Indeed!

LINK

"This 2003 Ferrari Enzo crashed during a charity racing event in Utah"

 

[mansr]

Indeed!

LINK

"This 2003 Ferrari Enzo crashed during a charity racing event in Utah"

View attachment 42560

It's just a flesh wound.

 

[NTomokawa]

It's just a flesh wound.

Yeah, that'll buff out!

 

[watchnerd]

It was said that the existence of these items shouldn't annoy me. Luxury items exist in other markets such as watches and cars, so why not audio?.

Well, I respond, why audio and why are they so common? And it does at least irritate me that we've reached the point where consumer audio products priced in the tens and hundreds of thousands are not that unusual, yet often offer nothing more where it really matters.

I'm not clear why it annoys you.

Do luxury watches (which are worse at telling time than your cell phone) and expensive handbags (which often hold less than a plastic shopping bag) annoy you, too?

Neither of these are sales driven by functionality, just like high end audio.

They're all Veblen goods.

 

[restorer-john]

I don't know much about video testing.

How inaccurate can the screen be and still be considered accurate?

Can one accurate screen be more accurate than another accurate screen?

Well with audio it's all about "transparency" isn't it? When I can use my TV as a window, like Arnie did in Total Recall, I'll happy.

 

[RayDunzl]

When I can use my TV as a window, like Arnie did in Total Recall, I'll happy.

I want a holodeck.

 

[restorer-john]

I want a holodeck.

Does the girl come with it?

 

[NTomokawa]

Does the girl come with it?

She certainly could, at a price.

 

[JustPoo]

I'm not even a car guy and that hurts to see!. I don't care how realistic AV gets, if it involves Riker and a trombone I'm out!.

Wealth and more conventional ideas of status are still a factor - every time I see someone gratuitously list their expensive gear, even to the point they stick it in their signature, I wonder how it makes them feel. They don't list anything that's affordable, it's not there so someone else can say "hey, I've been considering that, what's the verdict?". Yes, they're using it as their CV, they're establishing their audiophile chops, but they're also just showing off.

Gedeon expounded upon (but more succinctly, that's scattergun rants for you) what I touched on in my first post. High-end audio doesn't just reflect wealth and status, it suggests its fans and owners are endowed with something the rest of us aren't. If you don't hear or doubt the difference between a £200 DAC and a £20k DAC you're not sophisticated/trained/gifted/superhuman and you're hiding behind "numbers" to excuse your lack of refinement. The superiority of these products is shouted loud and proud, so it follows that if you can't hear it your hearing is faulty. Never that the products aren't actually superior at all. God forbid.

If high-end audio sales aren't driven by claims of increased functionality and performance, then somebody should convince the manufacturers, reviewers and purchasers of that. Perhaps the whole industry would collapse. If somebody wants a bedazzled phone or amplifier then good luck to them. Just don't piss in my ear and tell me it's liquid sparkly highs. And see a doctor, it shouldn't be carbonated.

Yes they're also status symbols in the conventional sense too, but let's not pretend there's not huge amounts of industry strength bullshit about their performance. They're justified and marketed first and foremost as the best of the best in audio, not jewellery.

 

[Dimitri]

If you don't hear or doubt the difference between a £200 DAC and a £20k DAC you're not sophisticated/trained/gifted/superhuman and you're hiding behind "numbers" to excuse your lack of refinement.

Easiest way to improve sound is to take a price tag displaying $19,599 and place it near the Volume control !
Also, if you actually paid a lot and it sounds crappy, put $49.95 or a hand written "Free" sign on it.

 

[mansr]

Easiest way to improve sound is to take a price tag displaying $19,599 and place it near the Volume control

That only works if the knob is made of wood.

 

[Dimitri]

That only works if the knob is made of wood.

You must not have wood grain duck tape in your neighborhood

 

[Xulonn]

duck tape

Little known factoid:

A common mispronunciation of duct tape is "duck" tape, but it may not be much of a mistake at all.

Key Facts

• Duct tape was originally called "duck" tape.
• Initially, duct tape only came in army green.
• Ironically, researchers at the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory, Environmental Energy Division concluded that you should never use duct tape to seal ducts.

