• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required as is 20 years of participation in forums (not all true). Come here to have fun, be ready to be teased and not take online life too seriously. We now measure and review equipment for free! Click here for details.

Genelec 8361A Review (Powered Monitor)

Rate this speaker:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 3 0.6%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 4 0.8%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 21 4.1%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 489 94.6%

  • Total voters
    517

waldo2

Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2021
Messages
49
Likes
89
I too would be skeptical of an individual report of a listener Like me. I understand the issue with people all over the internet reporting different opinions With no control. I also would like to have an easily codified way of identifying perfect speakers to eliminate judgment. I just don’t think we are there yet, despite the great desire of most of us to get there. maybe I am wrong, butworld of generally imperfect recordings, perfect playback may be problematic. Those are the recordings we have, howeve.
 

dfuller

Major Contributor
Joined
Apr 26, 2020
Messages
1,657
Likes
2,200
I too would be skeptical of an individual report of a listener Like me. I understand the issue with people all over the internet reporting different opinions With no control. I also would like to have an easily codified way of identifying perfect speakers to eliminate judgment. I just don’t think we are there yet, despite the great desire of most of us to get there. maybe I am wrong, butworld of generally imperfect recordings, perfect playback may be problematic. Those are the recordings we have, howeve.
That's the "Circle of Confusion" that gets talked about. If something is mixed and/or mastered on less-than-great speakers, it will not sound good on all sources.
 

Joachim Herbert

Active Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 20, 2019
Messages
213
Likes
357
Location
Munich, Germany
Congrats
Do you feel the soundstage is small or anything is "off"with the sound compared to non coaxial speakers?
Coming from Adam S3V* I find the stereo image to be more stable when moving my head.

One recording that caused some irritation today was "when I go to heaven by John Prine-. It features very intimate solo parts versus wide, maybe out of phase chorus passages. Stark contrast via headphones, not so much via the Genelecs. Demystified, sort of.

Will have to listen to this via my Neumann desktop setup tomorrow.

* Great value, though lacking GLM functionality.
 

waldo2

Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2021
Messages
49
Likes
89
Let me elaborate a bit more about my experience with GLM. It nicely adjusted the bass, but, as others here have said, doesn’t do much for upper mids and higher frequencies, and may have emphasized them a bit more. That is what I couldn’t fix with additional eq after GLM. That may be my fault because i was just trying different eq settings to get sound I was looking for and I may have not expert at that. Nevertheless, after GLM and without further tinkering the speakers were as I have described them and even after further adjusting the higher frequencies with GLM, I could not make them sound close to natural on acoustic recordings. Blame my ears, my eq settings, my room, my recordings, or All of them together. But, now i have given as complete account as I can.
 

Sancus

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Nov 30, 2018
Messages
1,893
Likes
4,612
Location
Canada
We have very few excellent recordings of classical music, in my opinion. Most of it is close miked, and a bit harsh and not very natural.

Huh? One of the most popular methods of recording classical/acoustic music is using the Decca Tree or a modern version of it which is not close-miking and typically captures a lot of room reflections.

I agree uneven recording quality is a problem with classical, but I don't think the issue is typically the recording techniques. I think the issue is mixing. Close-miked records can sound great when the post-recording steps are done well.

I realize now that few people here likely even listen to acoustic music and I tired to say that I like the speakers much better with electronic instruments and processed studio recordings.

Yes, that's why we have a 30-page thread about speakers used to mix classical music, because no one listens to it or cares about it.

That is what I couldn’t fix with additional eq after GLM. That may be my fault because i was just trying different eq settings to get sound I was looking for and I may have not expert at that.

See, that's totally reasonable. GLM and these speakers are after all foremost designed as a tool for professional engineers. So it's somewhat assumed that you will have a good understanding of EQ if you wish to customize the automatic profile GLM gives you. It's definitely a flaw that GLM's customization is very poor if you aren't practiced at building your own filters.

IMO the "Sound Character Profiler" is a pretty bad substitute for target curves.
 

Pearljam5000

Major Contributor
Joined
Oct 12, 2020
Messages
1,833
Likes
1,871
Coming from Adam S3V* I find the stereo image to be more stable when moving my head.

One recording that caused some irritation today was "when I go to heaven by John Prine-. It features very intimate solo parts versus wide, maybe out of phase chorus passages. Stark contrast via headphones, not so much via the Genelecs. Demystified, sort of.

Will have to listen to this via my Neumann desktop setup tomorrow.

* Great value, though lacking GLM functionality.
Thanks
Do you feel the bass is comparable to Adam S3V?
 

waldo2

Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2021
Messages
49
Likes
89
Huh? One of the most popular methods of recording classical/acoustic music is using the Decca Tree or a modern version of it which is not close-miking and typically captures a lot of room reflections.

I agree uneven recording quality is a problem with classical, but I don't think the issue is typically the recording techniques. I think the issue is mixing. Close-miked records can sound great when the post-recording steps are done well.



Yes, that's why we have a 30-page thread about speakers used to mix classical music, because no one listens to it or cares about it.
Unfortunately, fewer than 1% of recordings sold are classical, and much of that of the pop variety. Don’t want to get into recording techniques as i am no expert, but I disagree about classical recordings. I posted before, but found this interview with Tony Faulkner helpful on classical music recording techniques.
 

waldo2

Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2021
Messages
49
Likes
89
Unfortunately, fewer than 1% of recordings sold are classical, and much of that of the pop variety. Don’t want to get into recording techniques as i am no expert, but I disagree about classical recordings. I posted before, but found this interview with Tony Faulkner helpful on classical music recording techniques.
sorry, forgot the link:
.
 

