Help Shape Our Upcoming CD Player for 2024

[Tell]

CD player digital processor ICs have been doing fade up/down for well over 30 years, but it is much faster. Done to prevent nasty transients.

Ah yeah that makes sense, I have some memory hearing some kind of fast "clicky noise" on some players (might have been a software MP3 player though), sounds a bit nasty. But I'd like more than just a very few millisec though, I have around 100-750ms in Foobar2000 (depending on action) and it's such a smooth and nice experience when playing/pausing or changing tracks

 

[restorer-john]

Ah yeah that makes sense, I have some memory hearing some kind of fast "clicky noise" on some players (might have been a software MP3 player though), sounds a bit nasty. But I'd like more than just a very few millisec though, I have around 100-750ms in Foobar2000 (depending on action) and it's such a smooth and nice experience when playing/pausing or changing tracks

Some Sony and Pioneers back in the day had programmable fade in/outs, but they were in 1 second increments for tape dubbing. I agree, a nice rapid fade is nice when jumping tracks.

 

[LightninBoy]

Im in the market for a "fun" CD player. Something with old school tactical feel and updated lifestyle design.

Must haves:
1. Track info display and full track controls that are prominent and easy to see/use
2. Gapless playback (ridiculous this has to be specified)
3. At least 1 digital out
4. Small form factor
5. Under $300 us

Nice to haves
1. Bluetooth transmission
3. Multiple digital outputs (optical and coax)
4. Top load, or something unique to set it apart from other black boxes.
5. Remote with meaningful CD functions such as direct track access

Im leaning towards top load because
1. Tray mechanisms are the first thing to go in cheap CD player.
2. It enhances the "ceremony" of playing a CD.
3. I have the space in my entertainment center to accommodate a top load

The shanling CD player ticks many of these boxes but is just too expensive.

Lots of unknown brands pumping out models for around $100. But the quality is highly suspect.

 

[jruser]

SACD capability. Let it send stereo DoP over optical and give it an HDMI port for bonus points to send 5.1 DSD

 

[konst465]

First off all, thank you Fosi for listening to user feedback.

In my opinion the perfect cd player would be in the form factor of the SMSL PL200 or the Shanling EC3. These devices cost upwards of 600 Euro, a lot of this price could be cut by removing BT capability, no dac and no headphone output. While I think SACD's are great and MQA-CD's look interesting it is too costly. A USB C port for CD ripping would be a plus. An external power supply is great for this form factor. The biggest point of contention seems to be tray or top loading, this issue should be debated in this thread.

So in conclusion we would have a solid CD-Transport with great feeling buttons and a clear small display with essential information.

 

[Audioagnostic]

Beside all suggestions a feature that I would appreciate.

wifi connection so you can operate the player with a smartphone. Connection to a public cd database allowing recognition of the cd that is being played. This would allow display of the full playing list on your phone. Connection to allmusic or wikipedia to read up on the artist and cd.

 

[Bleib]

Low jitter
Quiet mechanics
Remote
No large footprint

are a must. For me it doesn't need to have a DAC, I'd connect through optical or more likely coaxial anyway as the TV already sends optical signal to the DAC..

 

[boxerfan88]

How about consider producing a high quality CDP+Streamer combo product? For example, DMP-A8 quality streamer plus a high quality CDP mechanism built in.

 

[mags65]

To expand on @etimal 's take.

What makes a CD Player is not that it is playing CDs. A lot of devices do. Portable players do it very poorly.

What makes a CD Player is its use of the features allowed by the medium.

Which is exactly what most disc players on the market right now do not offer since it starts with a full informative display.
The japanese brands dropped the ball years ago. Every single recent asian effort missed the point or showed a clear misunderstanding of record playing as an activity.

CD did not invent playing music, but it brought a way to do it better.
A real CD player is not living in the same dimension than a DVD player.
Maybe one has to experience it to understand the extend of this laconic remark.

The most defining features for a real CD player are:

• Direct Access to each track (meaning a dial pad!).
• Visualisation of the totality of the tracks available on the disc with an icon/number for each, on a indented line or a grid (meaning an info screen).
• Time and timing information in every possible situation : track, disc, sequence currently playing, elapsed/remaining.
• Custom sequencing of the tracks (meaning a program mode).
• Random Playing (meaning a random mode).
• Extract playing (meaning a scan mode).
• Repeat of selection, even within the random play mode that should support repeat too.
• A-B repeat of a section within any portion of the record.

It includes the legacy features :

• Quiet operation.
• Direct play from closing of the lid/tray/etc.
• That funny eject button (well ... it was fun in 1982-1984 ! Just search : Hitachi DA-1000)
• GAPLESS AUDIO PLAYING ... since it's not even a given anymore!

