GR Research LGK 2.0 Speaker Review (A Joke)

[YesChickenNuggets]

My god those measurements, vomit emoji.

 

[Joppe Peelen]

That wilson...... did they ever measured just a tiny bit what they made ? i guess not. even the part that can be easily measured by a DIYér sucks

 

[DanielT]

My god those measurements, vomit emoji.

It has also been pointed out a gazillion times in the thread that you might as well buy some small broadband elements/ drivers and place them in some small boxes. Probably the easiest DIY speaker to build. At almost no cost at all, or very little cost. The sound will not be full-range tip top (not good bass or sensible highest frequencies), but better than the speakers in the laptop.

Here you can search for broadband elements, in different price ranges and sizes:

Home

Or build something fun together with the children, or if you are of that age, the grandchildren:

Lego loudspeaker project using Dayton ND91-8

This project is rather for fun but who knows, maybe it will work out well and will do more of these.... I have some spare Dayton ND91-8 full range drivers (leftover from my MCLA and my truncated line array projects) and I will put one of those into a closed cabinet made of Lego bricks Cabinet...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[Gringoaudio1]

The full range single driver speaker phenomenon is a thing that some people ascribe to. There’s a whole forum on diyaudio.com dedicated to single driver speakers. Mainly old geezers who probably can’t hear highs and don’t miss a tweeter anyway. I got my start in diy audio building a couple full range speakers and quickly realized that they were missing something… for me anyway. Easy introduction to speaker building though. Had some fun. The original iteration of CSS was in Canada and they sold me a lot of stuff.

 

[Waxx]

The full range single driver speaker phenomenon is a thing that some people ascribe to. There’s a whole forum on diyaudio.com dedicated to single driver speakers. Mainly old geezers who probably can’t hear highs and don’t miss a tweeter anyway. I got my start in diy audio building a couple full range speakers and quickly realized that they were missing something… for me anyway. Easy introduction to speaker building though. Had some fun. The original iteration of CSS was in Canada and they sold me a lot of stuff.

I'm such a guy (but I also got multiway speakers) and not that old (43) and with good ears. Single driver speakers have something special no multiway speakers can do. And modern hi-engineered drivers like those from Mark Audio are way better than this driver in this GR speaker. They have a very flat thin cone and a kind of phase plug that makes their dispertion a lot better. And with the spider and surround they have 8mm xmax or so, so they can play bass better than most small midwoofers.

The GR driver is too small to be used as single driver speaker, it needs a sub. And it's bad engineered (sadly there are many such arround) so the tope is terrible. Even i as fullrange single driver speaker find this terrible. I use 5" or bigger drivers for my own builds like this bookshelf that i use in my office. Driver is the Mark Audio Alpair 10.3M in a 17.9L reflex and with a correction filter to tame the top end. And these sound good for this kind of setup. This is how i use them, in my office and driven by a Marantz PM5004 amplifier. They are against the wall, but were designed with that in mind. The finish is intented rough. I'm not so fond of how speakers look today, so i did not do the shiny polished look... I have no ready to publish measurements, and no rig like Amir to test them, but i love how they sound.

A multiway will always have a better dispertion and a flatter response, that is true. But not the true source point sound and lack of phase shifts that most, if not all multiway speakers suffer from. So it's a matter of choices of compromises. This speaker is not everybody's cup of tea.

But again, this GR speaker is just crap, even for a single driver setup. And those prices are totally crazy.

 

[Joe Smith]

I like my KEF Q 15.2 speakers in my office setup for nearfield...very nice with the combined woof/tweet axis lined up with my ears (just slightly lower by about 6" just because of the stands I'm using). Kinda satisfied my interest in the concentric speaker types. Bass down to 50hz comfortably.

 

[Gringoaudio1]

I'm such a guy (but I also got multiway speakers) and not that old (43) and with good ears. Single driver speakers have something special no multiway speakers can do. And modern hi-engineered drivers like those from Mark Audio are way better than this driver in this GR speaker. They have a very flat thin cone and a kind of phase plug that makes their dispertion a lot better. And with the spider and surround they have 8mm xmax or so, so they can play bass better than most small midwoofers.

The GR driver is too small to be used as single driver speaker, it needs a sub. And it's bad engineered (sadly there are many such arround) so the tope is terrible. Even i as fullrange single driver speaker find this terrible. I use 5" or bigger drivers for my own builds like this bookshelf that i use in my office. Driver is the Mark Audio Alpair 10.3M in a 17.9L reflex and with a correction filter to tame the top end. And these sound good for this kind of setup. This is how i use them, in my office and driven by a Marantz PM5004 amplifier. They are against the wall, but were designed with that in mind. The finish is intented rough. I'm not so fond of how speakers look today, so i did not do the shiny polished look... I have no ready to publish measurements, and no rig like Amir to test them, but i love how they sound.

View attachment 245564

A multiway will always have a better dispertion and a flatter response, that is true. But not the true source point sound and lack of phase shifts that most, if not all multiway speakers suffer from. So it's a matter of choices of compromises. This speaker is not everybody's cup of tea.

