GR-Research "Little Giant Killer 2.0"

[D!sco]

I think small wideband speakers may have potential in the nearfield and with DSPing. You have to wonder why there are no comercial solutions like it.
Just add a tweeter and it works fine.

Sure works for Logitech

 

[peanuts]

claiming that a minidsp "will suck the life out of the music" is ridiculous. i own several minidsp`s and they do nothing of that sort if you set it right.
also in my opinion any speaker consisting of a single driver sounds like crap to me. i guess the beaming and high-end distortion wont be that noticable with a 3" driver. but it will produce minimal bass and not go loud.
but sure its compact if you want it on your desk or something. if not i would rather go with one of his 2-way designs.

 

[mhardy6647]

Just add a tweeter and it works fine.

Well, I guess that may depend on one's definition of commercial.

'cause one may purchase things like this:

Orca 3" Wide-Band Speakers Shop— BLUMENSTEIN AUDIO

Birch Plywood : 6-8 weeks. Slightly warm yet extremely detailed Perfectly balanced for home audio. Our best selling speaker for almost 20 years In 2022, Fostex released a new version of their classic 3” driver that sounds significantly better than the older version (with the white dots o

www.blumensteinaudio.com

or this:

Fostex P800E DIY Kanspea 3" Full Range Speaker Kit - PAIR: Madisound Speaker Components, Inc.

Fostex 3" Full Range Speaker Kit Pair. Complete kit with pre-assembled cabinets.

www.madisoundspeakerstore.com

(or the 4 inch morph)

Fostex P1000E DIY Kanspea 4" Full Range Speaker Kit - PAIR: Madisound Speaker Components, Inc.

Fostex 4" Full Range Speaker Kit Pair. Complete kit with pre-assembled cabinets.

www.madisoundspeakerstore.com

In either case, just add DSP -- if one wishes.
Not sure adding a tweeter to the FE83 or the FE103 would be a good idea, though.

 

[jhaider]

So, do MiniDSPs really suck the life out of the music?

No, but they cut the grease off the conman.

This is the fellow who sells cheap Indian-made copper tubing as magic speaker connectors for $60/pr. What do you expect?

 

[amirm]

FYI I asked them for a sample. Response was that no one needs measurements since they already have made it. And that if I was willing to listen to them and my testing system was up to par, they would consider it. I wrote back:

-----------
Thank you for the response Danny. Your measurements are gated so lack resolution in lower frequencies. And at any rate, are not compliant with CEA-2034 which allows research into audibility of measurements to be applied to them. You also have not shown any distortion measurements. These are the reasons members are looking for me to measure them.

As to listening to them, I always do that. My system for testing desktop speakers is RME ADI-2 DAC driving Purifi based amplifier. These are world-class products. If they are to be tested as stand-alone speakers in a 2-channel system, then I use a Mark Levinson Reference amplifier ($20,000) driven by Matrix Audio streamer ($2,000). Is there a specific requirement you have here that owners need to have to buy them?

-------------
I received a long, hostile and rude response back from Danny saying no one needs my measurements. And that my listening tests are a joke in his eyes and his customers (referring to testing I did for his other speaker I reviewed which I actually recommended). That cabling, room setup, etc. all matter as to whether I have good enough setup to listen to his speakers. I guess I am not qualified in that department to listen to small speakers with 3 inch woofer.

The only thing was offered was for me to go to Austin, eat BBQ and listen to his system.

Meanwhile I received unprompted a super courteous email from the CEO of a top brand of studio monitors saying how much they like my reviews and like to send me samples to test. What a difference.

 

[Prana Ferox]

I'm pretty sure the MiniDSP is fine as long as you don't load the "Suck the Life Out Of Your Music" plugin

 

[Madjalapeno]

I'm pretty sure the MiniDSP is fine as long as you don't load the "Suck the Life Out Of Your Music" plugin

Was that the one @amirm got frustrated trying to download from their website?

 

[MattHooper]

FYI I asked them for a sample. Response was that no one needs measurements since they already have made it. And that if I was willing to listen to them and my testing system was up to par, they would consider it. I wrote back:

-----------
Thank you for the response Danny. Your measurements are gated so lack resolution in lower frequencies. And at any rate, are not compliant with CEA-2034 which allows research into audibility of measurements to be applied to them. You also have not shown any distortion measurements. These are the reasons members are looking for me to measure them.

As to listening to them, I always do that. My system for testing desktop speakers is RME ADI-2 DAC driving Purifi based amplifier. These are world-class products. If they are to be tested as stand-alone speakers in a 2-channel system, then I use a Mark Levinson Reference amplifier ($20,000) driven by Matrix Audio streamer ($2,000). Is there a specific requirement you have here that owners need to have to buy them?

-------------
I received a long, hostile and rude response back from Danny saying no one needs my measurements. And that my listening tests are a joke in his eyes and his customers (referring to testing I did for his other speaker I reviewed which I actually recommended). That cabling, room setup, etc. all matter as to whether I have good enough setup to listen to his speakers. I guess I am not qualified in that department to listen to small speakers with 3 inch woofer.

The only thing was offered was for me to go to Austin, eat BBQ and listen to his system.

Meanwhile I received unprompted a super courteous email from the CEO of a top brand of studio monitors saying how much they like my reviews and like to send me samples to test. What a difference.

Yeah, that falls in line with what I've read of Danny. He's had a similar evasive response to Audioholics.

Danny may certainly have some level of useful speaker design knowledge. But his stuff always came off as "fishy" to me and self-interested to the extreme, always finding something wrong with a speaker so he could "fix it" and pimp his own products. Hey, he has a business so there's nothing necessarily wrong with that. But it is what it is. And his respectability certainly takes a dive with that type of response, IMO.
Though probably not with the type of costumers he has cultivated.

