Good somewhat neutral mixing headphones with good bass extension for max. 350€?

[RexrothPigeon]

I dont like nor trust Scheps.

Scheps is on the record as being basically unable to make a living solely from mixing. Which is why he's turned to monetized Youtubing. Which is why he can't really be trusted.

 

[solderdude]

Small question regarding the Sennheiser HD650 and the SuperluxHD681 I have here at home, those are the distortion measurements for both from the reviews at ASR:


Superlux

View attachment 498472

Sennheiser

View attachment 498473

Do I understand this correctly, that Superlux has a 10x stronger distortion at around 20Hz? Even at 104dBSPL Sennheiser is only half the value?

Does this mean I can

a) boost the lows on the HD650 and
b) still have an overall more clean lowend?

comparable plots for HD681 and HD650 (my headphones, my measurements)

HD681 at 90dB SPL.

HD 650 at 90dB SPL but measured in a noisy enironment so distortion peaks seen are probably lower in reality.

HD681 is only suited for monitoring.

 

[Jiraya369]

Scheps is on the record as being basically unable to make a living solely from mixing. Which is why he's turned to monetized Youtubing. Which is why he can't really be trusted.

i knew something was up with that fella, glad to see my hunch was right.

snake oil dealer type fella.

 

[FireEmblem]

Ok let's say that is the case, but the post asks for neutral mixing headphones yet you want joy, so which is it? For mixing or for joy?

The "for joy" referred to having wider stereo imaging. Which is something I don't inherently need, but enjoy. My current headphones don't sound as spaced out as let's say HD650.

I dont like nor trust Scheps. He seems like one of the reasons why modern music sounds so bad, he only did Michael Jackson's live mixing

Uhm.. no. He also mixed Metallica, Red Hot Chilli Peppers, Black Sabbath, Lady Gaga, Bon Jovi, Beyonce, Lana Del Rey, Linkin Park, Justin Timberlake, Limp Bizkit, Johnny Cash, Sum 41 and many more. You'll have a hard time finding many other human beings on this planet with such an impressive portfolio.

But like I said, you're free not to believe in it. Headphone mixes work very well for me too, and they sound just as I envisioned them on any other system, including studio monitors.

Also, even if i were to trust his words, i did say that one can make exceptional mixes on headphones if they learn it, so i dont understand your point.

Then you're arguing against yourself here:

none, no headphone is good enough for mixing by itself.

Also, regarding this

You just use this one guy's example as gospel, the exception is never the rule buddy.

there are many more, but I don't have to list them if you deny my personal experience and of someone like Scheps, there's no point in adding more to the list. Also, it doesn't matter what "the rule" is. What matters is whether it's perfectly possible or not, and it is. Even if 90 out of 100 mixing engineers prefer to mix on studio monitors. That doesn't change the fact that headphones work as well and that some prefer it.

So back to topic:

All I was asking for was a pair of headphones with good measurements, that has a good bass extension (more than 650) out of the box and good stereo imaging.

 

[Jiraya369]

The "for joy" referred to having wider stereo imaging. Which is something I don't inherently need, but enjoy. My current headphones don't sound as spaced out as let's say HD650.



Uhm.. no. He also mixed Metallica, Red Hot Chilli Peppers, Black Sabbath, Lady Gaga, Bon Jovi, Beyonce, Lana Del Rey, Linkin Park, Justin Timberlake, Limp Bizkit, Johnny Cash, Sum 41 and many more. You'll have a hard time finding many other human beings on this planet with such an impressive portfolio.

But like I said, you're free not to believe in it. Headphone mixes work very well for me too, and they sound just as I envisioned them on any other system, including studio monitors.



Then you're arguing against yourself here:



Also, regarding this



there are many more, but I don't have to list them if you deny my personal experience and of someone like Scheps, there's no point in adding more to the list. Also, it doesn't matter what "the rule" is. What matters is whether it's perfectly possible or not, and it is. Even if 90 out of 100 mixing engineers prefer to mix on studio monitors. That doesn't change the fact that headphones work as well and that some prefer it.

So back to topic:

All I was asking for was a pair of headphones with good measurements, that has a good bass extension (more than 650) out of the box and good stereo imaging.

mate in the end you're agreeing with what im saying just in your own way lmao

read again : " no headphone is good enough for mixing by itself."

A headphone is nothing but a tool, skill is needed to make use of that tool. If you learn it, you can use it properly. But compared to a monitor, a headphone is just not good enough. I never said you can't make mixes off of headphones, just that monitors are far superior and if you want something good for mixing, don't get headphones. That's just how it is man. Just because the minority prefers headphones doesn't change the actual truth.

And finally, i did give you the best possible suggestion at the end, fits your budget. If you're not willing to eq/dont understand it, keep looking.

