Furniture maker looking for diy loudspeaker recommendations

[Nedjohnson]

Hello,

I’m looking for recommendations for a project I’m working on for a client. I’m building him a record console cabinet and want to put the highest quality speakers in which will work with a tube amp kit that will all be build into a cabinet. I’m working with an electronics guy who has experience building amps and speakers. My requirements are, $1500-2000 budget for amp and speakers combined. The speakers box needs to be about 22x12(w)x15(d). But these measurements can be adjusted to fit an existing design by +/- 2 inches. Depth could be much shallower as well to match the existing speaker design. Also I prefer the port to be in the front but if it would be better to put in that back, that works too. Which combo would you go with? I really appreciate any input/suggestions!

 

[GXAlan]

Why tubes and why build? I ask because you generally get economies of scale buying mass produced speakers.

A popular DIY choice is using the JBL

JBL Professional Control 328C

8" Coaxial Ceiling Loudspeaker with HF Compression Driver ...

jblpro.com

 

[Nedjohnson]

The client wants tubes, they will be exposed, built in to the cabinet along with the 2 speakers on either side. Buying a kit makes it easier for us to customize the face plate and dials. Ceiling speakers aren’t what I’m looking for but thank you.

 

[312elements]

The client wants tubes, they will be exposed, built in to the cabinet along with the 2 speakers on either side. Buying a kit makes it easier for us to customize the face plate and dials. Ceiling speakers aren’t what I’m looking for but thank you.

How many watts does the tube amp kit put out?

 

[GXAlan]

The client wants tubes, they will be exposed, built in to the cabinet along with the 2 speakers on either side. Buying a kit makes it easier for us to customize the face plate and dials. Ceiling speakers aren’t what I’m looking for but thank you.

Artbook Shelf Speaker Kit

*Price is for one pair (two speakers)Passive speaker. Recommended amp power 3 - 100 watts16” h x 14” w x 12.5” dFrequency Response*: about 40 Hz - about 18 kHzSensitivity: 96 dBNominal Impedance: 8 ohms (minimum 6 ohms)Recommended Power: 3-100 watts *This item is available for immediate...

ojas.nyc

Think of the ceiling speaker as a concentric driver with crossover built in and economies of scale. It’s also going to be efficient which allows you to get the most out of tubes.

OJAS makes regular speakers using those as the drivers.

 

[JustJones]

Madisound sells kits, this might work with your dimensions ? Sorry if this isn't what you're asking about.

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...6-10-2-way-kit-pair-based-on-the-classic-a25/

 

[312elements]

This would be my suggestion for the speakers. The design of the box is fairly forgiving. Just order the kit without the box obviously. With this particular design, the bigger the box, the deeper the bass. With a larger speaker cabinet, it performs best sealed (no port).

I make this suggestion with a lot of assumptions. First is that they’re not going to measure well, but I’d argue that most if not all designs in a built-in like this are compromised. You can’t toe the speakers in, the height is probably less than the ideal position, etc, etc. if you wanted a well measuring system you wouldn’t build them onto a cabinet like this.

That said, these speakers are a lot of fun and reminiscent of something that would have been built into a console in the 60’s and they’ll do fine with a tube amp. Basically what I’m saying is that I think I understand the design brief and I think this is the best solution to the problem.

Seas A26 10" 2-way Kit Pair (based on the classic A25)

SEAS A26 speaker kit based on the classic A25 design. Kit includes matched drivers, crossover components, and assembly documentation for a pair of speakers.

www.madisoundspeakerstore.com

 

[312elements]

Madisound sells kits, this might work with your dimensions ? Sorry if this isn't what you're asking about.

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...6-10-2-way-kit-pair-based-on-the-classic-a25/

Damn! You beat me to it. I agree 100%

 

[JustJones]

They also have a more forgiving coaxial kit which might work better in the proposed application.

Seas Loki MKII Coaxial Kit Parts Only - Each

7" coaxial driver speaker kit from the highly regarded Seas Prestige line. The driver used is the SEAS Prestige T18REX/XFC (H1353) 7" Coaxial. Each kit includes one driver and one crossover.

www.madisoundspeakerstore.com

Notes:

While creating a wonderful sound stage and imaging in an ideal setup on speaker stands, the LOKI also excels in non-traditional arrangements. We have auditioned the speaker in many unusual locations (on-wall, in ceiling, bookshelf, unevenly spaced, up in the warehouse rafters, etc) with very acceptable performance in every case. This is the most forgiving speaker for difficult locations that we have heard, so don't be afraid to get creative.

 

[DVDdoug]

Hopefully the "electronics guy" is using speaker design software. He can find (woofer) drivers that can be optimized within the dimensional limitations.

There are always compromises and trade-offs in speaker design and so hopefully he understands the client's requirements and expectations.

Because of long bass wavelengths the port can go in the front or back (or top or bottom) as long as it has room to "breath"... You don't want to block a rear port by putting the cabinet against a wall. Or, sometimes a sealed cabinet is better (or has more-desirable trade-offs) depending on the driver parameters and box dimensions. Often a rear port is used simply so the front panel can be smaller and still accommodate 2 or 3 drivers and maybe a horn or waveguide.

The higher cost of a tube amp may cut into the speaker's share of the budget. And you probably won't get a "great" tube amp with a limited budget... but that's the client's preference.

