Hifiman Edition XS

[oleg87]

Hi! Wanted ask some advice on amp/DAC for XS.

Two weeks ago an idea came to me that I should get some proper headphones for enjoying the music. No previous experience with HiFi. Went into local HiFi shop and listened for bunch of phones in 300-500 euro range. Finally tried the XS-s. They seemed so big and ugly that I almost decided not to try them. They were so different from the rest. All the others sounded like headphones. But with XS I had a feeling that there are two living rooms hanging by my ears. I was astonished and after long testing session bought them. Wonderful phones, so happy about them.

I also bought the DAC that I used to test the phones - Zen Dac v2. Now, after reading this thread and bunch of others I'm not sure why the shop sold it to me. My understanding is that this amp/DAC is not suitable for XS at all.

My plan is to get new amp and/or DAC. So many options, so I would like to get some advice. I paid 175 euros for Zen, I hope to sell it at small loss and get something better instead. I'm in Europe and would like buy locally for guarantee - this limits the selection little bit. Right now, I'm looking at Fiio K7, Topping L30 II+E30 II and SMSL C200. There is also Topping DX3 Pro+ that is highly regarded, but apparently it has some issues with low impedance headphones. I also thought about getting just an amp for Zen Dac but decided not to go this route. I don't think that it's something special as DAC, it's design will not match the amp and I will end up paying more. I found a page where it was measured, but I'm unable to assess it's qualities as DAC: https://reference-audio-analyzer.pro/en/report/dac/ifi-zen-dac-v2-single.php#gsc.tab=0

Topping L30 II+E30 II and SMSL C200 are reviewed here and got very high marks. Fiio K7 is new, but I did find a page with it's measurements: https://www.l7audiolab.com/f/fiio-k7/ I just learn reading those graphs and understand what values are good. Fiio K7 seems good, but not excellent to me. Seems to be below the others. It's available locally and I can test it - that's why I'm considering it. Visually I like SMSL C200 most. Built-in power supply is also nice.

So, what is your recommendation to me?

Keep in mind that while two devices may measure differently, for all practical audio-enjoyment purposes it makes no difference whether a distortion product is down -100db or -120db from the signal - you just not going to hear it, so while the Zen Dac's line out is nothing state of the art in measured performance, it's fine. Going purely off measurements (no idea about user experience/features/reliability/etc), the Topping L30 II is the most powerful and performant amp for your Hifimans out of what you listed, but any of them will work OK, really (if my math is right, you need about 300mW into ~16ohms to reach ~115dB SPL, which is a healthy amount of amp headroom for most purposes).

 

[arnea]

Thanks for your thoughts. Since I haven't listened to any other amp/DAC I really don't know how much quality and enjoyment I loose with Zen Dac. Some "airier" songs sound really good, but with rock tracks I have doubts. I think they can sound better.

Reference Audio Analyzer site that I referred does an interesting analysis of the amplifiers based on the quality. For Zen Dac v2 the phone impedance/quality graph is here: https://reference-audio-analyzer.pro/en/report/amp/ifi-zen-dac-v2-balance-hi.php#gsc.tab=0 They use more sensitive phones for modelling, so with XS the situation is even worse. There is long explanation somewhere on the site that explains the reasoning behind those assessments - it sounded logical to me.

And even in this same thread there was a long discussion if Zen Can (not Dac) is good for driving the XS. Can can put out much more power than the Dac and even for Can conclusion seemed to be that it is not a good match for XS.

So, I've really decided to try something that is more suitable for XS by the numbers and see if I can hear the difference.

 

[bodhi]

So, I've really decided to try something that is more suitable for XS by the numbers and see if I can hear the difference.

If you don't do volume matched blind comparison you will absolutely hear a difference. I'm betting two bananas that the new piece of equipment, regardless of what it actually is, will sound better.

 

[growbag]

Hello,

New user here who has been lurking for a long time (and enjoying the forum very much), but just registered to ask a question related to an issue I have with my new hifiman edition xs.

Generally, I think they sound amazing! But when connected to my headphone amp using a 3.5mm to 6.35mm adapter (not just the supplied one - I've tested with another too), I have an issue where if I move the 3.5mm connection, or apply even a little pressure, the sound changes. I don't lose either ear, but it's like I lose the parts unique to each ear, and only get the common, shared sounds. Like mono, with missing elements on either side.

As a test, I've tried plugging the 3.5mm connection into my mini hifi, laptop, and phone (my xDuoo XD05 Plus does not have a 3.5mm connection). It doesn't seem to happen in this case. So seems to only be an issue when connecting with any adapter.

I could return then for a new set. It's a bit of a pain though, so I thought I'd ask if anyone had any suggestions, maybe something I'm missing. I've tried to clean the 3.5mm end carefully, and both adapters, but no change.

