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Have you found sales clerks at high-end stereo stores to be rude?

anmpr1

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Sometimes yes. I recall one dealer in Helsinki, who got upset, when I asked him to describe what ’musicality’ means in terms of audio.
LOL. A great answer to you would have been for him to walk over to the back room and bring out a violin. Start playing something. I wonder how many of these high-enders are musicians, or attend live events?

I know that Mark "I never met a preamp that was too expensive" Levinson was a musician. But I don't think he designed anything. Maybe the knobs and panels. He was more a marketeer. Like Harvey Rosenberg who took over Julius Futterman's work. His engineer, George Kaye, was a jazz musician. Whether being a musician is helpful to audio design, I don't know. In terms of 'musicality' you'd think it would be what they are talking about.
 

watchnerd

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LOL. A great answer to you would have been for him to walk over to the back room and bring out a violin. Start playing something. I wonder how many of these high-enders are musicians, or attend live events?

I know that Mark "I never met a preamp that was too expensive" Levinson was a musician. But I don't think he designed anything. Maybe the knobs and panels. He was more a marketeer. Like Harvey Rosenberg who took over Julius Futterman's work. His engineer, George Kaye, was a jazz musician. Whether being a musician is helpful to audio design, I don't know. In terms of 'musicality' you'd think it would be what they are talking about.

I'm not a professional musician, but I play bass as a hobby and do gigs every once in a while.

"Musical", as used by audiophiles, usually seems to mean some kind of mild softening of transients, a little bit of dynamic compression...like late-night easy listening attributes.

Which is pretty much the antithesis of real life music, with its wide dynamic ranges and sharp transients.
 

Kal Rubinson

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Sometimes yes. I recall one dealer in Helsinki, who got upset, when I asked him to describe what ’musicality’ means in terms of audio.
I don't blame him. It is a purely audiophile conception. :facepalm:
 

anmpr1

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"Musical", as used by audiophiles, usually seems to mean some kind of mild softening of transients, a little bit of dynamic compression...like late-night easy listening attributes. Which is pretty much the antithesis of real life music, with its wide dynamic ranges and sharp transients.
I remember playing a recording of a violin to an 'audiophile'. The listener said, "Man, those high notes sound 'steely'. Your speakers sure sound 'aggressive.' I replied, "Steely? Could be. By the way, any idea what an E string is made of?"
 

watchnerd

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I remember playing a recording of a violin to an 'audiophile'. The listener said, "Man, those high notes sound 'steely'. Your speakers sure sound 'aggressive.' I replied, "Steely? Could be. By the way, any idea what an E string is made of?"

If your system is good enough at being steely (high resolution), you can tell the difference between the chrome steel, carbon steel, and stainless steel strings.

;)
 

JJB70

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It reminds me of some mad person who was selling homeopathic snake oil who when pushed to explain what she was selling came out with this gem "it's like electricity, nobody knows how it works, it just does".
 
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Blake Klondike

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I remember from many years ago a very polite and earnest young department store sales guy doing a great job explaining the superiority of VHS over Betamax.

Problem is that he had his wires crossed and was attributing the Betamax characteristics to the VHS product. :rolleyes:
that sounds like a betamax ad
I find really good salespeople adjust their sales pitch to the audience (such as avoiding the sillier BS if they clock a customer has some knowledge), are willing to look after customers they see as a good long term repeat cash cow and they make anyone feel comfortable. A sale should be a mutually beneficial exchange, the shop makes their profit, the customer gets something they like but sadly some salespeople do their best to make it difficult.

The other thing the salespeople said to me was "We always give even beginning listeners with small budgets 100% attention, because circumstances change over time and today's beginner with a small budget is tomorrow's experienced buyer with a bigger budget!" It occurs to me that spending what money you can in the shops you visit-- even if it is just for banana plugs, RCA cables or a turntable mat-- would probably go along way towards ameliorating this problem.
 
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Blake Klondike

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Sometimes yes. I recall one dealer in Helsinki, who got upset, when I asked him to describe what ’musicality’ means in terms of audio.

That is a very good point-- as someone with a recording background, when a salesperson tells me that speakers are designed to bring female vocals to the front of the mix, my immediate thought is "The designer must be boosting or cutting certain frequencies, then-- what is that going to do to the rest of my music that isn't a Rickie Lee Jones tune?" But I would be not be surprised if a question like that were received with irritation!
 

RayDunzl

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It occurs to me that spending what money you can in the shops you visit-- even if it is just for banana plugs, RCA cables or a turntable mat-- would probably go along way towards ameliorating this problem.


"Why, yes sir! We have a nice selection from which you may choose!"

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