One has to wonder how much of those responses come from real beliefs in what he says (doubtless, much of it), mixed with the knowing evasiveness of a business man protecting his interests.

Also, he's been doing this 'you have to come to my place so that my speakers are presented properly' thing for quite a while, and doesn't seem to notice what this seems to imply to customers, who surely don't have the special room set up he's using. Why would someone buy a speaker from a company who is afraid to lend their speakers for review and insist the need to be auditioned in The Perfect Room set up by the designer in order to sound right?

 

[amirm]

Yeh, that is the bizarre thing about him. He claims I can't possibly have the proper room to test it yet anyone can buy the speaker and use it. If he documented what should be there and no one should use it otherwise, it would be one thing. But it is not.

 

[ryanosaur]

It's a crock. I know when I've spoken with Designers, they have tended toward humbleness and appreciation for being interested in their work. I became interested in DIY because 5-6 different designers I talked to all got their start there. One guy is a little out there, three are well respected members of the community... doesn't matter. One guy has payed to have one of his designs processed at the NRC to help prove the efficacy of his design.
Sadly, I never got that from watching any of Danny's videos, and the self serving way he discusses his own interests.

I would love to see a comparison of Binding Posts from, Dayton, Cardas and Furutech along with his Tube Connectors. I don't think I've seen real measurements of any of his fixes, either.
I get it. There are people and companies that don't want measurements they are not in control of shared out. I don't trust these companies. (While I want to call a few out, here, I will refrain. )

Overall, this is why I dipped my toe into the pool here. I respect what is going on. It doesn't mean I have to, or will do, what is said... but I learn and grow and assimilate what knowledge helps me along my path!

Cheers!

 

[dougi]

I think small wideband speakers may have potential in the nearfield and with DSPing. You have to wonder why there are no comercial solutions like it.
Just add a tweeter and it works fine.

Agreed. I just "assembled" the Foxtex FF125WK and box kit. Just using the basic DSP tone controls in my study's Yamaha WXA-50 to do rough tweaking. They also have a bad 7 kHz resonance which better DSP would fix. But adding a tweeter may be my next step....

 

[SIY]

Have you, or anyone else here on ASR done an ABX with a mini-dsp (flat) in and out of circuit?? Have they published the results for peer review? Ha. I doubt it.

In order, yes and no for the miniDSP 2x4 HD. The result was unremarkable and thus not worth publishing.

 

[dougi]

I was going to start a new thread, but given the single driver flavour, below are quasi-spins of Fostex FF125WK in their bass reflex box, with tone control tweaks estimated (+5dB bass, -3dB mid, -3dB treble). No gating done, measured at 0.5m.

 

[mhardy6647]

that... thing... between ca. 5 and 8 kHz... looks about right for Fostex 'fullrange' drivers.
Many of them do tend towards the tizzy.

 

[kongwee]

Yeh, that is the bizarre thing about him. He claims I can't possibly have the proper room to test it yet anyone can buy the speaker and use it. If he documented what should be there and no one should use it otherwise, it would be one thing. But it is not.

Being an influencer, he just don't need to open door to reviewer. To be fair, there are another kits dealers. Danny is the only known influencer in modifying speaker. I have not see complaints from his customer for his mods. Selling a finish speaker is not his core business. Just look how mark up his own finished product to his kits. Reviews of his own speaker is not that important. He can just turn down every reviewer openly in youtube, in response of his clients to do reviews. Beside he is not the only kits dealers out there. Creative Sound Solution. There is youtube comparison between GR and CSS kits out there.

In business, if he can get away from reviewers, why not.

 

[amirm]

In business, if he can get away from reviewers, why not.

He sells speakers based on measurements. To the extent he runs away from us measuring them, that can soil his brand and sales pitch.

 

[ryanosaur]

He sells speakers based on measurements. To the extent he runs away from us measuring them, that can soil his brand and sales pitch.

For those who are interested… but how many willfully turn their back on such?
Alternate facts dominate the reality of too many.

 

[amirm]

For those who are interested… but how many willfully turn their back on such?

A lot right now. Hopefully with the right education this will change in the future.

 

[kongwee]

He sells speakers based on measurements. To the extent he runs away from us measuring them, that can soil his brand and sales pitch.

Yes and no. He does measurement, if there is irregularity beyond his tolerance, he will modify it. Other than that it is just parts replacement. Sometime he don't recommend it, all can be seen in his clips. I also have seen him replacing entire complex crossover that measure better than his kits. It is not like he aim to do flat respond like 8361A. His crossover principle is simple. Using his audiophile parts and get the circuit as simple as possible.

Again you can buy his finished speaker but he has no demand to get it review. Only one influencer bought his finished product. Otherwise, people just build them.

If you want his speaker to be review. Do you want his finished product that he has little interest in this area. Or borrow a completed kits where build quality can be different from builders. Why does he need to go through this trouble where being an influencer is a lots easier? He is not a Wilson Audio or Genelac.

You are holding Harmon products but instead you do custom installation. Do you want to do hard selling audiophile retail?

Of course, all my comment have nothing to do for pure measurement point of views.

 

[amirm]

Yes and no. He does measurement, if there is irregularity beyond his tolerance, he will modify it.

Again, I am talking about speakers here, not the mod business he runs.

Again you can buy his finished speaker but he has no demand to get it review.

Finished speaker is $1,100 so quite expensive and way outside of any curiosity I have about his products.

You are holding Harmon products but instead you do custom installation. Do you want to do hard selling audiophile retail?

The heck you talking about? If I contact Harman and they don't want to send me a sample, they don't insult me and the membership here. If you think this is a good business practice for GR Research, then you don't know anything about business.