Hifiman Sundara Review (headphone)

[Georgeadv]

Is a change of the stock cable worth it in terms of performance?

 

[Somafunk]

s a change of the stock cable worth it in terms of performance?

I bought this cheap but decent cable from Amazon for my Sundara, not for performance gains but for feel as it’s far better in use.

 

[mer]

Hi Guys,

I've just registered here, because i want to ask some questions about my setup.
For sure i'm no audiophile, but i enjoy listening to higher than average audio quality.

Currently i have the Sundara (2020), with Dekoni Hybrid Earpads, running on a Fiio K5 Pro connected with USB to my PC.
On the PC i do equalizing with EqualizerAPO and the EQ Settings from https://github.com/jaakkopasanen/AutoEq
To me it already sounds pretty good. No harsh/fatiguing highs anymore.
Bass is precise and that sounds really good, but sometimes still a bit lacking in power tbh.

Now to the questions.

TBH i cannot hear a difference between FLACs and 320kbit mp3. Therefor i mostly listen to spotify.
I've set my Windows Output to 44.1khz and 16bit. As i have heard, that resampling would introduce Artifacts in Windows 10 and 11.
1. Is that correct?

2. Am i limiting the Sundara with the AMP of the K5 Pro? Especially in the low frequencies? (also i am sometimes using mid and high gain settings)

3. Am i limiting the Sundara with the DAC of the K5 Pro? Is there more detail to be gained with a better DAC? Eventually a warmer DAC may pair better with these neutral sounding Headphones?

Asking because i'm looking at setups like the SMSL SU-9n + SH-9 for ~750€, and asking myself if i would hear a big difference there.
Or if there are cheaper options, available in Europe

 

[antanast]

Quick question. Considering upgrading from the Sundaras to the Ananda Stealth. What are your thoughts on that? Worth the upgrade?

 

[staticV3]

As i have heard, that resampling would introduce Artifacts in Windows 10 and 11.
1. Is that correct?

Yes. Here's a 44.1kHz test signal played natively:

and here it is upsampled to 96kHz by Windows (same DAC):

Source

So it's best to keep Windows at the same sample rate as the content you're listening to.
However, it's a good idea to set bit depth to the highest that your DAC supports. Bit depth conversion is lossless and can sometimes even reduce noise.

 

[antanast]

Hi guys. Thinking of upgrading from the Sundara to the Ananda stealth or the XS. Any thoughts? Worth the upgrade?

 

[Nikolaos]

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Hifiman Sundara planar magnetic open back headphone. It was kindly sent to me by one of their retailers, Apos Audio and costs US $349.

The Sundara looks elegant and no less so than higher up in the line from Hifiman:

View attachment 124233

The cups don't swivel. That, and being new made for slightly uncomfortable feeling around my ears. The weight is inline with other headphones in this class at 390 grams. The cup is round and has inside diameter of 59 mm and depth of 18 mm.

The included cord is short and comes with right angle connector. It has a nice (silicon?) insulator. It did not seem microphonic to me.

Note: The measurements you are about to see are preformed using standardized GRAS 45CA headphone measurement fixture. Headphone measurements require more interpretation than speaker tests and have more of a requirement for subjective testing as a result. In addition, comparison of measurements between different people performing it using different configurations requires fair bit of skill. So don't look for matching results. Focus on high level picture. Listening tests are performed using RME ADI-2 DAC and its headphone output.

Mounting the headphone on the test fixture was super easy requiring no manipulation to get left and right to match at dual frequencies.

Hifiman Sundara Measurements
As usual, we start with our stereo frequency response measurements:
View attachment 124234

I like the near compliance with preference curve form upper bass to lower treble. The former though as you can see, droops as many headphones do. The peaks above 5 kHz also exceed our target which you can better see in a relative graph:

View attachment 124235

There is a bit of shortfall around 2 kHz as well which I tend to like! No, it is not good that way but it means that once I compensate for it, it should open the sound more.

Distortion shows little unexpected other than something going on between 6 and 7 kHz:

View attachment 124236

View attachment 124237

This is much better than Hifiman Ananda:

Group delay shows the typical messiness we see in mid-frequencies which seems to have a role in (good) spatial effects:

View attachment 124238

Impedance is flat at 40 ohm meaning you need current more than voltage to drive the Sundara:
View attachment 124241

Efficiency is slightly below average:

View attachment 124242

Hifiman Sundara Listening Tests
I had been listening to my AKG K371 for a few hours before swapping it with Sundara. The difference was startling in how open and expansive the sound became with Sundara. Alas, I quickly realized there is no sub-bass being produced. And sound signature was a bit bright and over exaggerated at the top. So out came the EQ tool:

View attachment 124244

Oh wow! The transformation was dramatic. Sub-bass came into play like nobody's business. Even at lower volumes I could feel the nice vibrations in my head! The notch filter took care of the highs being exaggerated and a bit harsh. And the fine but broad filter around 2.1 kHz helped the spatial qualities improve even more. Overall tonality now was warm with tons of detail especially in string instruments. Very lovely.

