Genelec 8341A SAM™ Studio Monitor Review

[soundwave76]

^ same here - never gone above -40db with my 8331. Loud as hell!

 

[Frank Dernie]

Some of the best things come from Finland (I'm soo biased)

I don't quite get the not-loud thing. I've used their baby model 8331 in one short mixing session, with quick SAM room calibration. And in that intended nearfield use they were LOUD. I never went above -40 dB for mixing, -15 dB was still super clean but earbleeding loud. But to fill a big room with bass Genelec, like other similar pro gear vendors, has other goodies. This venue in Helsinki use big Genelecs as PA! Each of those 18" elements has its own 1100W class D amp... Expensive, yes, but Stereophile has more expensive ones in almost every issue.

View attachment 60763

At the listening distance I use in my room to listen to music these are the only ones Genelec say the direct sound still dominates.
Presumably it is their most directional model.

 

[QMuse]

This only applies to FIR filters correct? IIR filters are immune to pre ringing?

Minimum phase FIR filters and IIR filters have post ringing which is masked. Linear phase filters introduce pre-ringing which may be audible if it is excessive..

 

[Fotophred]

Three of my systems are based on Genelec 8010, 8331 and 8351.
Even the 8010s will go louder than I am comfortable listening in most domestic rooms.
People smile indulgently when I unpack the 8010s - when I subsequently play them - their jaws drop and the struggle for comment.
Often these listeners are well steeped in audio experience and have retailed high end audio, owned or still own a lot of expensive gear.
My Genelecs are used for listening mostly music with some movie duties. I auditioned perhaps 40 pairs of speakers - owned all sorts. My home for some reason sucks in bass - not really sure why.
A pair of Emerald Physics CS2 OBs with their room correction driven/commanded by a pair of Perreaux 8000s worked ok (The heartbeat at the beginning of DSOTM could rattle the alloy windows on another level of the house).
The Emeralds and Perreaux twins unfortunately disappeared from my possession and rebuilding commenced again.
After a long frustrating journey I had a pair of Genelec 8260s and 8351s side by side for evaluation.
It took me more than 2 weeks to decide on the 8351s.
After weeks of faffing about with the positioning of the 8351s their response is flat to 22/23hz (I also tilt the top down slightly)
Two other systems use more conventional speakers, my Mcintosh MC2255 leaning a pair of Tannoy Ardens is musical and soothing but cant hit like the Genelecs.

 

[HooStat]

After weeks of faffing about with the positioning of the 8351s their response is flat to 22/23hz (I also tilt the top down slightly)

I am looking at the 8351B -- how big is your room? I am trying to figure out if I can get away without a sub if they provide decent bass on their own in a comparable room.

 

[richard12511]

Three of my systems are based on Genelec 8010, 8331 and 8351.
Even the 8010s will go louder than I am comfortable listening in most domestic rooms.
People smile indulgently when I unpack the 8010s - when I subsequently play them - their jaws drop and the struggle for comment.
Often these listeners are well steeped in audio experience and have retailed high end audio, owned or still own a lot of expensive gear.
My Genelecs are used for listening mostly music with some movie duties. I auditioned perhaps 40 pairs of speakers - owned all sorts. My home for some reason sucks in bass - not really sure why.
A pair of Emerald Physics CS2 OBs with their room correction driven/commanded by a pair of Perreaux 8000s worked ok (The heartbeat at the beginning of DSOTM could rattle the alloy windows on another level of the house).
The Emeralds and Perreaux twins unfortunately disappeared from my possession and rebuilding commenced again.
After a long frustrating journey I had a pair of Genelec 8260s and 8351s side by side for evaluation.
It took me more than 2 weeks to decide on the 8351s.
After weeks of faffing about with the positioning of the 8351s their response is flat to 22/23hz (I also tilt the top down slightly)
Two other systems use more conventional speakers, my Mcintosh MC2255 leaning a pair of Tannoy Ardens is musical and soothing but cant hit like the Genelecs.