 

[FireEmblem]

At this point you're just repeating that "headphones aren't good enough" and I disagree again. Now that we've exchanged our opinions for the third time, it would be cool to let the thread be what it is about, finding a pair of headphones that matches the requested specifications:

All I was asking for was a pair of headphones with good measurements, that has a good bass extension (more than 650) out of the box and good stereo imaging.

And yes, I noticed your recommendation and I'll check it out. I just want the thread to return to the topic so others can post recommendations as well.

 

[solderdude]

All I was asking for was a pair of headphones with good measurements, that has a good bass extension (more than 650) out of the box and good stereo imaging.

Jade Audio JT7

 

[FireEmblem]

Jade Audio JT7

According to the measurement from DIY heaven they've got less low end than Sennheiser's 650:

I'm looking for a pair that has around 90-95dB at around 20Hz. The Superlux have 92dB at 20Hz and they sound pretty powerful.

 

[Scrivs]

AKG K371?

 

[FireEmblem]

AKG K371?

Hmm.. review here shows that there's some frequencies building up inside the earcups (group delay). The bass looks powerful, but maybe a bit too powerful, 20Hz goes up to almost 105dB and would probably require an EQ to tame it. But keep it in mind..

 

[kemmler3D]

A headphone is nothing but a tool, skill is needed to make use of that tool.

Yes, would agree with this. CAN you mix solely with headphones? Sure, apparently. I understand it's increasingly common, too.

You can also make great art using odd materials like broken glass or ketchup. Some people have unique talents. But there's a reason most revered paintings are oil paintings...

 

[kemmler3D]

I'm looking for a pair that has around 90-95dB at around 20Hz. The Superlux have 92dB at 20Hz and they sound pretty powerful.

This is the wrong way to read graphs like that, because presumably you've got access to a volume knob somewhere in your kit... look at frequencies relative to each other but don't worry about the absolute value.

 

[FireEmblem]

This is the wrong way to read graphs like that, because presumably you've got access to a volume knob somewhere in your kit... look at frequencies relative to each other but don't worry about the absolute value.

Yes but low frequencies need a multiple amount of dB do be perceived as louder, so I'd have to increase the volume to amounts where the much higher frequencies will start to pain the ears. And with headphones it's very important to maintain a good volume to prevent hearing damage. So I'd prefer a pair of headphones that's more balanced in terms of bass right out of the box, and without the need of EQ..

 

[drzk]

Jade Audio JT7

if I have an hd 650, should I buy a jt7 for mixing?

Before that, I was using the edition xs, and they were too bright for me, and the hd650 seemed too boring.

before all of them, there were fidelio x2hrs and they sounded very nice, but they don't seem to be very suitable for mixing because of their frequency response.

or are there any other recommendations?

 

[solderdude]

if I have an hd 650, should I buy a jt7 for mixing?

Before that, I was using the edition xs, and they were too bright for me, and the hd650 seemed too boring.

before all of them, there were fidelio x2hrs and they sounded very nice, but they don't seem to be very suitable for mixing because of their frequency response.

or are there any other recommendations?

You can use the HD650 if you know how that translates to monitors.
You were looking for a good headphone with great bass extension and would not need EQ.
The JT7 is exactly that.
To play it loud you might need amplification.

All other recommendations are much more expensive and/or colored.

 

[FireEmblem]

You were looking for a good headphone with great bass extension and would not need EQ.
The JT7 is exactly that.

This is another user, not me (the OP)

But I don't know if you have seen my post #28, it appears the JT7 have less bass extension than HD650.

 

[drzk]

You can use the HD650 if you know how that translates to monitors.
You were looking for a good headphone with great bass extension and would not need EQ.
The JT7 is exactly that.
To play it loud you might need amplification.

All other recommendations are much more expensive and/or colored.

thanks for the reply, will topping e2x2 be enough for jt7?

and wouldn't a sundara or k371 be better for these purposes than a jt7? These are the only options I've considered before jt7.

 

[solderdude]

According to the measurement from DIY heaven

HD650 does not have less bass extension, just more midbass hump (warmth) around 140Hz which the JT7 lacks.

The JT7 is closer to the HD600 but does not have the 'overly bright' character of the HD600

 

[solderdude]

thanks for the reply, will topping e2x2 be enough for jt7?

Yes, good headphone out section.

and wouldn't a sundara or k371 be better for these purposes than a jt7? These are the only options I've considered before jt7.

Sundara is NOT better sounding (I have 2 of them).
The K371 is closed, bass is seal dependent, build quality is not great, it has an audible 4kHz dip.

For mixing I would recommend near-field monitors that are compensated at the listening position.
If one has to mix on headphones I recommend open headphones which one is familiar with and knows how a mix will turn out on speakers.
That does not have to be an ideal headphone but it helps if it already is close to 'speakers'.

 

[RexrothPigeon]

You can also make great art using odd materials like broken glass or ketchup. Some people have unique talents. But there's a reason most revered paintings are oil paintings...

Interestingly, they’re called mix engineers not mix artists