HIDIZS S8 USB-C Headphone Adapter Review

[L5730]

OT: AliExpress payment related question:
As I am a UK resident and use GBP currency, my best bet looks to be to let AliExpress handle the transaction using my Visa Debit card.
I'd prefer PayPal, but it seems I then have to pay an additional fee, and also be forced to pay in USD and suffer the lousy conversion rate!

Am I missing something?

 

[Jimbob54]

So the 14mW and 13mW refers to the point where they clip, and not total power output capacity of the hardware? u/raistlin65 keeps on hammering that the power listed indicates max power output @ 300 ohm, and will not let up on this. He has claimed multiple times that the Tempotec Sonata HD Pro and the iFi Zen DAC have the same power output at 300 ohm based on those charts. (And he's so thicc about it, even after I showed him the math above)

I'm just repeating what is on both reviews. I have no idea what the absolute max output is of the devices. Neither are powerhouses and I don't think I'd get the zen as a desktop dac/amp combo. The user you mention is on here and I ain't commenting on a ruck you've had elsewhere!

 

[Jimbob54]

OT: AliExpress payment related question:
As I am a UK resident and use GBP currency, my best bet looks to be to let AliExpress handle the transaction using my Visa Debit card.
I'd prefer PayPal, but it seems I then have to pay an additional fee, and also be forced to pay in USD and suffer the lousy conversion rate!

Am I missing something?

I'm UK also, just use your debit card or better a credit card. You may still pay a conversion fee levied by your bank. It won't be much. Delivery was (relatively) quick too

 

[Veri]

OT: AliExpress payment related question:
As I am a UK resident and use GBP currency, my best bet looks to be to let AliExpress handle the transaction using my Visa Debit card.
I'd prefer PayPal, but it seems I then have to pay an additional fee, and also be forced to pay in USD and suffer the lousy conversion rate!

Am I missing something?

You can always turn off currency conversion in PayPal before clicking Pay. Usually you need to click the conversion in blue to turn it off, bank rate is almost always cheaper...

 

[raistlin65]

Amir tested both. The S8 clipped @300ohm with 14mw

The Zen clipped @300ohm with 13mw with power match enabled, 4mw without

So the 14mW and 13mW refers to the point where they clip, and not total power output capacity of the hardware? u/raistlin65 keeps on hammering that the power listed indicates max power output @ 300 ohm, and will not let up on this. He has claimed multiple times that the Tempotec Sonata HD Pro and the iFi Zen DAC have the same power output at 300 ohm based on those charts. (And he's so thicc about it, even after I showed him the math above)

You vigorously disputed the measurements based on your rationale. I encouraged you to come talk about it.

You claim this dongle can only achieve 6.4mw at 300 ohm. Amir's measurements show otherwise.

If you're rationale has legs, you ought to be able to explain it to people and they can confirm it. If it's wrong, someone will be able to explain it to you.

Leave me out of it. It's your claim. I merely support Amir's measurements. I have nothing more to add to this discussion.

 

[L5730]

I just entered my card details and went that way. Got a 'new user' -£2.44 coupon to make the sale around £28.38.
I've used GearBest before and paid PayPal in GBP, letting GearBest do the conversion internally. Better rate than my bank and easy better than PayPal.
Hopefully AliExpress will bill me in GBP, but I'm not too fussy if I have to pay another £1 or whatever in exchange fees from VISA.

 

[charleski]

So the 14mW and 13mW refers to the point where they clip, and not total power output capacity of the hardware? u/raistlin65 keeps on hammering that the power listed indicates max power output @ 300 ohm, and will not let up on this. He has claimed multiple times that the Tempotec Sonata HD Pro and the iFi Zen DAC have the same power output at 300 ohm based on those charts. (And he's so thicc about it, even after I showed him the math above)

Amir's criterion for maximum power takes a value at the 'knee' of the power/THD+N curve, i.e. the point where distortion begins to rise after reaching its lowest point. In most cases solid state devices exhibit a very dramatic rise in distortion as they hit their voltage rails and clip. Clipping in the Zen seems to be of a slightly different nature, though, possibly because of current limiting in its charge pump, and so we see a more gentle rise in distortion after the knee point that Amir located. Industry standard for these measurements is to rate at a defined distortion level, usually 1%, which is - 40dB. So by that standard the Zen does meet its spec of 36mW into 300ohms.