 

[kemmler3D]

If you are using a tube amp (understandable if aesthetics are a priority) then you are limited in terms of power. It might be worth hunting down a transmission line design if there is space in the cabinet, so you can get higher efficiency / sensitivity out of the drivers and make the most of the watts you'll have.

 

[GXAlan]

I still think that JBL ceiling speaker is the way to go. The Seas 7” coaxial is going to too hard to drive to room filling levels with the tube…

 

[Nedjohnson]

How many watts does the tube amp kit put out?

https://www.tubedepot.com/products/elekit-tu-8200-stereo-tube-amplifier-kit

This is the amp kit we were planning on using. But also we’re open to different suggestions that might better match a speaker design we find.

 

[kemmler3D]

https://www.tubedepot.com/products/elekit-tu-8200-stereo-tube-amplifier-kit

This is the amp kit we were planning on using. But also we’re open to different suggestions that might better match a speaker design we find.

Aha, up to 8.2 watts per channel... with 60w of heat to dissipate while the amp is on.

Good that the amp will be exposed, then.

This is a fraction of what a typical solid state amplifier puts out these days, so most speakers are designed with more power in mind. In order to get decent sound you're going to want to look for designs that reliably achieve more than 91dB/W from 100hz on up, at least.

I am not sure how much work you're willing to put into the speaker portion of the cabinet, or how much space is allocated to it, but when tube amps were popular, so were horn speakers, largely for this reason.

 

[Nedjohnson]

Artbook Shelf Speaker Kit

*Price is for one pair (two speakers)Passive speaker. Recommended amp power 3 - 100 watts16” h x 14” w x 12.5” dFrequency Response*: about 40 Hz - about 18 kHzSensitivity: 96 dBNominal Impedance: 8 ohms (minimum 6 ohms)Recommended Power: 3-100 watts *This item is available for immediate...

ojas.nyc

Think of the ceiling speaker as a concentric driver with crossover built in and economies of scale. It’s also going to be efficient which allows you to get the most out of tubes.

OJAS makes regular speakers using those as the drivers.

I see, yes we considered other full range speaker brands like lowther or fostex but maybe these would be better. Thanks for the option!

 

[Nedjohnson]

Aha, up to 8.2 watts per channel... with 60w of heat to dissipate while the amp is on.

Good that the amp will be exposed, then.

This is a fraction of what a typical solid state amplifier puts out these days, so most speakers are designed with more power in mind. In order to get decent sound you're going to want to look for designs that reliably achieve more than 91dB/W from 100hz on up, at least.

I am not sure how much work you're willing to put into the speaker portion of the cabinet, or how much space is allocated to it, but when tube amps were popular, so were horn speakers, largely for this reason.

the space is flexible but around 22(h)x 12(w) x 16 (d). I’d love to spend the time and build a horn speaker but I don’t have the know how. I haven’t been able to find plans to copy, know of any that I could use?

 

[kemmler3D]

Artbook Shelf Speaker Kit

*Price is for one pair (two speakers)Passive speaker. Recommended amp power 3 - 100 watts16” h x 14” w x 12.5” dFrequency Response*: about 40 Hz - about 18 kHzSensitivity: 96 dBNominal Impedance: 8 ohms (minimum 6 ohms)Recommended Power: 3-100 watts *This item is available for immediate...

ojas.nyc

Think of the ceiling speaker as a concentric driver with crossover built in and economies of scale. It’s also going to be efficient which allows you to get the most out of tubes.

OJAS makes regular speakers using those as the drivers.

Typically I would not recommend OJAS but in this case we're looking at a real vintage situation and the sensitivity #s are enough to convince me it's a real option here.

 

[Nedjohnson]

Hello,

I’m looking for recommendations for a project I’m working on for a client. I’m building him a record console cabinet and want to put the highest quality speakers in which will work with a tube amp kit that will all be build into a cabinet. I’m working with an electronics guy who has experience building amps and speakers. My requirements are, $1500-2000 budget for amp and speakers combined. The speakers box needs to be about 22x12(w)x15(d). But these measurements can be adjusted to fit an existing design by +/- 2 inches. Depth could be much shallower as well to match the existing speaker design. Also I prefer the port to be in the front but if it would be better to put in that back, that works too. Which combo would you go with? I really appreciate any input/suggestions!

This is our last build and looking to improve and find other better options to improve sound

 

[GXAlan]

Typically I would not recommend OJAS but in this case we're looking at a real vintage situation and the sensitivity #s are enough to convince me it's a real option here.

Yeah, I don’t recommend OJAS, but was pointing out that they build a box around the Ceiling speaker I recommended.

It’s easy enough for the furniture builder to take that JBL driver and put it in a box . That’s the whole point. OJAS cuts away a lot of the wave guide which you probably shouldn’t do.

But it means that the driver itself is pretty solid and you just need to put it in a box with the right amount of volume.

@Nedjohnson
The elekit is great. But definitely need something efficient like the driver I suggested. Not sure if there are other choices, since Fostex is pretty good too.

The problem with Fostex is just that the bass response won’t be there.

 

[Nedjohnson]

Typically I would not recommend OJAS but in this case we're looking at a real vintage situation and the sensitivity #s are enough to convince me it's a real option here.

Is there another tube amp kit that would give us more options?