• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

GR Research

Dennis Murphy

Major Contributor
Technical Expert
Joined
Mar 17, 2020
Messages
1,071
Likes
4,535
So was helping another member with his speaker search and found he had built one of Danny's speakers. The member does not seem to have them any longer but was looking for alternatives. When I built the X-LS Encore for Amir to review, had mentioned how quickly it went up in price with upgrades. As I mentioned earlier, GR is having supply issues and cannot ship Encores right now. Since I built them, GR has also started to offer cabinets. But a pair of unfinished cabinets almost doubles the price of the base kit!

Saw someone mention that Philharmonic Audio has their Affordable Accuracy Monitor back in stock, so I checked it out. It is under $400 shipped with a finished cabinet and no soldering! It also appears to include some damping material (@Dennis Murphy to confirm). That was another expensive adder for the X-LS Encore.

Once you add in GR's damping material, the Encore price is close to $600 BEFORE shipping. :eek:
Just saw this. I've always had cordial relations with Danny and have enjoyed our visits at audio shows. But for the record, the AA Quick Kit sells for $325/pair with finished cabinets, factory wired boards and Eco-Core damping material. No upgrades are suggested or offered.
 

beagleman

Major Contributor
Joined
Sep 24, 2020
Messages
1,161
Likes
1,583
Location
Pittsburgh Pa
The charlatans can do whatever they want. What we don't want happen is the misinformation about audio which they spread to become so broad as to be accepted as facts. Danny is charismatic on camera so gets a lot of people watching him. To the extent he goes on that medium and says a blind test is trivial to pass for cables, and that measurements are not needed, then we get to voice our opinion otherwise. And unlike him, do it with data. So yes, we are needed.


Danny reminds me of the older "used car sales man".

Every big car lot has one.
Not the young guys that run up on you, or the middle aged guys that cling to you for their weekly profit,.

But the one guy that just hangs out, seems friendly, does not force anything, nor keep asking you to buy, but he simply is able to always get you to buy the "Undercoating" and the "Pinstripes", based on simply being affable and not too annoying, and he seems to genuinely care that you get the car you want.
 

beagleman

Major Contributor
Joined
Sep 24, 2020
Messages
1,161
Likes
1,583
Location
Pittsburgh Pa
Just saw this. I've always had cordial relations with Danny and have enjoyed our visits at audio shows. But for the record, the AA Quick Kit sells for $325/pair with finished cabinets, factory wired boards and Eco-Core damping material. No upgrades are suggested or offered.
I have to agree mostly. He really is a nice guy, and is not putting on a fake personality or anything.

I think where some have issues, is he is skirting the line of a true genuine DIY guy versus the botique caps/cables stuff.

But at the same time, years ago I sold more than my share of Bose and Monster Cable, and a few other brands based on knowing my commission, not on what I truly thought was the best performance or value.
 

audio2design

Major Contributor
Joined
Nov 29, 2020
Messages
1,769
Likes
1,830
I'm generally NOT supporting Danny, but if he is a two man shop and totally swamped with existing orders, meaning hundreds are waiting to go out, you don't stop and fool around testing stuff. He is way beyond a bit busy! Customers want product in a timely fashion and he is 3 at least months out now. He has put out a call for more help. You guys bang on him even when he does what you want, hire more people. I don't even agree with his upgrades and I'm defending him because of the lame smack talk people say because they think they know what is going on.
Now stop making me be the voice of reason! I don't like the position, I'm retired so I can be that crazy old coot voice more often......

If he stuck to speakers, something he knows at least something about, then he would not get himself into this situation. I even defended him once on a speaker thread, but not completely as he was pushing changes in run-in too much without looking at the system effects. I gave him the benefit of the doubt though. However, when he starts making cable videos that show he has no idea what he is talking about, ditto for some rambling on other topics, then you should be prepared for the backlash. He is doing it for self promotion, to make himself look good and sell more stuff. Once you do that, you are responsible for your actions.
 

Steve Dallas

Major Contributor
Joined
May 28, 2020
Messages
1,201
Likes
2,784
Location
A Whole Other Country

Spkrdctr

Major Contributor
Joined
Apr 22, 2021
Messages
2,212
Likes
2,934
Are you saying it's not worth his time to prove to all of his detractors he's not bullshitting? I mean think about it, if you made a business selling something then this would likely be priority number one for you. This thread would be very different if he can do what he claims.