As a verification, I asked my son to come over and without looking at the measurements and EQ, listen to the headphone plain and then with EQ I had built above. After about half hour of listening he said there was no sub-bass and the there was something missing in the sound. With EQ he found the sound to be much improved causing him to say he likes it. So good correlation with my findings.

Conclusions
We have had a checkered history with Hifiman so far with HE-6 performing very well and the Ananda, not so much. It is nice to discover that Sundara, despite its much lower price than either two, brings a competent implementation to the table. Objectively we miss the bass by a mile but otherwise, compliance to our target is very good. Distortion while not best in class, is kept much more under control than Ananda. Likely the smaller driver is able to be much more optimized here.

Without EQ, I would not be a buyer as I love my deep bass response and highs that are a bit more sedated. With EQ, the Sundara transforms beautifully providing excellent spatial effect with respect to instrument and channel separation while providing the deep bass response that I crave.

I am happy to give a strong recommendation to Hifiman Sundara with equalization.

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As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.

Any donations are much appreciated using: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-support-audio-science-review.8150/

Hi, Amirm Marry Christmas, can you please send in the forum the PEQ for RME regarding SUNDARA headphone. Many thanks

 

[Jimbob54]

Hi, Amirm Marry Christmas, can you please send in the forum the PEQ for RME regarding SUNDARA headphone. Many thanks

Which sundara version?

 

[Nikolaos]

Which sundara version?

2020

 

[staticV3]

2020

Here's one made specifically for the RME and Sundara 2020:

Hifiman Sundara (2020 revised earpads) (RME ADI-2).pdf

Shared with Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

 

[_Piotr]

Love the sound after using the eq profile

 

[MrBrainwash]

Love the sound after using the eq profile

Which profile you have in mind - @oratory1990?

 

[_Piotr]

Which profile you have in mind - @oratory1990?

Amirm's profile.

 

[staticV3]

Amirm's profile.

FYI, Amir's EQ presets aren't very good, objectively.
His Sundara preset for example leaves a big hole in the bass around 80-100Hz (the black line):

That'll make bass sound less punchy than it's supposed to.

 

[_Piotr]

FYI, Amir's EQ presets aren't very good, objectively.
His Sundara preset for example leaves a big hole in the bass around 80-100Hz (the black line):
View attachment 260840
That'll make bass sound less punchy than it's supposed to.

I've tried, but I still liked Amir's eq a bit better. I've used the one from github so might have just picked the wrong one.

 

[oratory1990]

I've tried, but I still liked Amir's eq a bit better. I've used the one from github so might have just picked the wrong one.

The recommended EQ setting for the Hifiman Sundara is the following:

The original version (before 2020)
The version with the revised earpads (after 2020)

The settings on GitHub are from AutoEQ, not from me. They just use my measurements as a source.

 

[Somafunk]

The recommended EQ setting for the Hifiman Sundara is the following:

Cheers, I inputted the 7 band eq parameters into roon and now listening through my chord mojo2/poly, it sounds rather better than my hamfisted attempt at eq using the mojo2 4 band eq for my revised pad sundara

 

[Brianc]

The recommended EQ setting for the Hifiman Sundara is the following:

The original version (before 2020)
The version with the revised earpads (after 2020)

The settings on GitHub are from AutoEQ, not from me. They just use my measurements as a source.

How do you determine if a pair is pre 2020? Bought used so not sure.

 

[solderdude]

How do you determine if a pair is pre 2020? Bought used so not sure.

serial number. Just PM hifiman. They replied to me the next day.
Serial numbers are under the pads and on the warranty card.

From Reddit:
End of 2017 - Sundara released at $500
Beginning of 2019 - Sundara dropped to $350
End of 2019 - stealth revision changing the pads and dust filter to increase durability
September 2021 - first reports of the softer 4XX cable, but many people still got them with the old cable even in 2022, not clear if it was regional or maybe based on stock
June 2022 - adjusted process to drop the impedance to 32Ω - nobody measured them yet to confirm any audible changes but Hifiman assures it sounds the same. Looks like everyone is finally getting them with the new cable
July 2022 - new packaging with included table stand
The only confirmed change in the sound happened at the end of 2019 when they changed the pads (or should I say the glue in the pads that slightly changed their shape). Not clear if there are any audible changes since the impedance drop. Probably not.

The differences between 2018 and 2020 Sundara on my FP test fixture:

(Post edited due to an incorrect comparison plot)

 

[staticV3]

The differences between old and 2021 Sundara were not big on my test fixture:

though quite significant on KEMAR:

Much smoother ear gain on the 2020