Help With New DAC For Benchmark HPA4

[ShiZo]

Looking at the measurements of both the d70s and d90se (basing it off wolf's measurements) I'm having a hard time deciding which I should get.

Everything seems below audibility and extremely so on the d90se. I notice the d90se has better sinad, jitter, multitone, linearity, snr but the d70s has amazing crosstalk performance. My benchmark hpa4 also has amazing crosstalk performance. I did notice the d70s has lower linearity being below -120.

Do you think for my case I should just get the d70s to maintain the amazing crosstalk performance my hpa4 has or am I overvaluing the importance of that measurement and is the godly performance on the other tests with the d90se the easy choice for my next dac? I like the idea of the signal not bleeding into the other channels.

Guys, I know at this point we are talking about complete audio transparency on both, but please humor me. I'm also trying to learn the importance of each individual measurement.

 

[DHT 845]

D70s is great, d90se probably sligtly different, sabre is more "analitical" chip than AKM. Double chip in d70s is more "no compromise" in terms of crosstalk. I am not sure what voltage d90se has at the output, is it is 4V/2V I would still go for d70s that has 5V/2,5V (XLR/RCA).

 

[Jim Matthews]

If it is within your budget, why not stay in the Benchmark "family"?

 

[JohnYang1997]

From my point of view, D90se is planned and managed from every bit ground up. Every aspect of it is specifically designed that way. D70s was basically a trick that you get lower harmonics with lower output level. I'd recommend D90se all day every day.

 

[gonzoucab]

Get the D70s there are no more D90s available in the market

 

[DHT 845]

From my point of view, D90se is planned and managed from every bit ground up. Every aspect of it is specifically designed that way. D70s was basically a trick that you get lower harmonics with lower output level. I'd recommend D90se all day every day.

so what is the output lever of D90se? What do you meant by "trick"?

 

[JohnYang1997]

so what is the output lever of D90se? What do you meant by "trick"?

4V 5V selectable.
Attenuate level often reduces distortion. So D70s basically traded some SNR for lower distortion resulting better THD+N.

 

[DHT 845]

I just don't get it....

Maybe you just do not have AK chips supply any more. That was easy predictable that topping will swich to Sabre.
Good that I grabbed d70s, cause I alredy have double ES9038pro DAC

 

[JohnYang1997]

I just don't get it....

Maybe you just do not have AK chips supply any more. That was easy predictable that topping will swich to Sabre.
Good that I grabbed d70s, cause I alredy have double ES9038pro DAC

??
There's no maybe. We don't have supply for AK chips anymore. But how does that matter? Be happy with D70s there's nothing wrong with it. It's essentially better than the D90.
The DAC section of the D90se is fully developed by me to squeeze the performance out of 9038PRO. Where the older dacs aren't. Spec wise it's just plain better by a long shot even leaving M400 to dust. I'm not telling you any one would sound better. You probably don't know me but technical superiority is not better sound. Under certain threshold you just don't hear the difference. I recommend going through some threads articles in the psychoacoustics section.

 

[DHT 845]

which part you do not understand, Sir?
You just said that lower distortion is bad thing and that was a "trick". And you said that d70s has lower output level but it has 5V.

 

[JohnYang1997]

which part you do not understand, Sir?
You just said that lower distortion is bad thing and that was a "trick". And you said that d70s has lower output level and it hav 5V.

At 5V there's usually imbalance in distortion across two channels. That's why we speced it at 4V -2dB. Also even with 5V output there's already attenuation in the digital section. We just boosted afterwards. This is good because it reduced overall distortion. I never said a trick is bad but it's not designed the same way as D90se. Why on earth would I say D70s is bad??

 

[DHT 845]

For the 3rd time I tell you, make monoblock amps...
I can even accept SMPS, class H or whatever (if it will be of highest quality with current reserve)
Peace.

 

[gonzoucab]

When topping monoblocks?

 

[DHT 845]

Hello, topping. "Market" is asking....

From the business point of view you just start to eat your own tail by adding more and more quality DAC's.
And there is shortage of state of the art power amps on the market. Not including class D there is none in reasonable price! Benchmark AHB2 is too expensive for many.