The problem is once everyone's been swindled you'll find them perpetuating the myth which swindled them in the fist place.


How could you not believe in cables? I tried to use a speaker without cables once. I couldn't get any sound on it. Then after I got my engineering degree I finally realised my mistake.
That degree paid off!
 

Spkrdctr

Major Contributor
Joined
Apr 22, 2021
Messages
2,212
Likes
2,934
If he stuck to speakers, something he knows at least something about, then he would not get himself into this situation. I even defended him once on a speaker thread, but not completely as he was pushing changes in run-in too much without looking at the system effects. I gave him the benefit of the doubt though. However, when he starts making cable videos that show he has no idea what he is talking about, ditto for some rambling on other topics, then you should be prepared for the backlash. He is doing it for self promotion, to make himself look good and sell more stuff. Once you do that, you are responsible for your actions.
This has gone sideways! I only defended him on not taking the time to do a blind test. Now it has morphed into I'm defending his entire business. You guys just STOPPIT! I am the most rabid foaming at the mouth anti-snake oil person on ASR bar none. You are all arguing with the guy who agrees with you more than anyone else on this site. I'm dumbfounded. My words have been twisted beyond all reason and sanity. I'm out of the discussion about Danny.
 

Rick Sykora

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 14, 2020
Messages
3,520
Likes
7,033
Location
Stow, Ohio USA
This has gone sideways! I only defended him on not taking the time to do a blind test. Now it has morphed into I'm defending his entire business. You guys just STOPPIT! I am the most rabid foaming at the mouth anti-snake oil person on ASR bar none. You are all arguing with the guy who agrees with you more than anyone else on this site. I'm dumbfounded. My words have been twisted beyond all reason and sanity. I'm out of the discussion about Danny.

Well this is clearly more fun than a simple clarification or retraction. ;)

Thanks!
 

chorus

Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2020
Messages
41
Likes
37
Danny is in business to make money. This is a good thing because without it Danny's services would disappear.

He is quite busy selling XO upgrades and does not need to do blind tests. Or will you be footing the bill?
If he promised one then changed his mind after further consideration so be it. Do one for you and where does it stop?

If he sees a big improvement to a graph he knows it has to sound better. If he offers an upgrade to a speaker you own then
feel very fortunate the work is done and buy the parts. He should double his prices.

He has been doing this for many years. If you have been as well then I may listen to your comments.

He sells power cords and speaker cables because many people do think they help and are overpaying
some other company. He has a right to a share of that business as well. If you think lamp cord is good enough
then you will not be buying from him.

People wake up and smell the coffee.
 

Chrispy

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 7, 2020
Messages
7,757
Likes
5,918
Location
PNW
Danny is in business to make money. This is a good thing because without it Danny's services would disappear.

He is quite busy selling XO upgrades and does not need to do blind tests. Or will you be footing the bill?
If he promised one then changed his mind after further consideration so be it. Do one for you and where does it stop?

If he sees a big improvement to a graph he knows it has to sound better. If he offers an upgrade to a speaker you own then
feel very fortunate the work is done and buy the parts. He should double his prices.

He has been doing this for many years. If you have been as well then I may listen to your comments.

He sells power cords and speaker cables because many people do think they help and are overpaying
some other company. He has a right to a share of that business as well. If you think lamp cord is good enough
then you will not be buying from him.

People wake up and smell the coffee.
I still just smell bullshit. LOL if you think lamp cord is good enough.....that's a good one, never heard that before!
 
D

Deleted member 21219

Guest
People wake up and smell the coffee.

I believe I smell something, but it's not coffee.

Danny is in business to make money. This is a good thing because without it Danny's services would disappear.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

He is quite busy selling XO upgrades and does not need to do blind tests

That's similar to a company selling cam upgrades and saying they don't need to do dyno tests. Every electrical or mechanical piece of merchandise for sale is subject to testing to verify its efficacy. For audio equipment upgrades, whether circuit or transducer, that's a blind test. That test is not only for HIM, but also for US, who may be interested in buying from him.


Or will you be footing the bill?

Manufacturers are responsible for the financial burden of testing.

If he promised one then changed his mind after further consideration so be it.