Sancus

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Nov 30, 2018
Messages
1,893
Likes
4,612
Location
Canada
Don’t want to get into recording techniques as i am no expert, but I disagree about classical recordings.

Well, I cite the fact that the tv/film industry frequently uses close miking for their recordings and they generally sound pretty good. In fact, sometimes credits music mixed for Atmos sounds better than any available stereo recording of the same material.

Unfortunately I don't have time to watch an hour long interview right now but I'll try to take a look at some point. And I acknowledge that there are many varied opinions on how to record and mix classical, in fact I think classical maybe has more variance in this aspect than any other genre.
 
Last edited:

Joachim Herbert

Active Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 20, 2019
Messages
213
Likes
357
Location
Munich, Germany
Thanks
Do you feel the bass is comparable to Adam S3V?
Too early to tell. I had a pretty good bass EQ for the Adams and will have to work on the GLM results. I just took one single point measurement and have not optimized for wall distance.

Having said that there is lots of well defined bass. I'd say it can play much louder than the S3V without loosing shape. But the Adam is loud enough for all practical purposes.
 

dfuller

Major Contributor
Joined
Apr 26, 2020
Messages
1,657
Likes
2,200
I realize now that few people here likely even listen to acoustic music
Not ragging on you, but even I (a massive fan of loud distorted guitars) listen to a fair amount of acoustic music - albeit, usually bluegrass. But that has fiddle, which is subject to the same issues as classical violin because it's the same instrument. Classical recordings in my experience often emphasize the really biting parts of a violin's tone, even with good players. Which is odd, because that nails-on-a-chalkboard thing is the exact thing that separates good violinists from bad ones. Bad ones have it bad, good ones don't.
Don’t want to get into recording techniques as i am no expert, but I disagree about classical recordings. I posted before, but found this interview with Tony Faulkner helpful on classical music recording techniques.
When I've done orchestras, it was a mix of whole-orchestra (i.e. Decca Tree or similar) setups and per-section mics. The only things close miked were the basses and some of the percussion.
 

Sancus

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Nov 30, 2018
Messages
1,893
Likes
4,612
Location
Canada
Classical recordings in my experience often emphasize the really biting parts of a violin's tone, even with good players.

I wonder how much this is intentional and how much it might be a result of hearing damage or age-related loss among the audio engineers? Because while common it's definitely not universal either. Obviously, another explanation might be using speakers with a darker tilt for mixing.
 

ahofer

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jun 3, 2019
Messages
1,853
Likes
3,218
Location
New York City
Sitting next to a violinist or violist gets a pretty biting tone, relative to the audience-distance perception of massed strings.
 

turnip_up

Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2021
Messages
9
Likes
6
That's the "Circle of Confusion" that gets talked about. If something is mixed and/or mastered on less-than-great speakers, it will not sound good on all sources.

Has there been any scientific testing to determine that is the case? I mean... we don't even know what music he is talking about, much less what speakers may have been used during the production process.
 

Ardrazzt

Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2020
Messages
12
Likes
9
Probably happens everywhere, to some degree. There is certainly a lot of noise on gearspace... but there are also a lot of people there who have notched up some very serious hours of critical listening over long careers.



They are great sounding speakers, but I still think placement is key to getting the most out of them. I have a pair of S360s here too. Sticking them side by side about 2 to 2.5 meters away, and the S360s just trounce them in every way shape, and form. Their soundstage, depth and clarity is just incredible. Move them all closer, to about 1m away and the story changes entirely.
So, is "better" the S360 for 3 meters away?
 

dfuller

Major Contributor
Joined
Apr 26, 2020
Messages
1,657
Likes
2,200
Has there been any scientific testing to determine that is the case? I mean... we don't even know what music he is talking about, much less what speakers may have been used during the production process.
We do, he linked some of it further back. And yes, it was from Toole himself as I understand it.
 

pozz

Data Ordinator
Forum Donor
Editor
Joined
May 21, 2019
Messages
3,984
Likes
6,384
I wonder how much this is intentional and how much it might be a result of hearing damage or age-related loss among the audio engineers? Because while common it's definitely not universal either. Obviously, another explanation might be using speakers with a darker tilt for mixing.
Violin directivity. A lot of the HF radiates upward from the soundboard, and a common technique in classical music is to use overhead mics.

Few people recording understand the individual directivity patterns of each instrument.
 

pozz

Data Ordinator
Forum Donor
Editor
Joined
May 21, 2019
Messages
3,984
Likes
6,384
I too would be skeptical of an individual report of a listener Like me. I understand the issue with people all over the internet reporting different opinions With no control. I also would like to have an easily codified way of identifying perfect speakers to eliminate judgment. I just don’t think we are there yet, despite the great desire of most of us to get there. maybe I am wrong, butworld of generally imperfect recordings, perfect playback may be problematic. Those are the recordings we have, howeve.
Fair comment. Part of what we discuss here is the state of knowledge in audio. Lots of journal papers and so forth. They are good guides, since individually we only know so much, and each of us can bring something to the forum by doing the work of reading research. There is an implicit attitude here that if you find yourself in an unfamiliar area, the right thing to do is to investigate, and consider what you know suspect in the meantime.

Helps that we have so many members with professional and science backgrounds, and many others that are very knowledgable enthusiasts.

It's very nice that you've decided to remain part of the discussion.
 
Top Bottom