The only "modern" features truly needed :

• A great internal DAC/Headphone amp combo.
• Dual physical digital out (Optical and coaxial).
• Bit perfect digital Out (not just the internally produced upsampled then downsampled stream).
• CDR/CDRW and FLAC play
• 12v trigger since it's becoming a standard.

Having a CD Player doing DAC duties is neat but to add peripherical complexity and cost does not make it a better player; that's an orthogonal feature.

Today's Denon/Yamaha/Pioneer/Marantz/Tascam models do not bring even half of this feature set list that was a given on most of their own mid level players 30 years ago, and there were more to be had : digital volume, pitch control, fader, peek volume locator, etc.
Nowadays the portable gadgets we see online do not bring much more fonctionality than a $80 blue-ray player with an optical digital out. A point which does not erase the fetishist lust a MoonDrop DreamDisc can induce...

+1

 

[kelesh]

A must have, in addition to the many already specified necessary features: pre-emphasis compensation capability WITH INDICATOR as on some good older players, so that it is clear and unambiguous:

 

[DMill]

Why not just buy a decent used CD player for $100? I have a Denon 2910 in its factory box not used the last 10 years.

 

[Bleib]

Why not just buy a decent used CD player for $100? I have a Denon 2910 in its factory box not used the last 10 years.

It can be difficult to find them, in all too many cases the remote is missing. Can be great price but often too bulky in size as well.

 

[kelesh]

Why not just buy a decent used CD player for $100? I have a Denon 2910 in its factory box not used the last 10 years.

That's actually a very good machine that also plays SACD, I have one.

 

[kelesh]

It can be difficult to find them, in all too many cases the remote is missing. Can be great price but often too bulky in size as well.

They are not bulky, most are standard 17" size. It's the newer ones that are too small.

 

[kelesh]

Almost forgot - NO undefeatable auto play, please. I have seen way too many players that just start playing a disc once the tray closes. Few things are more annoying than that. Take lessons from the classic old machines - when you place media in the player, it needs to display the track/time/type info and then be quiet until the user enters a "play" command. If you want to include auto play, make it an option that can be turned off.

 

[Bleib]

They are not bulky, most are standard 17" size. It's the newer ones that are too small.

Open up just about any of them and it's mostly just air. And it's not like they need that much air either as none of the components really use a lot of energy.

Cambridge Audio AXC35
Could fit a ton or more electronics into this box. Class D amp, BT receiver, radio etc

 

[kelesh]

Open up just about any of them and it's mostly just air. And it's not like they need that much air either as none of the components really use a lot of energy.
View attachment 379411
Cambridge Audio AXC35
Could fit a ton or more electronics into this box. Class D amp, BT receiver, radio etc

Oh, I know, I've opened many. It isn't about that, it's about adhering to a sort-of standard, or what used to be. Us old-timers like to stack boxes of equal size. Most of this new gear I don't know where to put, given the random sizing. The Fosi/Topping/SMSL units I have look like matchboxes in comparison.

 

[Bleib]

Oh, I know, I've opened many. It isn't about that, it's about adhering to a sort-of standard, or what used to be. Us old-timers like to stack boxes of equal size. Most of this new gear I don't know where to put, given the random sizing. The Fosi/Topping/SMSL units I have look like matchboxes in comparison.

I'm an old timer too, a bit over 40 years. But, since vinyl isn't so common, we have class D amps I think it makes sense to shrink more things down. It also cuts down on shipping costs so for me it's a win-win

 

[Doodski]

Open up just about any of them and it's mostly just air. And it's not like they need that much air either as none of the components really use a lot of energy.
View attachment 379411
Cambridge Audio AXC35
Could fit a ton or more electronics into this box. Class D amp, BT receiver, radio etc

Disc players are sensitive to RF energy and a radio near or in a disc player will create troubles. But who knows we have PCs with Bluetooth and WiFi so maybe things have improved.

 

[Bleib]

Disc players are sensitive to RF energy and a radio near or in a disc player will create troubles. But who knows we have PCs with Bluetooth and WiFi so maybe things have improved.

That sounds just like poor design. Obviously interference is possible but one works largely in the digital domain whilst the other doesn't. And obviously one could design the radio parts so that they are not active when CD/BT is used in order to avoid any leakage.

Largely these things aren't designed this way because they want to sell more units.

I've had Philips receiver with radio built in, once I upgraded to an amp only with more power it was impossible to hear any difference at normal listening levels. This was late 90s