But again, this GR speaker is just crap, even for a single driver setup. And those prices are totally crazy.

Nice. I looked into the Markaudio speaker drivers but I moved over to multiway designs and haven’t looked back. Probably should look into those and try again. When I first heard Tangband W3-871 drivers in a small ported box I was blown away. Struggled with the CSS (Canadian CSS) drivers for a few years before I realized that they were completely incapable of what was being asked of them. Still they make a nice near field mid range in a three way but wow they were over promoted!

 

[mhardy6647]

It has also been pointed out a gazillion times in the thread that you might as well buy some small broadband elements/ drivers and place them in some small boxes. Probably the easiest DIY speaker to build. At almost no cost at all, or very little cost. The sound will not be full-range tip top (not good bass or sensible highest frequencies), but better than the speakers in the laptop.

Once upon a time, Radio Shack marketed speaker drivers designed to be used in their cartons.

source: https://www.radioshackcatalogs.com/flipbook/1969_radioshack_catalog.html page 38

 

[Waxx]

Nice. I looked into the Markaudio speaker drivers but I moved over to multiway designs and haven’t looked back. Probably should look into those and try again. When I first heard Tangband W3-871 drivers in a small ported box I was blown away. Struggled with the CSS (Canadian CSS) drivers for a few years before I realized that they were completely incapable of what was being asked of them. Still they make a nice near field mid range in a three way but wow they were over promoted!

If you want to go into that world again, start with good brands like Mark Audio, it's inspirator Jordan (who did the first part of the engineering of those modern drivers) and EAD (another Jordan spinoff). Seas, Scanspeak, SB acoustics and Tang Band make also relative good ones. Fostex are also good, but are mostly targetted to the far-east asian market who like a bright sound. But those Fostex in general are still usable for our goals also if you make the right cabinet.

But there are also many very bad drivers, and they are often very expensive. Brands like Audio Nirvana, Cube, Voxativ, ... that often cost thousands of $ or € are just trash. And even more known brands like Lowther and Lii are not that good from hifi perspective. They run on snake oil if you ask me... But they still got their following that is very radical and hardcore. On Diyaudio.com it's a constant battle to keep it science based without going into endless flameware with those. The admins (Planet10 and Scotmoose) are more on the science based diy side, but it's hard to find the balance. And on other spaces (fb and fora) it's even harder.

 

[Eggs Ackley]

Once upon a time, Radio Shack marketed speaker drivers designed to be used in their cartons

Thanks for the link. That catalog sure brought back some memories. I forgot how cool Radio Shack was back in the day.

 

[mhardy6647]

Thanks for the link. That catalog sure brought back some memories. I forgot how cool Radio Shack was back in the day.

De nada.
You know... as I reflect on this, it probably is a good thing that our compadre Mr. Ritchie doesn't know about those box-baffle drivers.

Come to think of it -- and in full and complete disclosure -- I do have this colorful artefact in the collection... not quite the same, but arguably on the spectrum.

 

[bennybbbx]

I'm such a guy (but I also got multiway speakers) and not that old (43) and with good ears. Single driver speakers have something special no multiway speakers can do. And modern hi-engineered drivers like those from Mark Audio are way better than this driver in this GR speaker. They have a very flat thin cone and a kind of phase plug that makes their dispertion a lot better. And with the spider and surround they have 8mm xmax or so, so they can play bass better than most small midwoofers.

The GR driver is too small to be used as single driver speaker, it needs a sub. And it's bad engineered (sadly there are many such arround) so the tope is terrible. Even i as fullrange single driver speaker find this terrible. I use 5" or bigger drivers for my own builds like this bookshelf that i use in my office. Driver is the Mark Audio Alpair 10.3M in a 17.9L reflex and with a correction filter to tame the top end. And these sound good for this kind of setup. This is how i use them, in my office and driven by a Marantz PM5004 amplifier. They are against the wall, but were designed with that in mind. The finish is intented rough. I'm not so fond of how speakers look today, so i did not do the shiny polished look... I have no ready to publish measurements, and no rig like Amir to test them, but i love how they sound.

View attachment 245564

A multiway will always have a better dispertion and a flatter response, that is true. But not the true source point sound and lack of phase shifts that most, if not all multiway speakers suffer from. So it's a matter of choices of compromises. This speaker is not everybody's cup of tea.

But again, this GR speaker is just crap, even for a single driver setup. And those prices are totally crazy.

intresting you build this yourself. did you not think that speakers sound much better on desktop when put them with a stative to ear height ?. reflection on desktop plate get less too. Because of this wy nobody build a tower speaker for desktop that is near high enough that it come to ear height. then case is larger and a smaller driver can produce more bass and need no bass reflex

 

[dustinyo]

I've never seen someone push more audio snake oil than Danny at GR-Research, he has multiple videos pushing the idea that high-end interconnects, speaker cables, power cables, etc all make a difference to audio. Just based on that alone I can't in good conscience buy anything from them. They are also weirdly hostile towards reviewers in general and come off as arrogant and refuse to take any constructive criticism.

