headphones with better soundstage (from 400-500€ downward)

[ThomsBrown92]

K702 is fine for the price and if you wish soundstage with a deacent everything else. They are not great nor sounding particularly good out of the box, you need to slope it down a bit which will work to the good very loud program (let's say 96 dB), drivers aren't particularly low distortion so forget about mind blowing listening levels or busting bass a lot even on loud to very loud one. Three is a consistency control issue (like with most AKG's) or a quality issue if you wish. Rod's failing of is easy to fix after all. At the end fit is what matters the most and only old cups (stock regular foam one's) are good if you want to retain those spectral qualities. And for that reason I wouldn't recommend used one's if its not really a bargaining price and if you can purchase new stock pads for reasonable price to replace them, same goes for refabrish if the pads are renewed then its OK.
With a little luck (and bit of knowledge) good old combo of AKG K702 and SBX G6 are all you need for the purpose (and on the budget).

thank you very much for the advice. But I didn't understand one thing, why don't you recommend used?

 

[ZolaIII]

thank you very much for the advice. But I didn't understand one thing, why don't you recommend used?

Pods probably won't be in a good shape, probably best would be new with good return policy if you don't get good quality one's with good L-R channel matching or you simply don't like them.

 

[Robbo99999]

I will definitely do it. As soon as they arrive I will give all the necessary information

I answer the question asked in the other thread: "Are the headphones you got for 60 € new?" The answer is: no, they are used, precisely described as in excellent condition, and for Amazon it literally means: The item has signs of frequent use, but it is in good condition and has all its accessories. It may have slight cosmetic defects, scratches and other signs of wear left by the previous owner.

Ah, ok, it's a used one. If you need to get replacement pads I recommend the following ones:

Accessory House Premium Velour ear pads compatible with AKG K701 K702 AKG Q701 K612 PRO K712 PRO and Massdrop K7XX Headphones. Premium Velour | Soft High-Density Foam | Easy Installation: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics & Photo

Free delivery and returns on eligible orders. Buy Accessory House Premium Velour ear pads compatible with AKG K701 K702 AKG Q701 K612 PRO K712 PRO and Massdrop K7XX Headphones. Premium Velour | Soft High-Density Foam | Easy Installation at Amazon UK.

smile.amazon.co.uk

They're a lot cheaper than the genuine pads, but they're designed "the same" and I've measured them vs stock pads on my miniDSP EARS rig and they're virtually identical - they don't change the frequency response much at all. They are praps a tad deeper than the stock pads, but this will help in the soundstage......but like I said it doesn't really change the frequency response (see following graph of stock pads vs the aftermarket pads).

 

[Count Arthur]

When it comes to soundstage on headphones and IEMs, I think I'm with Crinacle, there are differences, but they're probably too small to worry about and that other things like the overall frequency response, clarity, bass impact, etc., are far more important.

 

[Robbo99999]

When it comes to soundstage on headphones and IEMs, I think I'm with Crinacle, there are differences, but they're probably too small to worry about and that other things like the overall frequency response, clarity, bass impact, etc., are far more important.

It's interesting, it depends on the individual, for me it's a very important factor, but I appreciate not everyone is the same.

 

[ThomsBrown92]

@ZolaIII @solderdude @Robbo99999 thank you very much for your availability you helped me in the conscious choice of the headphones, I am about to buy the AKG K702, and I have a question for you: assuming that the headphones have NO functional defects (not aesthetic), the fact that this Has it been used for a long time does it imply something in terms of sound? Can a headset used for a longer time have negative variations? I ask you because unlike € 20 I take a headset that has been rarely used (with slight aesthetic defects) while the other has signs of frequent use left by the previous owner, so compared to the first one it was certainly used more, and being a headphone released 10 years ago this thing worries me a little, even if I don't know anything about it, the idea of owning a headphone already used for 6/8/10 years is not really reassuring.

 

[ZolaIII]

Everything can be abused, hopefully you aren't buying from an idiot. Those are fairly good and simple construction so little can go wrong. Driver's with normal use can last for 20+ years in time they lose a bit of brightness which is even good thing in case of those. I have almost 50 years old pair of Pioneer Monitor 10 II in a good shape but used more as a trophy. They don't make them like that any more that's for sure.

 

[solderdude]

The most common issues with older K702 are:

• Eastic bands that lost tension (all of them will after many years)
• Worn pads (depends on factors) These are easy to replace (€ 22.- each so € 44.- for 2)
• Sometimes (very rare but happens) the internal wiring to the metal headband rods (which carry the signal for the right driver) breaks off and needs to be resoldered (right channel not or intermittent sound).