What was it about the 8351 that you liked better than the 8260?

 

[Robert394]

Interestingly, I compared the 8341 to the Hedd Type 20s in my room and was ready to go with whichever sounded better. I actually thought the Type 20s were the better speaker for my own needs, which is listening to music for enjoyment as well as home theater. The Genelec sounded a tad "dirtier" to me, whereas the Type 20s are very clear. I think the AMT tweeter is likely better than Genelec's. I also thought the 8341 had a narrower soundstage and less apparent power ... watching movies scenes was quite a bit better with the Type 20s.

These are all subjective impressions, but I was not overly impressed with the 8341 for the price even though it was a very good speaker. I would have paid $6,000 and kept the Type 20s if the price had been reversed and the 8341s were the cheaper speaker.

 

[Ilkless]

Interestingly, I compared the 8341 to the Hedd Type 20s in my room and was ready to go with whichever sounded better. I actually thought the Type 20s were the better speaker for my own needs, which is listening to music for enjoyment as well as home theater. The Genelec sounded a tad "dirtier" to me, whereas the Type 20s are very clear. I think the AMT tweeter is likely better than Genelec's. I also thought the 8341 had a narrower soundstage and less apparent power ... watching movies scenes was quite a bit better with the Type 20s.

These are all subjective impressions, but I was not overly impressed with the 8341 for the price even though it was a very good speaker. I would have paid $6,000 and kept the Type 20s if the price had been reversed and the 8341s were the cheaper speaker.

The Hedd AMT is coloured. Benignly so, but nonetheless coloured. You can perceive as clarity, but there's no pretending it as fidelity compared to the Genelec.

 

[Purité Audio]

Really do you have comparative measurements, the Hedd’s don’t sound coloured compared to GRIMM, Kii, D&D .
Keith

 

[q3cpma]

Interestingly, I compared the 8341 to the Hedd Type 20s in my room and was ready to go with whichever sounded better. I actually thought the Type 20s were the better speaker for my own needs, which is listening to music for enjoyment as well as home theater. The Genelec sounded a tad "dirtier" to me, whereas the Type 20s are very clear. I think the AMT tweeter is likely better than Genelec's. I also thought the 8341 had a narrower soundstage and less apparent power ... watching movies scenes was quite a bit better with the Type 20s.

These are all subjective impressions, but I was not overly impressed with the 8341 for the price even though it was a very good speaker. I would have paid $6,000 and kept the Type 20s if the price had been reversed and the 8341s were the cheaper speaker.

Less "apparent power" is very much believable, the big woofer is probably able to handle more than tiny low sensitivity oval "woofers". As said, you can see in the measurements that Genelec has no problem whatsoever with its tweeter, so any difference must be in the wrong direction, if it does exist.
Most importantly, loudspeakers with this compact layout always have suboptimal dispersion characteristics, as drivers aren't aligned. Coaxials are the complete opposite, with one kind of optimal layout being the point source. See the Neumann KH310 (which is arguably the best of the bunch) or Dynaudio LYD48 for example:

If you add to that the vertical directivity problems usually associated with ribbons, the fact that HEDD still doesn't provide measurements apart from a very smoothed on-axis in their manuals (while they answered "in a few weeks" to my 2019 mail) and their linearizer thing being basically a software based DSP to correct phase, but only in proprietary formats (no LADSPA/LV2 plugin for UNIX peasants), I simply don't see the point.

 

[thewas]

Really do you have comparative measurements, the Hedd’s don’t sound coloured compared to GRIMM, Kii, D&D .
Keith

Sound & Recording measured the HEDD Type 30 and the measurements are not really on par with Genelec, Neumann etc.
https://www.soundandrecording.de/equipment/hedd-type-30-3-wege-monitor-mit-amt-hochtoener-im-test/

 

[jonfitch]

Interestingly, I compared the 8341 to the Hedd Type 20s in my room and was ready to go with whichever sounded better. I actually thought the Type 20s were the better speaker for my own needs, which is listening to music for enjoyment as well as home theater. The Genelec sounded a tad "dirtier" to me, whereas the Type 20s are very clear. I think the AMT tweeter is likely better than Genelec's. I also thought the 8341 had a narrower soundstage and less apparent power ... watching movies scenes was quite a bit better with the Type 20s.

