Guide: Computer Active XO, 2ch+ and EQ/DSP (Mac & PC systemwide)

[wacomme]

What do you think of Dirac? Same, but easier to use, or better?

 

[DWPress]

I've got to admit, after doing it manually with REW and rePhase for so many years, that Dirac does do some magic helping to clean up room nodes and adding some clarity to the mids. Still not sure if I'll end up purchasing.

 

[wacomme]

I'm now set up with my Adam T5V speakers, EQ'd with REW and Hang Loose Convolver (HLC), with assistance from BlackHole 2Ch and AudioPluginHost for systemwide access to HLC. I'm loving the sound, especially compared to my old AudioEngine A2 speakers. In the process I discovered I have a R channel problem with my SMSL DO100 dac. A replacement dac arrives today.

However, my measured speaker frequency response dips in the lower frequencies, as expected. The base with EQ is still quite good, but I'm wanting to know if I can arrive at a relatively flat frequency response over the entire spectrum with a subwoofer? I'd like to do this for minimal money - thinking about a $100 sub and some type of device/connection to DSP the speakers and sub together. I'd like to be able to do the DSP via REW (free) and use HLC for the EQ - if possible. I really don't want to go the route of Dirac or miniDSP - mostly because I don't want to spend the money, but also as a challenge to see if I can get a flatline response using other means, albeit more legwork. Is this feasible? If so, what do I need? Could I return my DO100 replacement for a Motu M4? The Motu isn't a good of a dac as the DO100, but I'm not sure if I'd hear any difference. Is there a better solution than the Motu M4?

 

[DWPress]

A small sub won't get you there for 20-20kHz, most subs under 12" won't even get you to 30Hz without room gain or having a port. I've only ever integrated my subs using a multichannel DAC but many subs will take a line/speaker level input and perform the XO so that's a possibility if you're going to invest more money in a sub anyway. For Mac and a MC DAC I think the Motu gear is pretty good for the money and, no, you won't notice the difference with the Adams. The miniDSP 2x4 device would also work really well for your application and it's pretty cheap.

 

[wacomme]

A small sub won't get you there for 20-20kHz, most subs under 12" won't even get you to 30Hz without room gain or having a port. I've only ever integrated my subs using a multichannel DAC but many subs will take a line/speaker level input and perform the XO so that's a possibility if you're going to invest more money in a sub anyway. For Mac and a MC DAC I think the Motu gear is pretty good for the money and, no, you won't notice the difference with the Adams. The miniDSP 2x4 device would also work really well for your application and it's pretty cheap.

Thanks for dashing my hopes and dreams -

If I won't notice any sound improvement with a sub + my Adam monitors, then it's not worth the effort. That's fine. I'll just enjoy the music.

 

[DWPress]

Well, the Adams only go down so far. 30Hz is quite an improvement over 50Hz. You've only had them a couple days, see what you can do with the tools you have and it's something you can revisit down the road if you feel you sound is lacking LF impact.

 

[phoenixdogfan]

If nothing else, not having to deal with the agony of Windows driver management will be worth the switch. If you have any questions getting your new system rolling I'm happy to help. What kind of system are you going to manage?

A couple days ago I started a Dirac trial. I host it in the chain within SoundSource and then send the signal to the Hang Loose Convolver for the XO. Quite nice and simple.

My system consists of 4 four LS 50's (Meta in Front and OG's as surrounds), two SVS SB 2000 subs, a Kef HTS 3001 Center, the Octo 8, a Purifi Eigentact for L-R, and a couple of lesser quality amps (Aiyima A07, Behringer A500) for center and surrounds. I use JRiver for surround management and eq, Dephonica for a crossover to the subs (and I don't care about latency) when I run in stereo mode, equalizer APO to remove the windows processing objects, and Dirac live for room and speaker correction for all five channels.

 

[wacomme]

Well, the Adams only go down so far. 30Hz is quite an improvement over 50Hz. You've only had them a couple days, see what you can do with the tools you have and it's something you can revisit down the road if you feel you sound is lacking LF impact.

It's all fine. I'm loving the sound compared to the A2's. With my replacement dac - same R channel cutoff issues - I was able to circumvent the cutoff (turn the dac off and back on for each measurement) and update the EQ. I'm also now using FIR filters (vs IIR) using Hang Loose Convolver within a system-wide app using AudioPluginHost. The sound is getting better and better. The measurements today were super precise - speakers equal distance from my ears, monitor output volume matched, multiple measurements each channel and averaged, etc. I'm happy with the results. Though, I don't know what to make of the R channel issue. It seems to be type of protective cutoff - though only on the R channel. When doing a second REW measurement without turning the dac off and back on, I get a sudden audible snap in the sound 2/3 of the way through the measurement, resulting in a pronounced frequency drop around 5kHz. Both dacs do this identically. Also, when sending full range pink noise to the R channel via REW, I get about a second of sound and then nothing. Only when I turn off and back on the dac can I repeat that second of sound. The L channel does not have this problem. It plays the pink noise just fine.

 

[DWPress]

Just a bump to the thread. I did a major edit today to reflect my current usage, clarify things (hopefully) and introduce the use of @mitchco's new Hang Loose Convolver in the signal chain. Working better than ever and since I originally created this thread a few more multi channel home stereo oriented DACS have appeared on the scene.

 

[Music1969]

Hi @mitchco does HLC work as a standalone app on Linux?

And convolves system wide audio? Or needs another program/s to achieve this?

 

[dualazmak]

Just for your possible interest and reference,,,

As a follow-up of my post #6 on this thread, in my post here I shared my latest system setup as of August 3 2023 of my DSP-based multichannel multi-SP-driver multi-amplifier fully active audio project.

 

[DWPress]

HLC work as a standalone app on Linux?

And convolves system wide audio? Or needs another program/s to achieve this?

On Mitch's web site it say fully compatible with Ubuntu 20.04.5 LTS or later. The HLC standalone app is implemented through a standard JUCE template so if other JUCE based plugins or apps work in your environment HLC should as well. Mitch has nailed it for Mac so I would imagine his implementation in Linux to be good as well. Best to get confirmation from Mitch though, or just try the free 14 day trial.

I use the HLC app to host several other plugins in addition to the HLC plugin (even Dirac occasionally) in the signal chain and it looks and performs similarly to Element which I believe is also based on the JUCE framework.

HLC is merely the host for convolution filters though, they need to be created elsewhere like REW, rePhase, Audiolense, Accurate, etc.

What dualazmak continually advocates for is a completely different process though with similar results and is very peculiar to his tastes. I am using FIR convolution filters and his process with EKIO uses IIR filters. Both are DSP and have their advantages and disadvantages but FIR filters are more commonly used even if they are merely exported IIR filters into a .wav format.

 

[Music1969]

Mitch has nailed it for Mac so I would imagine his implementation in Linux to be good as well.

Yes but with macOS you use something like Blackhole for a virtual driver.

On Linux (Ubuntu Desktop) I don't know how to do the equivalent

Unless HLC presents as a Virtual Driver? Now that would be cool

Will wait for @mitchco to point me in the right direction

 

[DWPress]

Will wait for @mitchco to point me in the right direction

Just download the free trial, the HLC app part is separate from the convolver plugin so shouldn't even activate the 14 day countdown.

There are ways to create a virtual sound card in Alsa which does the same thing as Blackhole but I've been away from Ubuntu for awhile so not sure which way is currently the best.