 

[Count Arthur]

It's interesting, it depends on the individual, for me it's a very important factor, but I appreciate not everyone is the same.

I've tried a fair few headphones and IEMS over the years and even the very widest and most soundstage-ey headphones I've tried, probably the HD560s, still sounds to me like a tiny band in my forehead. It never sounds like sitting in front of a pair of speakers, which, in turn, never sounds like standing in front of a band.

 

[Robbo99999]

@ZolaIII @solderdude @Robbo99999 thank you very much for your availability you helped me in the conscious choice of the headphones, I am about to buy the AKG K702, and I have a question for you: assuming that the headphones have NO functional defects (not aesthetic), the fact that this Has it been used for a long time does it imply something in terms of sound? Can a headset used for a longer time have negative variations? I ask you because unlike € 20 I take a headset that has been rarely used (with slight aesthetic defects) while the other has signs of frequent use left by the previous owner, so compared to the first one it was certainly used more, and being a headphone released 10 years ago this thing worries me a little, even if I don't know anything about it, the idea of owning a headphone already used for 6/8/10 years is not really reassuring.

As solderdude says in the post I quoted below, a few of those things have happened with my various K702, I've got 3 units (don't ask!). The wires have failed on two of them & required resoldering. The last failed soldering to go was on my newest K702, this was my favourite K702 and I'd totally perfected the EQ for it, so when visiting my parents one time I took along this K702 with the EQ to show them to see what they thought - well my Mum has no experience of headphones and I said to be careful with it but she pulled off the headphone with one hand and overextended the headband, and one of the wires immediately became dislodged from the right earcup - she managed to break it within 2 mins flat......I've still got to solder that wire on which I don't look forward to because it's fiddly! But, I assume the seller is no selling you a headphone with just one earcup working, lol! Regarding the loosening of the headband elastic, I've had my first unit of K702 since back in 2015 - and I put thousands of hours on that in around 5 yrs and indeed the soldering needed doing on that unit too, but I didn't need to change the elastic, although it's noticeably looser (less clamping pressure) than my other two newer K702. It's possible to replace the elastic yourself, but apparently that is also a bit fiddly. In my opinion, you'll just have to replace the earpads, I think you should actually replace them anyway, the aftermarket pads I linked you earlier.

The most common issues with older K702 are:

• Eastic bands that lost tension (all of them will after many years)
• Worn pads (depends on factors) These are easy to replace (€ 22.- each so € 44.- for 2)
• Sometimes (very rare but happens) the internal wiring to the metal headband rods (which carry the signal for the right driver) breaks off and needs to be resoldered (right channel not or intermittent sound).

I've tried a fair few headphones and IEMS over the years and even the very widest and most soundstage-ey headphones I've tried, probably the HD560s, still sounds to me like a tiny band in my forehead. It never sounds like sitting in front of a pair of speakers, which, in turn, never sounds like standing in front of a band.

Yeah, it will never sound exactly like speakers arranged in front of you, but I think depending on the individual it's possible to experience the music outside of your head to varying degrees. The K702 does do the best for me on this variable, with HD560s second. Soundstage is really quite an individual & subjective experience that varies from person to person, but there does seem to be general trends in how large or good the soundstage is of various models of headphone - so there is some loose consensus re headphone models that have good soundstage & those that don't.

 

[ZolaIII]

I've tried a fair few headphones and IEMS over the years and even the very widest and most soundstage-ey headphones I've tried, probably the HD560s, still sounds to me like a tiny band in my forehead. It never sounds like sitting in front of a pair of speakers, which, in turn, never sounds like standing in front of a band.

Spekers are there where you place them and they mix up to a low bass level, with headaphones it's direct but you have separation all the way down. In a topical up words front mix you won't have much to position in the first place so it sounds tiny I personally hete when they for instance put bassy instruments all on the one side never mind on what I am listening. How ever there ware/are certain artists and albums with high DRA and lots of positioning either experimental playing with placing and panning or something else which you will best expirienc (and imagine) with such hedaphones like Pink Floyd even Beatles to hell even with CCWR (once and only in Rude Awakening N°#2). How ever those contrary don't sound anything spectacular or it even sounds bad on speakers.