Thank you,

g

 

[arrow0309]

Hello,

New user here who has been lurking for a long time (and enjoying the forum very much), but just registered to ask a question related to an issue I have with my new hifiman edition xs.

Generally, I think they sound amazing! But when connected to my headphone amp using a 3.5mm to 6.35mm adapter (not just the supplied one - I've tested with another too), I have an issue where if I move the 3.5mm connection, or apply even a little pressure, the sound changes. I don't lose either ear, but it's like I lose the parts unique to each ear, and only get the common, shared sounds. Like mono, with missing elements on either side.

As a test, I've tried plugging the 3.5mm connection into my mini hifi, laptop, and phone (my xDuoo XD05 Plus does not have a 3.5mm connection). It doesn't seem to happen in this case. So seems to only be an issue when connecting with any adapter.

I could return then for a new set. It's a bit of a pain though, so I thought I'd ask if anyone had any suggestions, maybe something I'm missing. I've tried to clean the 3.5mm end carefully, and both adapters, but no change.

Thank you,

g

Welcome mate, is the adaptor (and the 3.5mm jack) regular or screwable?
Don't mix them.
If screwable try not to fully tighten them.

 

[growbag]

Welcome mate, is the adaptor (and the 3.5mm jack) regular or screwable?
Don't mix them.
If screwable try not to fully tighten them.

Hi Arrow,

No it's not screwable, just regular push in (I had to google this actually - I have never seen/heard of screw connections before).

Thanks for replying,

g

 

[Ken Tajalli]

Generally, I think they sound amazing! But when connected to my headphone amp using a 3.5mm to 6.35mm adapter (not just the supplied one - I've tested with another too), I have an issue where if I move the 3.5mm connection, or apply even a little pressure, the sound changes. I don't lose either ear, but it's like I lose the parts unique to each ear, and only get the common, shared sounds. Like mono, with missing elements on either side.

If you intend on keeping the XS, better invest on a quality cable for it.
The bundled cable with XS sucks! don't take my word for it, just do a search on a few forums and you will see a trend.
They are badly made, they are terminated badly. When I say quality, I don't mean snake-oil cables that were made by virgins under moonlight! stay away from rock bottom £20 cables on Amazon.
I can not recommend a particular brand or type, as I make my own, I am sure you can find recommendations from other users.
It is the cable that's to blame.

 

[arrow0309]

Hi Arrow,

No it's not screwable, just regular push in (I had to google this actually - I have never seen/heard of screw connections before).

Thanks for replying,

g

I just looked and the 3.5mm connector on the XS is not screwable.
Here's an example of a compatible cable with screwable jack to quarter inch:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Replacement-Compatible-Hifiman-connector-Headphones-Black/dp/B097PWMRTC

I do have a similar cable for my Beyers DT 900 Pro X (also working with my AKG 712 Pro) and is sounding just fine.
However I do not vouch for the HiFi tier quality of this or the measurements also the sleeve is a little rigid and sometimes annoying or noisy.

Edit:

Ken Tajalli above better link a higher quality one​

 

[Ken Tajalli]

I just looked and the 3.5mm connector on the XS is not screwable.
Here's an example of a compatible cable with screwable jack to quarter inch:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Replacement-Compatible-Hifiman-connector-Headphones-Black/dp/B097PWMRTC

I do have a similar cable for my Beyers DT 900 Pro X (also working with my AKG 712 Pro) and is sounding just fine.
However I do not vouch for the HiFi tier quality of this or the measurements also the sleeve is a little rigid and sometimes annoying or noisy.

Edit:

Ken Tajalli above better link a higher quality one​

That particular one, I have tested and it is rubbish!
Others that look like this cable, are the same. They are made in bulk by some Company and sold under different brands.

 

[arrow0309]

That particular one, I have tested and it is rubbish!
Others that look like this cable, are the same. They are made in bulk by some Company and sold under different brands.

Yeah it was mainly for showing the screwable jacks.
And I did have a feeling it was crappy (mine, DT 900 Pro X version) so I barely used it a couple of times.
How about this one (I'm using on 4.4mm output with the Sundara):

Balanced 4.4mm Headphone Cable for Hifiman SUNDARA/ANANDA/ARYA/HE1000SE Braided | eBay

This is a high quality hand-made headphone cable for the Hifiman Headphones above. The quality OFC copper wire used (4 lengths per cable) is sheathed in black Paracord 550 and round braided up to the point where it splits to connect to each headphone cup (about 50cm from the headphone...