In a nutshell, the Zen will go louder, but you'll possibly be hearing some distortion on the peaks. The S8 limits its gain so that it will never approach clipping and will remain undistorted throughout its range, but that limit means it won't go as loud.

 

[Chastity23]

Amir's criterion for maximum power takes a value at the 'knee' of the power/THD+N curve, i.e. the point where distortion begins to rise after reaching its lowest point. In most cases solid state devices exhibit a very dramatic rise in distortion as they hit their voltage rails and clip. Clipping in the Zen seems to be of a slightly different nature, though, possibly because of current limiting in its charge pump, and so we see a more gentle rise in distortion after the knee point that Amir located. Industry standard for these measurements is to rate at a defined distortion level, usually 1%, which is - 40dB. So by that standard the Zen does meet its spec of 36mW into 300ohms.

In a nutshell, the Zen will go louder, but you'll possibly be hearing some distortion on the peaks. The S8 limits its gain so that it will never approach clipping and will remain undistorted throughout its range, but that limit means it won't go as loud.

Thanks for the clarification. However, the dispute isn't over, and we need confirmation on the max power output of both units at 300 ohm. Essentially, I could use someone to confirm my math, and @raistlin65 seems to only trust this site. I know there are plenty of sites with power calculators, and I confirmed with those, but I'm tired of debating this with him, so thus why we are here.

 

[Chastity23]

You vigorously disputed the measurements based on your rationale. I encouraged you to come talk about it.

You claim this dongle can only achieve 6.4mw at 300 ohm. Amir's measurements show otherwise.

If you're rationale has legs, you ought to be able to explain it to people and they can confirm it. If it's wrong, someone will be able to explain it to you.

Leave me out of it. It's your claim. I merely support Amir's measurements. I have nothing more to add to this discussion.

And you were a total **** and told me some very rude things on what I can do with my rationale. And now we are here to see who is right.

 

[raistlin65]

Amir's criterion for maximum power takes a value at the 'knee' of the power/THD+N curve, i.e. the point where distortion begins to rise after reaching its lowest point. In most cases solid state devices exhibit a very dramatic rise in distortion as they hit their voltage rails and clip. Clipping in the Zen seems to be of a slightly different nature, though, possibly because of current limiting in its charge pump, and so we see a more gentle rise in distortion after the knee point that Amir located. Industry standard for these measurements is to rate at a defined distortion level, usually 1%, which is - 40dB. So by that standard the Zen does meet its spec of 36mW into 300ohms.

In a nutshell, the Zen will go louder, but you'll possibly be hearing some distortion on the peaks. The S8 limits its gain so that it will never approach clipping and will remain undistorted throughout its range, but that limit means it won't go as loud.

With ifi Zen, Amir's rating the maximum of 13db at a second knee where the distortion starts to rise very rapidly after -70db, as opposed to the bottom of the curve

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...e-amp-review.9885/#lg=attachment38824&slide=0

 

[raistlin65]

And you were a total **** and told me some very rude things on what I can do with my rationale. And now we are here to see who is right.

I suggested you come over here to talk about the science, as you have been bad mouthing ASR measurements over there with your personal rationale. This is an opportunity to vet your claims. Doesn't have anything to do with me.

 

[Chastity23]

With ifi Zen, Amir's rating the maximum of 13db at a second knee where the distortion starts to rise very rapidly after -70db, as opposed to the bottom of the curve

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...e-amp-review.9885/#lg=attachment38824&slide=0

But you said the Temptec Sonata HD and the iFi Zen DAC have the same power output at 300 ohm. You posted this many times on the subReddit. Do NOT change the narrative here, because I will post what you said there. the whole reason I am here, is because of your BS.

