GR Research B24 AC Cord Review

[tomchr]

Yes, he put an unknown transformer near the cable with unknown field strength.

Yep. And unknown orientation, etc. All fine and good. Benchmark did the same thing with star quad cables: https://player.vimeo.com/video/155057552

An uncontrolled experiment like that is great for comparing A vs B, but the wheels fall off when it's then compared to a standard reference (threshold of audible) or to results obtained under different conditions.

Tom

 

[fcracer]

@amirm , how does it feel, knowing that despite you putting endless effort into debunking all of this snake oil shit, there is probably zero effect. All of those magic cords and magic boxes sellers will still find enough gullible music loving folks.

I go to some local forums here in EU and this is usual first post of a new member "I have bough Denon xx + Monitor Audio yy, which cables do I need to buy to remove bloated bass". I sometimes think, this hobby is beyond redemption.

It really seems, that there are 2 parallel universes with completely different laws of physics, one normal and another one in audiophile's listening room. This includes IT, where for some reason audio files behave completely differently to the rest.

I will admit I was one of those gullible people, but after finding ASR, I've become enlightened and no longer buy into that BS. I've saved so much money thanks to Amir that I will regularly donate to this site. This site is making a tangible difference, one gullible person at a time.

More importantly, when I do buy some gear (as I did recently with the NAD M33), I let the manufacturer and vendor know that I did so after checking ASR's measurements on their equipment. I want the manufacturers to know that we're getting more educated on this stuff, so they should stop dishing out BS.

 

[DanielT]

Your SPL meter is dumb as a stomp. Industrial noise pollution standards and practices live in dark ages. Audibility of noise must be done per frequency bands or it is useless.

A bit OT, perhaps.

Speaking of different frequencies and sounds, noise, in apartments. A tip for those who are interested. A pdf that is available.
Doctoral thesis / Luleå University of Technolog.
Research topic
Technical acoustics

Measurement and perception of sound insulation from 20 Hz between dwellings

DiVA portal is a finding tool for research publications and student theses written at the following 50 universities and research institutions.

www.diva-portal.org

 

[DualTriode]

Your SPL meter is dumb as a stomp. Industrial noise pollution standards and practices live in dark ages. Audibility of noise must be done per frequency bands or it is useless.

Apparently you did not read the part about 8 octave band measurements that I mentioned or in the provided attachment.

We are speaking of engineered levels of noise across 8 octave bands.

 

[DualTriode]

Sorry for derailing the conversation, but those guidelines have a 2018 date (in the document title at least -- I do not see a date on the actual pages). They reference 'current' ASHRAE Handbook instead of providing the date/ volume -- which is unfortunate when they pull guidelines from it and it is important to know which version it is based on. All 4 Handbook volumes have been updated since 2018. So it's possible some of the info/ guidelines in that Titan publication may have changed slightly. Poor writing on their part. But it's also possible they have a newer version that tracks with the current Handbook volumes. It is still good information, but there is always a danger working with outdated Codes and industry standards.

There is a long story about Codes and industry standards: typically they are updated on a 3 year cycle. The currently adopted codes may have been published 2 years ago and the adopted by reference industry standards may be 3 years older than that. Remember that the codes are a minimum standard. Then a building designed 5 years ago may permitted under codes and standards 5 or 10 years old. Just because there is a new published code or standard does not mean that we use it.

Private institutions may specify their own requirements and they do as long as they exceed the currently adopted codes.

We designed and built a Stem Cell research Lab. The MD, PhD with all the Federal research grants wanted to add a television studio so he could publish his video periodical so we did.

Then during construction Owners with big bank may want things changed prior to the facility being completed; we tell them how much and they ask when will it be done? So the owner says that a live performance venue is too noisy, what ever the specification was we fix it for a fee.

Something like covid-19 ventilation requirements may get put in place a lot sooner.

Thanks DT

I neglected to mention, that I use the old ASHRAE hand books under my computer monitor to prop it up off my desk.

 

[Lambda]

Yes, he put an unknown transformer near the cable with unknown field strength.

The thing here is he compares this "noise" to an signal of unknown strength.
by varying the strength of the signal without telling us the signal he can make the result look however he wants.
this would look like this:

If the electrical signal defined as 120dBSPL would be 30dBV lower then the unspecified arbitrary chosen level we don’t know it would look like this

If the signal would be 20dBV higher:

Agreed it would have been good to know what level the signal was. Let us say we drop that by 20 db which is now 2.67 volts.

this is fundamental and not just "good to know" the whole result of this measurement depends on this.
Why would we make guesses abut it? why is amirm not specifying it. Why is he hostile when asked for this?

None of what is left in the GRR cable assuming those levels are unchanged reach the F-M curve. Neither do the levels of the generic cable. So that is the worst way this could have been represented. The conclusion doesn't change.

