Look at the region between 100Hz and 300Hz. This is where the monitor is most limited in SPL. Incidentally, it's also the region where SPL will be at its highest when you play bass-heavy music crossed over with a subwoofer. The 8361A is more capable in these frequencies than the 8351B. I have personally managed to clip my 8351B's while playing bass-heavy music with subwoofers crossed over at 120Hz. I would have been able to play louder if I had 8361A's.Could someone explain this in a bit more detail, maybe Amir can add some light.
it seems that the top end is clipping even earlier, it's not an issue to me as I never listen that loud though. (I normally have averaged SPL at 65-70db, any higher and my ears feels pain as it's too loud for me).Look at the region between 100Hz and 300Hz. This is where the monitor is most limited in SPL. Incidentally, it's also the region where SPL will be at its highest when you play bass-heavy music crossed over with a subwoofer. The 8361A is more capable in these frequencies than the 8351B. I have personally managed to clip my 8351B's while playing bass-heavy music with subwoofers crossed over at 120Hz. I would have been able to play louder if I had 8361A's.
I use two subs placed in either corner behind the monitors, so bass is coming the same direction of each monitor respectively. I could cross even higher if my subs were capable and still not have issues.it seems that the top end is clipping even earlier, it's not an issue to me as I never listen that loud though. (I normally have averaged SPL at 65-70db, any higher and my ears feels pain as it's too loud for me).
One thing though, when crossing over at 120hz, do you have localization problem with subs if it's a single sub??
I am fairly surprise you can easily clip a 5.1 setup listening at 3m. How loud was it? 100dBA? 100dBZ? 120 peak?This is about mid/upper bass not covered by the subwoofer.
I am fairly surprise you can easily clip a 5.1 setup listening at 3m. How loud was it? 100dBA? 100dBZ? 120 peak?
Esp. in home theater setup I never get it to clip even on EDM.
My sub (7370)A is giving up way before the 8361A and when it does I am already in party mode.
I never manage to clip the system with the W371 (I tried a few times with a headset for fun and I can only try since I do not have neighbour).
There's an 8351B flush mount kit with a photo of how much it protrudes.Specific to all of the "ones", I wonder how much of the front of the speaker protrudes? I would guess far enough so that the woofer surrounds are forward of the baffle wall plane?
Outstanding but 70lbs that is crazy for a bookshelf speaker!This is a review and detailed measurements of the Genelc 8361A studio monitor (powered active speaker). It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $4,995.
The 8361A looks identical to the rest of the series except massively scaled up:
View attachment 164823
It doesn't look it but it is extremely heavy. It has a handle in the back but I could barely carry it a few steps using that before having to ask my wife for help. This is a 3-way speaker with coaxial mid and tweeter helped by dual woofers hidden behind the front massive waveguide/baffle.
Measurements that you are about to see were performed using the Klippel Near-field Scanner (NFS). This is a robotic measurement system that analyzes the speaker all around and is able (using advanced mathematics and dual scan) to subtract room reflections (so where I measure it doesn't matter). It also measures the speaker at close distance ("near-field") which sharply reduces the impact of room noise. Both of these factors enable testing in ordinary rooms yet results that can be more accurate than an anechoic chamber. In a nutshell, the measurements show the actual sound coming out of the speaker independent of the room.
Measurements are compliant with latest speaker research into what can predict the speaker preference and is standardized in CEA/CTA-2034 ANSI specifications. Likewise listening tests are performed per research that shows mono listening is much more revealing of differences between speakers than stereo or multichannel.
Reference axis was the center of coaxial driver (aligned by eye). Unit was factory reset and all dip switches were in off setting. It is getting colder with the measurement room temp at 16 degrees C.
Genele 8361A Measurements
Acoustic measurements can be grouped in a way that can be perceptually analyzed to determine how good a speaker is and how it can be used in a room. This so called spinorama shows us just about everything we need to know about the speaker with respect to tonality and some flaws:
View attachment 164824
What beautiful results! It almost doesn't get any better than this. The only minor nit is slightly lower bass output. I have seen this in another Genelec speaker. Company's measurements don't have this. So either it is slight measurement error due to lower temp, or level is set slightly too low by Genelec due to their measurements not showing the same.
Due to excellent directivity index, early window reflections are all similar to on-axis but slightly rolled off as they should be:
View attachment 164825
Put the two together and we get predicted far-field response of:
View attachment 164826
Notice how port/cabinet resonance is kept at extremely low level:
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Drilling into beam width shows the same precision and attention to bot on and off axis response:
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Notice how not only are the red portions of the graph smooth, but that the transition to white happens with very little chaos indicating lack of diffraction errors due to cabinet, driver edges, etc.
Same praise almost goes for vertical axis naturally:
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Modelling the full 3-D sound field at three critical frequencies shows the near perfection of this speaker/driver:
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Forward projection is so controlled and well formed.
As I was running the sweeps for distortion tests, i could detect the deep bass and super smooth response from low to high indicating absence of distortion:
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Speaker simply doesn't feel the pressure of being asked to pump out this volume so I cranked it up another 10 dB:
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Now the clipping indicator was blinking and as I have seen with other Genelecs, it aims to protect the tweeter by limiting its output. Listening through my hearing protection, I thought the sound was still fine.
Waterfall shows some resonances:
View attachment 164833
Impulse response is impressive in approximating the ideal:
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Assuming Klippel has measured the latency correct, we are looking at almost 5 milliseconds.
Genelec 8361A Listening Tests
While many pros buy the Genelecs for near field listening, our membership here is mostly interested in far field so that is how I tested it (pictured above). The first impression is that of clarity with slightly light tonality. I did want to see if it could benefit from some bass boost per measurements though so dialed that in:
View attachment 164835
The increased bass performance was phenomenal. So much so that in some tracks my room mode at 105 Hz became a bit much so I dialed it down as you see. Once there, I was greeted with a level of clean and deep bass which I had never experienced with any other speaker I have tested. It was like having the most perfectly integrated subwoofer next to a very powerful and capable speaker. Dynamics knew no limit. Turn it up and it simply gets louder and louder with deep notes rocking the entire room!
With the bass boost the sound was so wonderful and fun that I did not want to stop to eat dinner and then type this review! No speaker I have tested come close to this level of performance. Yet I keep looking at a speaker that is less than half the height of my own speakers! You keep wondering where the incredible bass tones are coming from.
And it is not just the bass. Midrange and treble clarity was superb.
Do I honestly need to write this? That this is one of the most perfectly executed speakers both objectively and subjectively. No longer does a powered speaker have a limit in either deep bass or loudness. I was testing just a single one. I can just imagine a pair being able to bring the house down with perfect clarity and dynamics. $5,000 sounds like a lot of money but you are getting multiple levels of amplification and DACs for free plus in-built DSP, room EQ, etc., etc. Buy a pair for $10K and you are done with your journey as an audiophile.
It is my absolute pleasure to strongly recommend the Genelec 8361A. I killed my back (and that of my wife's) carrying it around to measure and listen to but it was all worth it. If you can afford it, run, don't walk to get them for your system!
Edit: video review also posted:
As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.
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Learnings, two months or so into use.Other than that, how's the sound so far?