The tape was invented during World War II because the soldiers needed a waterproof tape that would keep moisture out of ammunition cases. The soldiers later used it for repair purposes, after seeing how well it holds up. Because it was developed for the military, the tape was initially army green before it became available in the metallic silver that's common today. Later, it began being used to seal ducts, which is how it became known as "duct" tape. The color was changed to silver to match the ducts. Ironically, research discourages its use on ducts, as the tape becomes brittle under typical duct conditions.

 

[JustPoo]

Today I Found Out? I must admit part of the reason I watch is to see how many words he mangles. You could have a pretty good drinking game on your hands if it includes non-English words too

 

[scott wurcer]

Little known factoid:


View attachment 42565

The ASTM and UL have specifications for duct sealing tape, the spec numbers are often printed on the tape. There actually is a Duck brand of duct sealing tape. Funny thing is when someone open an expensive "mod" offered for DAC's, etc. there was off the shelf Home Depot duct tape pasted over everything.

 

[Wombat]

I'm not even a car guy and that hurts to see!. I don't care how realistic AV gets, if it involves Riker and a trombone I'm out!.

Wealth and more conventional ideas of status are still a factor - every time I see someone gratuitously list their expensive gear, even to the point they stick it in their signature, I wonder how it makes them feel. They don't list anything that's affordable, it's not there so someone else can say "hey, I've been considering that, what's the verdict?". Yes, they're using it as their CV, they're establishing their audiophile chops, but they're also just showing off.

Gedeon expounded upon (but more succinctly, that's scattergun rants for you) what I touched on in my first post. High-end audio doesn't just reflect wealth and status, it suggests its fans and owners are endowed with something the rest of us aren't. If you don't hear or doubt the difference between a £200 DAC and a £20k DAC you're not sophisticated/trained/gifted/superhuman and you're hiding behind "numbers" to excuse your lack of refinement. The superiority of these products is shouted loud and proud, so it follows that if you can't hear it your hearing is faulty. Never that the products aren't actually superior at all. God forbid.

If high-end audio sales aren't driven by claims of increased functionality and performance, then somebody should convince the manufacturers, reviewers and purchasers of that. Perhaps the whole industry would collapse. If somebody wants a bedazzled phone or amplifier then good luck to them. Just don't piss in my ear and tell me it's liquid sparkly highs. And see a doctor, it shouldn't be carbonated.

Yes they're also status symbols in the conventional sense too, but let's not pretend there's not huge amounts of industry strength bullshit about their performance. They're justified and marketed first and foremost as the best of the best in audio, not jewellery.

I have always associated possessions listed in a forum signature with:

Or the abbreviated form:

 

[Blumlein 88]

You guys are mangling the words. It's 200 mph tape.

Another little factoid: duct tape is called gaffers tape in the UK. Gaffer's tape in the USA is the kind used in video and audio studios which doesn't stick permanently or leave a residue when removed. Bad mistake to mix those things up.

 

[Wombat]

In Oz, duct tape is a satin-silver coloured super grippy smooth vinyl substrate tape that sticks like shit. It is used for joining aluminium concertinaed ducting.
Gaffer tape has threads in the vinyl backing for strength and although it sticks tenaciously can be readily 'undone'. Mostly used by Gaffers and Roadies for temporary dismantlable stage accessory fastening.

 

[digicidal]

You guys are mangling the words. It's 200 mph tape.

Another little factoid: duct tape is called gaffers tape in the UK. Gaffer's tape in the USA is the kind used in video and audio studios which doesn't stick permanently or leave a residue when removed. Bad mistake to mix those things up.

That makes sense considering a gaffer in the UK is usually referring to an old man or a job foreman. Makes you wonder what they call gaffers at the BBC... "lighting tech" or something I'd guess.

To the OP... I wonder just how prevalent the high-end audio world would be today if it weren't for social media and the Internet? Sure there were and will always be millionaires who love spending money in ways that show... but now you've got so many other avenues - multiple trade shows, "influencers", etc. who have (inadvertently in some cases I imagine - deliberately in others) breathed new life into such luxury goods.

It made little sense ever IMO - but it made far more sense in the days when you couldn't achieve the same level of transparency available today for a few hundred dollars.