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[Ken Tajalli]

Yeah it was mainly for showing the screwable jacks.
And I did have a feeling it was crappy (mine, DT 900 Pro X version) so I barely used it a couple of times.
How about this one (I'm using on 4.4mm output with the Sundara):

Balanced 4.4mm Headphone Cable for Hifiman SUNDARA/ANANDA/ARYA/HE1000SE Braided | eBay

This is a high quality hand-made headphone cable for the Hifiman Headphones above. The quality OFC copper wire used (4 lengths per cable) is sheathed in black Paracord 550 and round braided up to the point where it splits to connect to each headphone cup (about 50cm from the headphone...

www.ebay.co.uk

I don't know, looks decent.
Do you have 4.4 balanced output on your amp?
If yes, try it!
you wouldn't need the adaptor no more, and you get more power output.
Only if your amp can power it right.
BTW, there is a lot of rumours out there that EDXS needs 1W or more power. I say no, a decent 0.5W is enough for most people, unless you are into heavy EQ'ing, and therefore need to use heavy preamp cut.
EDXS just needs about 3dB boost at 1800Hz (roughly), it means something like a Mojo or Mojo2 with 0.4W output is just about enough.
More power does not hurt, if it is clean.
the EDXS lets you know, if it isn't.

 

[growbag]

Thanks for the suggestions Arrow and Ken. I'm the original poster who was having the problem with the cable. It's 3.5mm I need rather than 4.4 balanced. Would something like this work?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Youkamoo-Headphone-Replacement-Compatible-Headphones/dp/B0B1TH8QRG/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1SSP3MD9SZE9G&keywords=youkamoo%2Bhifiman&qid=1673277230&sprefix=youkamoo%2Bhifiman%2Caps%2C72&sr=8-1&th=1

 

[solderdude]

It's 3.5mm I need rather than 4.4 balanced. Would something like this work?

Yes

 

[arrow0309]

I don't know, looks decent.
Do you have 4.4 balanced output on your amp?
If yes, try it!
you wouldn't need the adaptor no more, and you get more power output.
Only if your amp can power it right.
BTW, there is a lot of rumours out there that EDXS needs 1W or more power. I say no, a decent 0.5W is enough for most people, unless you are into heavy EQ'ing, and therefore need to use heavy preamp cut.
EDXS just needs about 3dB boost at 1800Hz (roughly), it means something like a Mojo or Mojo2 with 0.4W output is just about enough.
More power does not hurt, if it is clean.
the EDXS lets you know, if it

I have this little flagship boy but already getting replaced by the new ESS one
So no worries



I don't have the EDXS yet, that I need, looking to get them at a decent price

 

[Ken Tajalli]

My modified Edition XS is up for grabs, if anyone is interested.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/14493897...ssg=|tkp:Bk9SR-TNxrXHYQ&LH_ItemCondition=3000

Edit: Sold.

 

[arrow0309]

My modified Edition XS is up for grabs, if anyone is interested.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/14493897...ssg=|tkp:Bk9SR-TNxrXHYQ&LH_ItemCondition=3000

I already bought an open box for £325 about a month ago and also a Geekria hear band.
What's this grill mod about really anyway?

 

[Ken Tajalli]

I already bought an open box for £325 about a month ago and also a Geekria hear band.
What's this grill mod about really anyway?

check the link https://www.head-fi.org/threads/hifiman-edition-xs-launched.960155/page-99#post-16883024

 

[Jyo'za]

Hi all, I bought a pair of B-stock Edition XS' from the $399 sale directly from HIFIMAN. I got a pair dated February of 2022, and it had some vibration issues at low frequencies that are inconsistent. And 2 days after using them, the left side lost some volume and it's about 4-5dB lower than the right at a constant 200Hz, and about 2dB lower at 1000Hz. Pretty sad since they sounded amazing while they were working. Currently looking to get a replacement, but if that doesn't work out I might just refund them. Anyone with any experience working with HIFIMAN on defective models? How was the customer service in your experience?

 

[Ken Tajalli]

Hi all, I bought a pair of B-stock Edition XS' from the $399 sale directly from HIFIMAN. I got a pair dated February of 2022, and it had some vibration issues at low frequencies that are inconsistent. And 2 days after using them, the left side lost some volume and it's about 4-5dB lower than the right at a constant 200Hz, and about 2dB lower at 1000Hz. Pretty sad since they sounded amazing while they were working. Currently looking to get a replacement, but if that doesn't work out I might just refund them. Anyone with any experience working with HIFIMAN on defective models? How was the customer service in your experience?

its 50/50.
If the right person deals with your case or not.

 

[Jyo'za]

its 50/50.
If the right person deals with your case or not.

Thanks for the reply Ken. I got a prompt response via email, and I'm currently inquiring about the exchange process. I saw on reddit that HiFiMAN sends the replacement after they receive the original? If so that is unfortunate. I hope they'll offer an advanced exchange. Fingers crossed I win the QC lottery this time!