Since he offered the test, it would have been civil of him to notify parties concerned that he had changed his mind.

Do one for you and where does it stop?

Hopefully, it never stops. That's the nature of improvement; it literally never ends.

If he sees a big improvement to a graph he knows it has to sound better.

Appeal to authority. Bogus.

He should double his prices.

Prices are subject to the forces of the market. I believe that there is a reason his prices have not doubled. He might even have a sale soon.

He has been doing this for many years. If you have been as well then I may listen to your comments.

Many people in the less-savory walks of life have been doing what they do for many years. Spending years at something does not in and of itself signify legitimacy.

He sells power cords and speaker cables because many people do think they help and are overpaying
some other company. He has a right to a share of that business as well.

Your logic is faulty. The same comment could be made about someone who promotes seances.

He's in a business. He advertises to customers. Every customer or potential customer has the right to question the legitimacy of his claims just as they have the right to question the legitimacy of some other business's claims. Jim
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Killingbeans

Major Contributor
Joined
Oct 23, 2018
Messages
4,089
Likes
7,552
Location
Bjerringbro, Denmark.
He sells power cords and speaker cables because many people do think they help and are overpaying
some other company. He has a right to a share of that business as well.

As in: "It's okay to sell placebo products, because placebo works just as well as the real thing." Sure, but then the decent thing would be to acknowledge that you're in the sugar pill business. I wouldn't mind as long as a spade is being called a spade.
 

Spkrdctr

Major Contributor
Joined
Apr 22, 2021
Messages
2,212
Likes
2,934
Careful not to step in it. 3 posts from our "expert" there :)
I approve of lamp chord for speaker wires. Gets the job done, even if the "look" is not pretty! But then I live in a one bedroom apartment. Nothing looks all that good in a tiny sardine can.........
 

audio2design

Major Contributor
Joined
Nov 29, 2020
Messages
1,769
Likes
1,830
I approve of lamp chord for speaker wires. Gets the job done, even if the "look" is not pretty! But then I live in a one bedroom apartment. Nothing looks all that good in a tiny sardine can.........

These tools are about $20 on Amazon. You can make yourself some nice custom "sweaters" for that lamp cord:

 

honjr

Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2021
Messages
19
Likes
8
His guideline is to buy what he sells. LOL.
Yes - he seems to be somewhat like a music theorist telling a composer how to compose - “you must follow the following rules” - without regard to whether or not the result is good music. Just because the new components cost more or have higher quality does not necessarily mean they translate to better sound. What qualifications, aside from some capacity to measure frequency responses etc., as a music listener does he have to discern a musical vs non-musical speaker or upgrade?
 

Rick Sykora

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 14, 2020
Messages
3,520
Likes
7,033
Location
Stow, Ohio USA
Just saw this. I've always had cordial relations with Danny and have enjoyed our visits at audio shows. But for the record, the AA Quick Kit sells for $325/pair with finished cabinets, factory wired boards and Eco-Core damping material. No upgrades are suggested or offered.

Thanks Dennis!

Have not met him, but my discourse with Danny has always been cordial. Unfortunately, he just tends to overpromise and not just once, but multiple times. I think he does some good but am not clear of his intentions. If I am going to spend my hard-earned money, I want it to be with a business that meets its commitments. When it cannot, it should at least offer rationale. GR falls considerably shy in my experience in this regard.

Thank you for commitment to delivering value in the audio market and being forthcoming in your interactions. :)
 
Last edited:

beagleman

Major Contributor
Joined
Sep 24, 2020
Messages
1,161
Likes
1,583
Location
Pittsburgh Pa
Danny is in business to make money. This is a good thing because without it Danny's services would disappear.

He is quite busy selling XO upgrades and does not need to do blind tests. Or will you be footing the bill?
If he promised one then changed his mind after further consideration so be it. Do one for you and where does it stop?

If he sees a big improvement to a graph he knows it has to sound better. If he offers an upgrade to a speaker you own then
feel very fortunate the work is done and buy the parts. He should double his prices.

He has been doing this for many years.
If you have been as well then I may listen to your comments.

He sells power cords and speaker cables because many people do think they help and are overpaying
some other company. He has a right to a share of that business as well. If you think lamp cord is good enough
then you will not be buying from him.

People wake up and smell the coffee.
Danny, is this you??
 
Top Bottom