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Heissmann DXT-Mon-182

suttondesign

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I've been wanting to try out a solid DIY approach to a 2-way, so I'm starting up a build of the Heissmann DXT-Mon-182. I went through $100 of good material to do that darned faceted face but couldn't get consistent results with my tools (which are good, but no match for a CNC machine). So I've got a local CNC shop doing the face -- a capitulation which departs from pure DIY, I realize, but shredding good wood and generating lots of heat from a canted table-saw blade wasn't worth the hours of extra effort. One of those little compromises we make to our values, I guess.

The other problem that cropped up was that the mid-woofer from Wavecor in the 4-ohm version specified by Heissman isn't available in the U.S., but Solen in Canada had it (whew).

The rest of the construction is cinchy. Madisound was very helpful with the crossover parts. My local woodshop has 3/4" MDF for $30 a sheet right now, and they had some walnut veneer for a song. Looks like the build cost will end up at $1,750 all-in for parts and materials (not including the material I chewed through, but hey, who's counting). I'm hoping to visit Amir one day in the Fall to let him test one.

My main worry is that I've never built crossovers before. Anyone who has tips about the spacing of the crossover components, construction methods, feel free to chime in. I'll be asking for help on that, I'm sure. The Heissman diagram shows the physical layout and connection points, so I plan to just blow it up to scale, print it, and lay it over my boards. I'm installing the crossovers outboard in boxes in the equipment closet, rather than in the speakers, and using speakons to minimize the number of terminals on the speakers.

As the forum knows, I've built all the Linkwitz speaker designs over the years, some twice, and I now run Linkwitz 521.4's. The Heissman is a fun project to run a traditional 2-way in place of the LX521.4 upper unit, crossed over to the open-baffle bass unit and my DIY subs which handle everything below 40hz. The MiniDSP flex 8 makes it easy to set up separate profiles for different configurations of speakers, so I can swap things out at my leisure.
 
My main worry is that I've never built crossovers before. Anyone who has tips about the spacing of the crossover components, construction methods, feel free to chime in. I'll be asking for help on that, I'm sure. The Heissman diagram shows the physical layout and connection points, so I plan to just blow it up to scale, print it, and lay it over my boards. I'm installing the crossovers outboard in boxes in the equipment closet, rather than in the speakers, and using speakons to minimize the number of terminals on the speakers.
Have some paper or use boards if you already know maximum final size, then just arrange the components so that they fit into the limits. Do not hesitate to go 3D, i.e. stack components over each other or even rotate them into any angle you see fit. Luster terminals are a good way to go into and out of crossover broads.
Unless you built the crossover for show, hot glue is an easy way to secure the components. Pay attention to coil layout:

 
That's cool. Heissmann publishes the diagram, so it seems consistent with what you show. All inductors are flat against the board, and separated from each other quite a bit.

1756497937040.png
 
Knowing the DXT-Mon 182 would stay with me for long I ordered pre-built cabinet out of multiplex which were 500€/$ at that time. I built many speakers but they don't end up looking that good if I diy them from MDF.
The DXT-Mon 182 are still some of the best kits I heard even if not exactly cheap. My speakers did not end up measuring the same as the ones from Alexander Heissmann (seems his dxt tweeters measure a bit different which gives a mild midrange recess and mild high frequency boost). Still they sound fantastic without eq for any music.
As a side note css uses the 8 Ohm version of the Wavecor midwoofer on many of their kits. I think this is an awesome driver with nice and pleasant sound and very good bass for the cabinet volume.
 
Knowing the DXT-Mon 182 would stay with me for long I ordered pre-built cabinet out of multiplex which were 500€/$ at that time. I built many speakers but they don't end up looking that good if I diy them from MDF.
The DXT-Mon 182 are still some of the best kits I heard even if not exactly cheap. My speakers did not end up measuring the same as the ones from Alexander Heissmann (seems his dxt tweeters measure a bit different which gives a mild midrange recess and mild high frequency boost). Still they sound fantastic without eq for any music.
As a side note css uses the 8 Ohm version of the Wavecor midwoofer on many of their kits. I think this is an awesome driver with nice and pleasant sound and very good bass for the cabinet volume.
Could you share your measurements here please?
 
DXT-Mon 182 vs KH150.jpg

Could you share your measurements here please?
Above is a comparative Measurement on Axis with Neumann KH150, 1m mic distance somewhat in the middle of the room. Wiggles are room modes but a trend can be seen. KH150 has more Bass and a bit too much lower Mid (that is not on axis but from reflection, can be seen in Estimated in room response of ASR Measurement). DXT-Mon 182 is flawless in Woofer Range but the Tweeter has too low Volume in 1,5khz Range and a bit too much 6khz and above. However that actually sounds good as a midrange recess is milder on the ears. All in all without EW everyone hugely preferred the DXT-Mon over the KH150. Different Situation with my Ascilab C6B - here the opinions are divided. Ascilab more neutral mids, DXT-Mon 182 better Bass (the wavecor is a better Bass driver then the much cheaper SB Acoustics) and more Sparkle (but too much sparkle and a bit recessed mids).

