All true, but that's kind of orthogonal to what ASR is about. Amir reviews tube amps, true, but with an eye to objective excellence. If you desire special effects, fine, but it's not what we do here.
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Has the objective of ASR been reached?
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Multicore
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I think that if you want to listen to music with non-linear distortions, coloration, compression etc. then it makes sense to use digital effects to do that so that you are in control and can dial in the effects you want for the specific music and listening context. It's standard practice in music production and performance these days so I don't see why not in playback.
From an engineering standpoint that's inarguable. But obviously people enjoy their tube amps for what they are.
mhardy6647
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computer-audiophile
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I would not overestimate the importance of ASR. There were already enough hi-fi fans interested in technical data in the past. (You can count me in)
I rather see the trend that marketing nowadays focuses on other aspects when it comes to the USP of audio products. ASR also only covers a rather small product spectrum, in my opinion.
BTW: People who are on a mission are rather suspect to me.
I rather see the trend that marketing nowadays focuses on other aspects when it comes to the USP of audio products. ASR also only covers a rather small product spectrum, in my opinion.
BTW: People who are on a mission are rather suspect to me.
raif71
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exactly
It's hard to judge one way or another. Certainly there has been a significant amount of animus directed here from other forums, and certain manufacturers deeply regret ASR's existence.
We need a stirring ASR anthem! Onward Amir's soldiers...
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DSJR
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I agree the MUSIC is the subjective thing and each of us has our own taste, but I'm too damned old and been through the subjective mill before it spat me out, to ever return to 'just' trusting my ears, which are shot to pieces now due to meds and older age (not prolonged Led Zeppelin played too loud as I like to jest). Speakers in rooms yes definitely listen and compare, but the gear to me now should be as benign as possible and fortunately, that usually means not having to spend loads, especially when there's a sea of good used gear out there currently.I would lke to say that I'm on the middle ground as far as being objective and subjective. ASR site is very valuable to me and to others as well but like I said music listening is very subjective. As far as saying quality of sound correspond to high price tag, I believe this is just perception and generalization. Personally I would not buy anything that is beyond what I'm wlling to pay and if I did and it sounds rubbish then I've got a few things to say... As it is, I'm generally happy with my purchases. The recommendation from this site is very valuable for my shelling out money on audio gears.
mhardy6647
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OK, OK.
1. I amnot very good terrible at manipulating images.
2. This is just meant humorously.
3. If it's too soon to invoke this image, I apologize!!!!
1. I am
2. This is just meant humorously.
3. If it's too soon to invoke this image, I apologize!!!!
I'd say this will lead to merciless attacks, but I'm not sure we could have more trolls.OK, OK.
1. I amnot very goodterrible at manipulating images.
2. This is just meant humorously.
3. If it's too soon to invoke this image, I apologize!!!!
View attachment 275199
mhardy6647
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well... different trolls. Upon reflection, that might be an improvement... (?)
Ask, and ye shall receive
As I point out to my subjectivist friends, that, of course, the ear is the final arbiter, but there is so little hard data available to consumers, that this site, as are some others, is invaluable.
When we compare products, though we can't do it blind, they are at least at equal volume. The results are usually a surprise to them- often no conclusive difference- but not to me.
When we compare products, though we can't do it blind, they are at least at equal volume. The results are usually a surprise to them- often no conclusive difference- but not to me.
D
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Has the objective of ASR been reached?
Well-->
No.
If I were to explain the position of ASR to a friend, I would simply say pay attention to the SysOps comments and the information HE provides.
I have seen many more test performed by other members and the data is very compelling. I have alway been of the opinion a person's personal
preference never deserves a tongue lashing by anyone not having to pay for their selection. I admire the APPROACH of many here who have
explained their position but not at the expense of the patrons who may have a different opinion. EX: Digital vs Analog. Streaming vs LP, etc.
When anyone make a blanket statement like anything is inarguable, I instantly take offence.
Education is not a WAR. If people don't welcome the newcomer and embrace THEM vs their ideas, it is a lost cause. You cannot learn from
ones injured pride if that is the source of the conversation. I have never denied science but alway question the method.
Basic science has alway been my main goal in life. As a retired mechanic they went hand in hand my whole career.