 

[gonzoucab]

Im going to buy 2 Bechmark AHB2, but im holding for Topping to see if i can get 4 monoblocks.

BTW, new product from SMSL

https://apos.audio/blogs/news/16x-less-distortion-than-monoprice-the-smsl-sa400

 

[linger63]

Looking at the measurements of both the d70s and d90se (basing it off wolf's measurements) I'm having a hard time deciding which I should get.

Everything seems below audibility and extremely so on the d90se. I notice the d90se has better sinad, jitter, multitone, linearity, snr but the d70s has amazing crosstalk performance. My benchmark hpa4 also has amazing crosstalk performance. I did notice the d70s has lower linearity being below -120.

Do you think for my case I should just get the d70s to maintain the amazing crosstalk performance my hpa4 has or am I overvaluing the importance of that measurement and is the godly performance on the other tests with the d90se the easy choice for my next dac? I like the idea of the signal not bleeding into the other channels.

Guys, I know at this point we are talking about complete audio transparency on both, but please humor me. I'm also trying to learn the importance of each individual measurement.

My friend uses a Gustard X26Pro with his Benchmark LA4 and is very happy.

https://soundnews.net/sources/dacs/gustard-x26-pro-dac-review/
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...rd-x26-pro-dual-9038-pro-by-l7audiolab.19921/

 

[Spocko]

Looking at the measurements of both the d70s and d90se (basing it off wolf's measurements) I'm having a hard time deciding which I should get.

Everything seems below audibility and extremely so on the d90se. I notice the d90se has better sinad, jitter, multitone, linearity, snr but the d70s has amazing crosstalk performance. My benchmark hpa4 also has amazing crosstalk performance. I did notice the d70s has lower linearity being below -120.

Do you think for my case I should just get the d70s to maintain the amazing crosstalk performance my hpa4 has or am I overvaluing the importance of that measurement and is the godly performance on the other tests with the d90se the easy choice for my next dac? I like the idea of the signal not bleeding into the other channels.

Guys, I know at this point we are talking about complete audio transparency on both, but please humor me. I'm also trying to learn the importance of each individual measurement.

Go with your gut because at this point, we know they all sound great - the question is more emotional: which one makes you feel good owning?

 

[Spocko]

At 5V there's usually imbalance in distortion across two channels. That's why we speced it at 4V -2dB. Also even with 5V output there's already attenuation in the digital section. We just boosted afterwards. This is good because it reduced overall distortion. I never said a trick is bad but it's not designed the same way as D90se. Why on earth would I say D70s is bad??

Do you know when we can buy the D90SE from sites like Apos? I do like their generous return policy.

 

[dpippel]

Do you know when we can buy the D90SE from sites like Apos? I do like their generous return policy.

It's changed from what it used to be. They advertise *45 DAY RETURNS*, but if you read the fine print you only have *8* days to initiate that return, otherwise they hit you with a 20% restocking fee:

"Return requests made between 8 and 45 days after the order is marked as delivered will be subject to a 20% Processing Fee*."

I've purchased a number of items from Apos in the past and have always been amazed at their great customer service and fast shipping. My latest ordering experience, however, was terrible. They misrepresented how long the item would take to reach me, it took them on average 2 days to respond to both email and chat inquiries, multiple CSRs responded and none of them knew what the others had told me. It was a CF. Doubt that I'll go there again and it's a shame, because they used to be among the best.

 

[Spocko]

It's changed from what it used to be. They advertise *45 DAY RETURNS*, but if you read the fine print you only have *8* days to initiate that return, otherwise they hit you with a 20% restocking fee:

"Return requests made between 8 and 45 days after the order is marked as delivered will be subject to a 20% Processing Fee*."

I've purchased a number of items from Apos in the past and have always been amazed at their great customer service and fast shipping. My latest ordering experience, however, was terrible. They misrepresented how long the item would take to reach me, it took them on average 2 days to respond to both email and chat inquiries, multiple CSRs responded and none of them knew what the others had told me. It was a CF. Doubt that I'll go there again and it's a shame, because they used to be among the best.

Wow, thanks for the heads up because like you, I enjoyed their excellent customer service the last time I purchased from them (about a year ago).