However - if the DXT Tweeter would perform as the one Heissmann used to design the DXT-Mon 182 then the DXT-Mon would be even more neutral too. I did not bother to fix that even if i could as it just sounds good as it is and the error is in Frequency response only and not in directivity. Used with an AVR and Dirac that is a quick fix. Dirac makes the speaker sound more neutral but not in every case "better" like explained.
 
Thanks. I'm building 2way with DXT tweeter and I just wanted to see how the one in heissmann project works in real world. There are not many loudspeakers that use DXT and measurements are even more rare.
 
...All in all without EW everyone hugely preferred the DXT-Mon over the KH150...
Awesome! I was looking at the SPL curves on my computer monitor but hadn't scrolled down enough to see your text. I was going to comment that, as much as Neumann's get great reviews and comments on their objective measurements, I bet the speaker with the purple line actually sounds better to a real human listening to real music in a real room.
 
I bet the speaker with the purple line actually sounds better to a real human listening to real music in a real room.

Pretty sure the KH150 is also listened to by real humans in real rooms and lots of people love their neutrality. That DXT182 Mon should be more neutral than the response provided. If it were my speaker I'd be tracking down the reason why it doesn't measure as it should.
 
Pretty sure the KH150 is also listened to by real humans in real rooms and lots of people love their neutrality. That DXT182 Mon should be more neutral than the response provided. If it were my speaker I'd be tracking down the reason why it doesn't measure as it should.
I think it measures as it should. It seemed odd that in Heissmann's measurements there was no 13khz deep that DXT tweeter had.
 
...If it were my speaker I'd be tracking down the reason why it doesn't measure as it should.
Interesting, if I had speakers that sounded very good I wouldn't do anything other than listen to them. If you tracked it down, fixed it, and they sounded worse, would you keep it that way?
 
I think it measures as it should. It seemed odd that in Heissmann's measurements there was no 13khz deep that DXT tweeter had.

What makes you think it measures as it should? There are other members here who have built Heissmann designed speaker using the DXT and their responses track with Heismanns measurements. I would speculate there is a component value that is incorrect somewhere. The 13khz dip does show up in Heismanns 182 data, but it looks worse on yours due to the 7.5khz elevation and what I would descrive as a general incorrectness to the tweeters high pass slope. The dip around the xover point is much more concerning. Of course EQ'able but still strange.
 
I think it measures as it should. It seemed odd that in Heissmann's measurements there was no 13khz deep that DXT tweeter had.
Im pretty sure it does not measure as it should - the speaker seems designed with a different behaving batch of dxt tweeters. It needs a different crossover for the tweeter but can be fixed, I did on my smaller DXT-Mon (non 182 version with the 5" woofer).
 
Im pretty sure it does not measure as it should - the speaker seems designed with a different behaving batch of dxt tweeters. It needs a different crossover for the tweeter but can be fixed, I did on my smaller DXT-Mon (non 182 version with the 5" woofer).
Is there such large deviation in fr from batch to batch of dxt tweeters?
 
What makes you think it measures as it should? There are other members here who have built Heissmann designed speaker using the DXT and their responses track with Heismanns measurements. I would speculate there is a component value that is incorrect somewhere. The 13khz dip does show up in Heismanns 182 data, but it looks worse on yours due to the 7.5khz elevation and what I would descrive as a general incorrectness to the tweeters high pass slope. The dip around the xover point is much more concerning. Of course EQ'able but still strange.
Maybe it was not measured straight on axis- even 5 degrees vertically makes difference (dip) in crossover area.
 
Maybe it was not measured straight on axis- even 5 degrees vertically makes difference (dip) in crossover area.

And...
To put it in perspective, here is Suttondesign's measurement and Heismann's measurement.
This is the scale from Heismann's site.
Psychoacoustic smoothing added.
Thick traces to reflect the fact that even good measurement mics are not all that precise. If I could have made the traces +/- 1.5dB I'm not sure there would be a visible difference.

TEMP Comparison 2.jpg
 
And...
To put it in perspective, here is Suttondesign's measurement and Heismann's measurement.
This is the scale from Heismann's site.
Psychoacoustic smoothing added.
Thick traces to reflect the fact that even good measurement mics are not all that precise. If I could have made the traces +/- 1.5dB I'm not sure there would be a visible difference.

View attachment 473205
I am pretty sure Heissmann measurement is gated and near field merged while the other is only smoothed. But the deviation is there in the same way I have it.
 
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