 

[diddley]

The customer ain't dumb anymore thanks to youtube and ASR. you read, view different review(wers) and make up your own mind.
And young boys that are green filter themselves out.

 

[Spkrdctr]

The full range single driver speaker phenomenon is a thing that some people ascribe to. There’s a whole forum on diyaudio.com dedicated to single driver speakers. Mainly old geezers who probably can’t hear highs and don’t miss a tweeter anyway

Very true!

 

[Spkrdctr]

Once upon a time, Radio Shack marketed speaker drivers designed to be used in their cartons.

View attachment 245647
source: https://www.radioshackcatalogs.com/flipbook/1969_radioshack_catalog.html page 38

I wonder how far a big company like JBl/Harman could take a speaker in the box concept? I think maybe a small 2 way in a box. It would be fun to see how they measured and what you could tweak on them to increase performance. As usual, as scary as it is, they would probably come out good enough to fool many people who think they would sound terrible. If I was younger and working, I might have tried a 2 way cardboard box build. One of our esteemed engineers, maybe one with a son should try building one and getting it measured. I know Amir would measure it as it is so interesting! I'm thinking the box could be from high strength heavy duty cardboard (very strong stuff), not just regular weak cardboard. There I go, starting to think about the possibilities!

 

[DanielT]

intresting you build this yourself. did you not think that speakers sound much better on desktop when put them with a stative to ear height ?. reflection on desktop plate get less too. Because of this wy nobody build a tower speaker for desktop that is near high enough that it come to ear height. then case is larger and a smaller driver can produce more bass and need no bass reflex

Regarding reflection on desktop plate.
You can place the speaker elements close to the table surface to reduce those problems. In addition, if you build the boxes yourself, you can angle the baffle exactly to your liking so that it fits your listening position.

Attached image only tc9 without box, mostly to illustrate that. As well as a couple of small JPW speakers I play with now on the table in front of the sofa. A lot of damping stuff/fluff that I laid out in front of them. That helps too.

Here Stig Carlsson and one of his speaker models. Apparently built to reduce reflections in the listening room. You can also do this:

The damping discs (damping material) prevent floor reflection and wall reflection. In addition, there is a ring around the tweeter, which prevents reflection from the nearest edges...

CarlssonKult

carlsson story

Edit:
Tc9. Good drivers but they don't go that deep in frequency.

Peerless TC9FD18-08 | HiFiCompass

The THD measurements at voltage level 2.83 Volt were carried out with High Pass Filter "on" (2nd order Butterworth type, 80 Hz cutoff, HPF2-80) The THD measurements at voltage level 4 - 11.2 Volt were carried out with High Pass Filter "on" (2nd order Butterworth type, 150 Hz cutoff, HPF2-150)...

hificompass.com

 

[Robbo99999]

Regarding reflection on desktop plate.
You can place the speaker elements close to the table surface to reduce those problems. In addition, if you build the boxes yourself, you can angle the baffle exactly to your liking so that it fits your listening position.

Attached image only tc9 without box, mostly to illustrate that. As well as a couple of small JPW speakers I play with now on the table in front of the sofa. A lot of damping stuff/fluff that I laid out in front of them. That helps too.

Here Stig Carlsson and one of his speaker models. Apparently built to reduce reflections in the listening room. You can also do this:

The damping discs (damping material) prevent floor reflection and wall reflection. In addition, there is a ring around the tweeter, which prevents reflection from the nearest edges...
View attachment 245945
View attachment 245946

CarlssonKult

carlsson story

Edit:
Tc9. Good drivers but they don't go that deep in frequency.

Peerless TC9FD18-08 | HiFiCompass

The THD measurements at voltage level 2.83 Volt were carried out with High Pass Filter "on" (2nd order Butterworth type, 80 Hz cutoff, HPF2-80) The THD measurements at voltage level 4 - 11.2 Volt were carried out with High Pass Filter "on" (2nd order Butterworth type, 150 Hz cutoff, HPF2-150)...

hificompass.com

Ha, looking at the pic of him with the speaker, it looks like he's not quite sure what he's designed!

 

[DanielT]

Ha, looking at the pic of him with the speaker, it looks like he's not quite sure what he's designed!

He he, well Stig Carlsson was an extremely meticulous man. He tested and measured over and over again. For example, it took him over a year to find suitable felt cloth for those speakers in the picture.
As far as I know, the OA 52.2 has good FR and fairly low distortion.

 

[Robbo99999]

He he, well Stig Carlsson was an extremely meticulous man. He tested and measured over and over again. For example, it took him over a year to find suitable felt cloth for those speakers in the picture.
As far as I know, the OA 52.2 has good FR and fairly low distortion.

Ha, that may be true, but he's not big on marketing - the way he's sitting in that chair with that expression makes it look as if he's criticising his own creation, ha!