These are all subjective impressions, but I was not overly impressed with the 8341 for the price even though it was a very good speaker. I would have paid $6,000 and kept the Type 20s if the price had been reversed and the 8341s were the cheaper speaker.

According to Harman 30-35% of perception of sound quality comes from the bass. Did you run any correction with GLM?

 

[Robert394]

According to Harman 30-35% of perception of sound quality comes from the bass. Did you run any correction with GLM?

No, but I didn't think that was going to make the difference for things like soundstage and the other qualities I preferred in the Type 20s. Again, remember I wasn't using these for professional applications.

I was pretty underwhelmed when I compared the Genelec 8030s to the Adam A7xs at Guitar Center also (even more so actually). I may just not be a fan of the Genelec sound but in both cases I thought they were outperformed by the Adam or Hedd speakers as well as being pretty overpriced for the quality I was hearing -- not to say they weren't good speakers.

Now, a mix engineer might have a different perspective and that's fine. I'm a recreational listener. I will mention that the entire reason I bought the Genelec to compare at the same time as the Type 20s (when both were within the return window) is I figured the Genelec might be the superior speaker, but it just didn't seem to be the case in my personal opinion.

 

[Ilkless]

Sound & Recording measured the HEDD Type 30 and the measurements are not really on par with Genelec, Neumann etc.
https://www.soundandrecording.de/equipment/hedd-type-30-3-wege-monitor-mit-amt-hochtoener-im-test/

I'm very puzzled by why the HEDD AMT (which I've heard extensively) is so ragged, unlike the ADAM S-series AMT. It measures more closely to the Goldenear AMT (which I thought was even worse by some margin). I think exposed screwheads in the waveguide and the thick bars of the grille on the HEDD contribute to it, compared to the much lower-profile grille and lack of exposed screwheads near the tweeter.

 

[TimVG]

I'm very puzzled by why the HEDD AMT (which I've heard extensively) is so ragged, unlike the ADAM S-series AMT. It measures more closely to the Goldenear AMT (which I thought was even worse by some margin). I think exposed screwheads in the waveguide and the thick bars of the grille on the HEDD contribute to it, compared to the much lower-profile grille and lack of exposed screwheads near the tweeter.

Also a listening window average would be useful compared to a single on-axis measurement as given here.

 

[Ilkless]

Also a listening window average would be useful compared to a single on-axis measurement as given here.

Definitely. It wasn't outright unpleasurable to listen to like the Goldenear tweeter, just discernably, subtly coloured, so I'm willing to accept it is some sort of local interference, like Revel. It's just weird that ADAM S2V/S3V has a very similar transducer that entirely avoids it.

I really, really wanted to like HEDD because they are the freshest offering in their price segment and form factor, and teardowns show excellent parts and build quality. No one else in the segment for their entry-level 2-ways has a well-documented and measured amp module (ICEPower). There's some stuff the HEDD Type 07 does great. Wonderful midbass, male vocals are a treat. Upper midrange a tad recessed. I would like to see measurements because the Type 05 only has OK measurements.

 

[thewas]

I was pretty underwhelmed when I compared the Genelec 8030s to the Adam A7xs at Guitar Center also (even more so actually). I may just not be a fan of the Genelec sound but in both cases I thought they were outperformed by the Adam or Hedd speakers as well as being pretty overpriced for the quality I was hearing -- not to say they weren't good speakers.

A 6,5" monitor (A7x) has usually more SPL and deeper bass than a 5" one (8030), the 8040 would be the Genelec equivalent.
But I agree, the Adam A7x has a more "pleasant Hifi" tuning and is often preferred at direct comparison in such shops where many monitors are placed close and also act as a partial bass absorber, same happened to a musician I know who preferred them to (the also 5") KH120, but sold them after a year in his studio. But as you say for a recreational listener the only thing that matters is what gives you more joy with the music you listen to, so you did the right choice.