This is not my point.
The conclusion was made long before measurements ware made. its a stupid cable and this is all only abut making fun of Danny.

 

[balletboy]

Anyone coming here seeing allegedly electronically educated people bickering rather aggressively over science in relation to measuring a cable and whether noise is audible is unlikely to be impressed. Not exactly a united front from the anti-cable brigade.

 

[amirm]

Apparently you did not read the part about 8 octave band measurements that I mentioned or in the provided attachment.

Apparently you didn't seeing how you said room noise was a singular 40 dbspl.

 

[amirm]

The conclusion was made long before measurements ware made. its a stupid cable and this is all only abut making fun of Danny.

You are out of line. I did not make fun of anyone. Just got done giving recommendation for his speaker mod. Don't project how you would act in a situation compared to what I do.

I spent days developing and optimizing the process for null testing of cables. This is a major advancement in providing data for people who dismiss measurements.

Now what is your agenda? You complain in these tweak product reviews yet never deliver a single test to back your claims. This is not whiners convention.

 

[amirm]

this is fundamental and not just "good to know" the whole result of this measurement depends on this.

You don't even know what that means. Did you read the references I provided?

 

[amirm]

An uncontrolled experiment like that is great for comparing A vs B, but the wheels fall off when it's then compared to a standard reference (threshold of audible) or to results obtained under different conditions.

And AB test it was. On the second part until you start reading the research papers provided to you, you will continue to be in the dark.

 

[amirm]

The horse is dead.

The horse is not dead. Adoption of such tweaks have become almost universal. Our camp has not done enough to counter them. Just saying something is impossible when the other party thinks strongly that they hear something dies not work. Measurements help with that argument. Null testing adds a powerful component.

 

[Spkrdctr]

that , you need a cool drink . that was so morbid reading . poor cow and beating a horse ? i think why not beating a bose speaker for now okay everyone . it's like "beating a knackered bose speaker" at least that is immaterial objevt not some lovely animal creature .

"beating a knacakred bose speaker".
View attachment 218680

I repaired many 901s. As they aged the drivers did not do well. Plus you had to have the electronic add on box (EQ and such) working or who knew what you would get. Those were the days before speaker science really took off. Time for my favorite saying "Heck, I was there"!

 

[Spkrdctr]

Your SPL meter is dumb as a stomp. Industrial noise pollution standards and practices live in dark ages. Audibility of noise must be done per frequency bands or it is useless.

Amir, you are correct. Don't even get me started on industrial noise. The Federal standards for most things are figured by a lot of corrupt people. Decades down the road they tend to actually figure out the truth as new employees come in who care about what they do. SPL levels and Radiation levels are all over the map. In fact I feel PTSD coming on just typing this!

 

[Lambda]

I spent days developing and optimizing the process for null testing of cables. This is a major advancement in providing data for people who dismiss measurements.

never?

RCA cable Magnetic interference measurement and comparison

Cables are cables and there is no difference?! I designed a test to see if they perform significantly different in therms of "magnetic shielding" or Leakage inductance. This test dose not test for ground loop currents but interference from close by magnetic in homogeneous magnetic files. The...

www.audiosciencereview.com

What is your data showing?!
Without mentioning the the test level it can’t be independently reproduced.
I could repeat the test with a different level an make the "data" look however i want or how ever i need to fit a narrative.

If the electrical signal defined as 120dBSPL would be 30dBV lower then the unspecified arbitrary chosen level we don’t know it would look like this

If the signal would be 20dBV higher:

Did you read the references I provided?

what reference? about the Fechner absolute hearing threshold?
In not questioning his work at all i’m questioning the method your using and how you try to apply this.

You don't even know what that means.

Sounds almost like a personal attack to me.

 

[DualTriode]

Apparently you didn't seeing how you said room noise was a singular 40 dbspl.

As SINAD is a singular number made up of component parts.

Are you ready to remove SINAD from the ASR dashboard?

 

[amirm]

what reference? about the Fechner absolute hearing threshold?

What reference? Are you not even reading responses written on this topic? What a pain the few of you have become....

 

[amirm]

As SINAD is a singular number made up of component parts.

Are you ready to remove SINAD from the ASR dashboard?

Take your off topic complaints elsewhere. Do you understand that single number SPL values are useless now?

 

[amirm]

Using it as an interconnect, who cares?

Company's claim for this cable was its ability to reject noise. So I isolated the cable and tested for that. It would have been impossible to check the same with a live AC cable.

 

[5mall5nail5]

I did not make fun of anyone.

But I did Danny responded to me on YouTube telling me that he can, in fact, audibly hear the difference between PVC and PTFE insulation on a wire.

He owes me an ounce and a half of bourbon and a new t-shirt.