CANI. Continual And Never-ending Improvement. The actual true definition of Basic Science and a MECHANIC.
Your mind sharpens EVEN as the body fails. I'm there!
Simple is better. My words will always be easy to understand and not at the expense of others with more or less formal education.
The KEY to ASRs mission is to never battle, draw lines, proclaim victory, shame the world, BUT listen and with a gentle hand provide the
information. The cost of an item doesn't make it better, but the lack of cost sure can.
How long will a company survive with the least expensive product on the market? Not the cheapest.
Kind words were the FIRST things I notice here. To be honest they were the LAST thing inforced at other sites. You treat people (AND COMPANIES)
the way you want to be treated. Turnabout is NOT fair play. If people continue to be arrogant about being right, it will do one thing, encourage
a$$holes to prove you wrong.
Listening to music can be fun, debating whether a person heard something vs measured something is only in question when the question is
"HOW DOES IT SOUND" vs "HOW DOES IT MEASURE".
Do you like what you hear? STOP you've accomplished YOUR goal unless making other people feel like $hit is your purpose in life.
I'm here to enjoy what is left, not screw it up because someone else thinks it's a WAR. Music calms the savage beast, turn it up fellas!!
With great regard.
I have seen many more test performed by other members and the data is very compelling. I have alway been of the opinion a person's personal
preference never deserves a tongue lashing by anyone not having to pay for their selection. I admire the APPROACH of many here who have
explained their position but not at the expense of the patrons who may have a different opinion. EX: Digital vs Analog. Streaming vs LP, etc.
When anyone make a blanket statement like anything is inarguable, I instantly take offence.
Education is not a WAR. If people don't welcome the newcomer and embrace THEM vs their ideas, it is a lost cause. You cannot learn from
ones injured pride if that is the source of the conversation. I have never denied science but alway question the method.
Basic science has alway been my main goal in life. As a retired mechanic they went hand in hand my whole career.
CANI. Continual And Never-ending Improvement. The actual true definition of Basic Science and a MECHANIC.
Your mind sharpens EVEN as the body fails. I'm there!
Simple is better. My words will always be easy to understand and not at the expense of others with more or less formal education.
The KEY to ASRs mission is to never battle, draw lines, proclaim victory, shame the world, BUT listen and with a gentle hand provide the
information. The cost of an item doesn't make it better, but the lack of cost sure can.
How long will a company survive with the least expensive product on the market? Not the cheapest.
Kind words were the FIRST things I notice here. To be honest they were the LAST thing inforced at other sites. You treat people (AND COMPANIES)
the way you want to be treated. Turnabout is NOT fair play. If people continue to be arrogant about being right, it will do one thing, encourage
a$$holes to prove you wrong.
Listening to music can be fun, debating whether a person heard something vs measured something is only in question when the question is
"HOW DOES IT SOUND" vs "HOW DOES IT MEASURE".
Do you like what you hear? STOP you've accomplished YOUR goal unless making other people feel like $hit is your purpose in life.
I'm here to enjoy what is left, not screw it up because someone else thinks it's a WAR. Music calms the savage beast, turn it up fellas!!
With great regard.
ASR is, at least, another available voice in component reviews. At most, it is measurement-based reviews to traceable standards.
How a reader weighs ASR against an eloquent subjective reviewer is best left to the reader. But the value of traceable measurements cannot be ignored.
Just because the greater masses utter unsupported babble, we shouldn't let that outshout and obscure the truth.
How a reader weighs ASR against an eloquent subjective reviewer is best left to the reader. But the value of traceable measurements cannot be ignored.
Just because the greater masses utter unsupported babble, we shouldn't let that outshout and obscure the truth.
One could call it a war against ignorance!
I totally agree with this. "you catch more flies with honey than vinegar". And, if the "scientists" of the audiophile world are seen to be closed-minded, then the subjectivists will feel justified in ignoring them. Even if people come in here spouting old, dumb ideas, (the "more crispy sound" thread for a recent example) they still need an explanation that makes sense to them, not dismissal or derision.
I think this is why ASR needs a FAQ. Right now many of the regular posters are tired of answering the same silly questions over and over, so they end up being a bit rude to newbies, who are often hard to tell apart from trolls. With a good FAQ, we can send newbs and trolls alike to the FAQ without needing to worry about it.
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