Fun with vinyl measurements

[aaaakkkk]

On a test record? With what profile stylus?

Not only on test recordings, comparing first pressings of CD and LP, there is a drop in the high-frequency region of the frequency response, starting from the first minute and by about the 18th minute it reaches ~ 2 dB at 10,000 Hz, ~ 4 dB at 15,000 Hz, Microline stylus profile.

 

[Thomas_A]

1khz ( 5cm or 8cm?)
for azimut....? or... crosstalk?
;-)

Well one track would be that but the mono track is for technicians to set level for cutting. What I know Flo use interferometry to measure the tracks. Most of the test records he have measured are off with 0.6-1 dB. Not so with his record but I cannot say how good the Ortofon is since it is a repress of the original record. What we know is that the sweep is off (as already said).

 

[morillon]

Questions arise:
Is this a disc that carefully revisits the classic approaches to tuning aids (with the timing sorting regarding the interest of this)... for the general public?
Or is it intended to help with characterization, a sport that excites the few enthusiasts here based on the Pythons created here...
Or both?

Or should it supplement the existing disc offerings with demanding tests like the IMD, which are very well thought out and not necessarily available yet... but which won't necessarily concern many people...?

As a reminder (and I invite you to observe it), the famous SRT-14A... "For home and laboratory use"
Home?
Laboratory?


;-)

 

[Thomas_A]

Questions arise:
Is this a disc that carefully revisits the classic approaches to tuning aids (with the timing sorting regarding the interest of this)... for the general public?
Or is it intended to help with characterization, a sport that excites the few enthusiasts here based on the Pythons created here...
Or both?

Or should it supplement the existing disc offerings with demanding tests like the IMD, which are very well thought out and not necessarily available yet... but which won't necessarily concern many people...?

As a reminder (and I invite you to observe it), the famous SRT-14A... "For home and laboratory use"
Home?
Laboratory?


;-)

As far as I know the CA-TRS1007 is out of print and there is really nothing with enough quality currently in production. Uses can be from cutting/studios, manufacturers of cartridges, reviewers, and consumers/hobbyists.

 

[morillon]

if such a wait...clearaudio could simply reprint.. ;-)
surprised that it was not done in this case....

 

[Thomas_A]

if such a wait...clearaudio could simply reprint.. ;-)

Clearaudio knows that there is a demand of the CA-TRS1007. Reprints has limits if quality is first priority. I have no clue how many pressing and/or represses have been made already, but perhaps the limit has been reached.

Flo did his test record only for technicians, not for public use. Ortofon made re-presses of that both for their own use and for commercial sales.

If there is a new even better test record in the pipe-line from Flo it is a good thing. It will probably be aimed primarily for technicians, as the first one.

 

[morillon]

for my use, and for a long time...I don't focus on the 1007... ;-)

 

[Balle Clorin]

I am glad I have 3 CA TRS-1007 which 2 are unused and a Mint JVC TRS-1007.,,,
And only one new cartridge to test., I think I am good

 

[morillon]

I am glad I have 3 CA TRS-1007 which 2 are unused and a Mint JVC TRS-1007.,,,
And only one new cartridge to test., I think I am good

its function is nevertheless... very limited ;-)

 

[Balle Clorin]

Not where it matters…

 

[JP]

Not only on test recordings, comparing first pressings of CD and LP, there is a drop in the high-frequency region of the frequency response, starting from the first minute and by about the 18th minute it reaches ~ 2 dB at 10,000 Hz, ~ 4 dB at 15,000 Hz, Microline stylus profile.

As I said, I've not experienced it on test records... unless there was an error. I don't compare CDs and LPs as nothing of what was done in mastering is known. The geometric reality of the groove at inner diameters is well known, though difficult to assess with typical program material.

 

[morillon]

Not where it matters…

We won't agree.. ;-)

(other discs, even if a little less rigorous, will be enough to help with the correct adaptation of the load, capacitance in particular, of our mm ;-) )

 

[Thomas_A]

for my use, and for a long time...I don't focus on the 1007... ;-)

Ok. It has a use though for MM load settings. For adjustments of azimuth and tracking force to minimize crosstalk one can either use a sweep or fixed signals. The requirement is that the tracks and pressing is of the highest quality. VTA is what it is unless you use shims to tilt the cartridge. An IMD track could be good to have but VTA can also be checked visually. Finally the antiskate test which IMO can be adjusted by a combination of tests.

 

[morillon]

Ok. It has a use though for MM load settings. For adjustments of azimuth and tracking force to minimize crosstalk one can either use a sweep or fixed signals. The requirement is that the tracks and pressing is of the highest quality. VTA is what it is unless you use shims to tilt the cartridge. An IMD track could be good to have but VTA can also be checked visually. Finally the antiskate test which IMO can be adjusted by a combination of tests.

There is basically no good solution for anti-skating adjustment...just biases....like the protrac of our cartdriges on our pivot arms.
;-)

 

[Thomas_A]

There is basically no good solution for anti-skating adjustment...just biases....like the protrac of our cartdriges on our pivot arms.
;-)

I agree it is a compromise. As is all other issues. Still when those compromises have been done, what is delivered from those plastic discs still give me suprises. It is probably due to a ”negatve expectation bias”.

 

[narud]

I decided to have a go at amateur retip/cantilever grafting. I had a shure stylus laying around with a severely chiseled tip diamond. I clipped off most of the cantilever and left a stub to slip fit the cantilever from an evg black diamond nude elliptical stylus. these just pull out of the brass tube with the damper and magnet. I cut off that end and used a little jbweld to slip fit over the stub. i cant remember what cart the shure stylus came from, but im pretty sure it was attached to a high inductance body. i measured this with a shure m97he body and this is what came out. this is at 2 grams with the brush down.

not terrible. heres what it looks like

I didnt put this in the cartridge library since this is very much an amateur job.

 

[USER]

Funny story:

After restoring my Nakamichi RX-505 cassette deck (which is a fairly top end deck) I compared the FR of a Green Day Dookie cassette recording against my old CD from my teen years to see how the the cassette version and my work stacked up. I knew full well that this is sort of comparison is ridiculous as differences in mastering, format limitations, and the playback machine all come into play. The results were waaay closer than I expected based on an iZotope RX 11 spectrum analysis....BUT THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE WAS THAT THE CD HAS WHAT SEEMS LIKE AN AZIMUTH ERROR WITH MISMATCHING PAST 10kHz!! (You can also see a small discrepancy on the lowest end pointing to this as well!)

So yeah, there are so many variables at play. And that can include the supposedly reference digital version. Not saying it isn't fun to compare. (And that Nak is nice!)

 

[Balle Clorin]

Shute you did not mix up the files?

 

[USER]

Shute you did not mix up the files?

100% sure. Believe me, I triple checked. Plus the FR extension past 16kHz says its CD.

 

[aaaakkkk]

As I said, I've not experienced it on test records... unless there was an error. I don't compare CDs and LPs as nothing of what was done in mastering is known. The geometric reality of the groove at inner diameters is well known, though difficult to assess with typical program material.

Am I correct in understanding that there are only two test records (JVC TRS-1007 & JVC TRS-1005) on which there is no drop in high frequencies on the internal tracks?