 

[q3cpma]

A 6,5" monitor (A7x) has usually more SPL and deeper bass than a 5" one (8030), the 8040 would be the Genelec equivalent.
But I agree, the Adam A7x has a more "pleasant Hifi" tuning and is often preferred at direct comparison in such shops where many monitors are placed close and also act as a partial bass absorber, same happened to a musician I know who preferred them to (the also 5") KH120, but sold them after a year in his studio. But as you say for a recreational listener the only thing that matters is what gives you more joy with the music you listen to, so you did the right choice.

The real problem is that this first impression may fade with time, leaving you only with an inferior speaker whose sound you're now used to.

 

[Robert394]

In defense of the Hedd speakers, professional reviewers seem to like them quite a bit. This was one factor in my decision to purchase them, despite the measurement issues being discussed here.

There is quite a disparity between how Sound on Sound and these other pro speaker review sites describe the Hedd monitors and how they are described here. Lots of gushing reviews:

https://tapeop.com/reviews/gear/118/type-30-active-monitors/
"Spoiler alert! This active, three-way, midfield monitor from HEDD is so incredible, I purchased a pair for my personal studio. "

https://www.musicradar.com/reviews/hedd-audio-type-20
"Outperforming monitor speakers twice the price, they are a worthy investment for the serious producer or mixing/mastering engineer. After only an hour of testing them in our studio, we’d already reached for our credit card."

When two reviewers like a product so much they buy it, that says something to me.

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/hedd-type-20
Pros:

• Classy electro-acoustics and engineering result in a fundamentally great monitor.
• Genuinely exceptional mid-range character.
• The Lineariser adds a new element to monitoring performance.

Cons:

• None

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/hedd-type-07

Pros

• Superb sonic performance.
• Easy to listen to whilst being impressively analytical.
• Optional digital interfaces add AES3 and USB 2 connectivity as well as audio-over-IP functionality.
• Well-priced for the performance on offer.

Cons

• None, other than the rear-panel placement of the volume, power on/off and source select cont

"These are INCREDIBLE in the top end, the clarity, is just ridiculous ... I'll stop gushing about them. I think they're in my top 5 speakers I've listened to."

 

[q3cpma]

In defense of the Hedd speakers, professional reviewers seem to like them quite a bit. This was one factor in my decision to purchase them, despite the measurement issues being discussed here.

There is quite a disparity between how Sound on Sound and these other pro speaker review sites describe the Hedd monitors and how they are described here. Lots of gushing reviews:

https://tapeop.com/reviews/gear/118/type-30-active-monitors/
"Spoiler alert! This active, three-way, midfield monitor from HEDD is so incredible, I purchased a pair for my personal studio. "

https://www.musicradar.com/reviews/hedd-audio-type-20
"Outperforming monitor speakers twice the price, they are a worthy investment for the serious producer or mixing/mastering engineer. After only an hour of testing them in our studio, we’d already reached for our credit card."

When two reviewers like a product so much they buy it, that says something to me.

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/hedd-type-20
Pros:

• Classy electro-acoustics and engineering result in a fundamentally great monitor.
• Genuinely exceptional mid-range character.
• The Lineariser adds a new element to monitoring performance.

Cons:

• None

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/hedd-type-07

Pros

• Superb sonic performance.
• Easy to listen to whilst being impressively analytical.
• Optional digital interfaces add AES3 and USB 2 connectivity as well as audio-over-IP functionality.
• Well-priced for the performance on offer.

Cons

• None, other than the rear-panel placement of the volume, power on/off and source select cont

"These are INCREDIBLE in the top end, the clarity, is just ridiculous ... I'll stop gushing about them. I think they're in my top 5 speakers I've listened to."

Well, guess you're starting to see the emperor's skin.