 

[Robbo99999]

Spekers are there where you place them and they mix up to a low bass level, with headaphones it's direct but you have separation all the way down. In a topical up words front mix you won't have much to position in the first place so it sounds tiny I personally hete when they for instance put bassy instruments all on the one side never mind on what I am listening. How ever there ware/are certain artists and albums with high DRA and lots of positioning either experimental playing with placing and panning or something else which you will best expirienc (and imagine) with such hedaphones like Pink Floyd even Beatles to hell even with CCWR (once and only in Rude Awakening N°#2). How ever those contrary don't sound anything spectacular or it even sounds bad on speakers.

Massive Attack is great on headphones for the soundstage element - to tally with what you say about certain artists.

 

[ZolaIII]

Massive Attack is great on headphones for the soundstage element - to tally with what you say about certain artists.

Well it's more present in a modern genre's I tryed to pin it back in time on easy representative manner. If it's a good mix and recording even some old jazz things have a great one. Telegraf Road for another example from me and a good night.

 

[Robbo99999]

Well it's more present in a modern genre's I tryed to pin it back in time on easy representative manner. If it's a good mix and recording even some old jazz things have a great one. Telegraf Road for another example from me and a good night.

Ha, Telegraph Road, I remember that one, I used to be a Dire Straits fan back in the 80's, I was just a young kid back then & at the time influenced by my older cousins music......but I do remember Telegraph Road having a lot of atmosphere and sound effects, quite an epic song.

 

[ThomsBrown92]

The most common issues with older K702 are:

• Eastic bands that lost tension (all of them will after many years)
• Worn pads (depends on factors) These are easy to replace (€ 22.- each so € 44.- for 2)
• Sometimes (very rare but happens) the internal wiring to the metal headband rods (which carry the signal for the right driver) breaks off and needs to be resoldered (right channel not or intermittent sound).

so better if I spend 20 euros more, but I take the less used ones

 

[solderdude]

I really cannot say.

Both the K702 and HE400i, 400i (2020) and 400SE weren't keepers for me.

 

[Robbo99999]

so better if I spend 20 euros more, but I take the less used ones

If you want the K702 then buy it used or new - if you buy it used then understand that you'll probably have to replace the earpads (my aftermarket pad link recommendation). I'd be inclined to buy it new if you're gonna buy a K702 to save the hassle and be sure you've just got a new one with zero hours on it (in relation to headband elastic too).

If you're sensible you'll buy the HD560s though......but if you really really value soundstage then get the K702 as you are now aware of all the drawbacks & unreliabilities of the K702 that I have explained to you in this thread & others. I actually really like the K702 with the right EQ, and because of that soundstage too, but you know the drawbacks - I've explained them to you.

 

[ThomsBrown92]

If you want the K702 then buy it used or new - if you buy it used then understand that you'll probably have to replace the earpads (my aftermarket pad link recommendation). I'd be inclined to buy it new if you're gonna buy a K702 to save the hassle and be sure you've just got a new one with zero hours on it (in relation to headband elastic too).

If you're sensible you'll buy the HD560s though......but if you really really value soundstage then get the K702 as you are now aware of all the drawbacks & unreliabilities of the K702 that I have explained to you in this thread & others. I actually really like the K702 with the right EQ, and because of that soundstage too, but you know the drawbacks - I've explained them to you.

if the danger is to change the bearing, I would take the used ones but less, (80 €) I hope that here 20 € as per Amazon description is worth it, as it says that the headphones have been used very little.

 

[Blorg]

@ThomsBrown92 The Edition XS fits your budget and has excellent soundstage. It comes 3rd on Rtings soundstage measurements, if you believe in them, under the HD800S (1) and Ananda (2) and ahead of the Arya (4), I have all of them and that's how I'd order them for soundstage as well, presuming the Arya is the Stealth version which does reportedly have less soundstage than the V2. It's a fantastic headphone in every other regard as well.

If you have bought the K702 already, I haven't heard it but it looks decent as well. It's a LOT cheaper as well, €139 new now from Thomann. It was more than that at launch but much reduced now. It also does very well on the Rtings soundstage ranking. I might be a little concerned about the 2-3kHz elevation and the Edition XS has better bass extension. But it's more money too. K702 looks great, it's a classic look.

 

[Robbo99999]

if the danger is to change the bearing, I would take the used ones but less, (80 €) I hope that here 20 € as per Amazon description is worth it, as it says that the headphones have been used very little.

Have you not bought the K702 yet then? You were going to buy it two weeks ago?