 

[raistlin65]

But you said the Temptec Sonata HD and the iFi Zen DAC have the same power output at 300 ohm. You posted this many times on the subReddit. Do NOT change the narrative here, because I will post what you said there. the whole reason I am here, is because of your BS.

I'm not going to bicker with you. If you want to discuss the science of your claims go ahead.

 

[L5730]

C'mon people, let's not fight.

Whilst I don't see any reason to think there is any special about an iOS version, it seems Tempotec claim otherwise. I must have missed it in the disorganised and migraine inducing product page

Not that it actually matters to me, having no Apple products in my possession.

 

[Jimbob54]

But you said the Temptec Sonata HD and the iFi Zen DAC have the same power output at 300 ohm. You posted this many times on the subReddit. Do NOT change the narrative here, because I will post what you said there. the whole reason I am here, is because of your BS.

Got to say, seems like you just came here to continue beef. Not a great start. Maybe leave that one alone and enjoy the forum?

 

[Chastity23]

Got to say, seems like you just came here to continue beef. Not a great start. Maybe leave that one alone and enjoy the forum?

I just want someone to verify my math, so I can put this all to rest.

 

[Jimbob54]

C'mon people, let's not fight.

Whilst I don't see any reason to think there is any special about an iOS version, it seems Tempotec claim otherwise. I must have missed it in the disorganised and migraine inducing product page

View attachment 80641
Not that it actually matters to me, having no Apple products in my possession.

Well colour me surprised that there is a difference apart from the supplied cable, and I don't think I consciously chose the ios version because I too don't use apple. But hey, it's not expensive either way. Be interested to see if the S8 makes such a distinction.

 

[charleski]

Thanks for the clarification. However, the dispute isn't over, and we need confirmation on the max power output of both units at 300 ohm. Essentially, I could use someone to confirm my math, and @raistlin65 seems to only trust this site. I know there are plenty of sites with power calculators, and I confirmed with those, but I'm tired of debating this with him, so thus why we are here.

Honestly I'm not interested in whatever dispute you're having. But you really just need to look at the graphs for this. This S8 is gain-limited and stops amplifying the signal before clipping sets in. The Zen isn't gain-limited, but can't really support the additional gain it attempts to provide. (Just so we're clear, Gain = Voltage out / Voltage in, whereas Power = Voltage out * Current out.) Amir's rating discounts the extra gain the Zen can provide on the reasonable basis that we want to know the maximum low-distortion power. The maximum low-distortion power of these units is virtually the same, but the Zen will allow you to turn up the volume past that point and get higher volume at the cost of distortion, whereas the S8 won't.

Since we're dealing with devices with a SINAD of -100dB or better it's fair to regard the industry standard of -40dB as far too lenient. So I think Amir's criterion has a lot of validity, but you need to take the difference into account when comparing his numbers to measurements from elsewhere.

 

[charleski]

Well colour me surprised that there is a difference apart from the supplied cable, and I don't think I consciously chose the ios version because I too don't use apple. But hey, it's not expensive either way. Be interested to see if the S8 makes such a distinction.

I asked this question before, and someone else said it really was just the cable. iOS lightning connectors come with a proprietary verification chip in them. If the connector lacks that chip then your iPhone will pop up a nag screen moaning about connecting an uncertified device. But that's the only difference. I tested mine on my ipad and it works fine without complaining, so they're using an official connector.
Obviously this official connector costs money, which is where the extra cost of the iOS version comes from. But the extra cost is actually quite reasonable as proper lightning->micro usb cables go for a lot more than the ~£5 they charge, even on AliX.

 

[L5730]

I asked this question before, and someone else said it really was just the cable. ..

I found your original question after posting myself.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...hone-adapter-review.10823/page-36#post-478780

Yeah, seems just the lightning cable is the difference. Oh and that it probably has a black box (non-iOS) not a white one (iOS).

The AliExpress checkout seemed a bit quirky. Hopefully they get the right address details. Had the email saying payment is successful, so now it's the waiting game.