From Marantz AVR to Emotiva AVP

[alik1006]

I hear you, hard to accept for people who went with Marantz for whatever reason and had to pay significantly more. I always knew about the possibility of paying more for less going with M instead of D, but was reconfirmed after I replaced my AVR-4308 CI with a Marantz AV7005, then the AV8801+MM8003 and an Anthem 2 channel amp, found no difference in sound quality whatsoever, though it was my subjective impression because there were no supporting measurements available at the time.

As for the recent models, say since 2016 through 2018, you shouldn't be surprised by the measurements because the only differences between the two in the audio signal chain, as mentioned many times, are the HDAMs (vs no HDAMs), and the use of different DAC reconstruction filters. Those are the two things that D+M could use as examples of D+M's claimed individual tuning.

Practically speaking such claims (the sound tuning) are 99% marketing hypes, because both teams must have the same goal, that is, let the amplifiers to just amplify the signal truthfully. The HDAM is an extra buffer stage at the end of the preamp. It is not for EQ or tone control. If done well, it should improve on measurements under certain conditions such as driving low impedance load (power amps) at high output, but from all the measurements done so far, I could not even find any evidence of Marantz's measuring better under any conditions ASR have tried. I guess if he use a test load of under 10 kOhm at above 2 or may be 3 Volts, the Marantz may come out on top, but that's not a sure thing, not until we can see some results.

Isn't X8500H more expensive than SR8015 ($4K vs $3.2K)?
It's less about money and more about Marantz being marketed as a "higher brand" than Denon (unless I miss something). It's like finding that VW measures better than Audi. Possible but surprising.

 

[peng]

Isn't X8500H more expensive than SR8015 ($4K vs $3.2K)?
It's less about money and more about Marantz being marketed as a "higher brand" than Denon (unless I miss something). It's like finding that VW measures better than Audi. Possible but surprising.

My "pay more....comment" referred to the X4700H vs SR7015, X4500H vs SR7013 etc.. The AVR-X8500H has nothing to compare with on the Marantz side, except one can compare its preamp/processor section with the AV8805 as those two were both 2017 models, have the AK4490 DAC, and do share a few pages of block diagrams and schematics in the service manual. As you know, the AVR-X8500H measured much better than the AV8805, and cost much less. The AV8805 has balanced I/Os, so if that is a must than you can't compare those two either.

I don't know much about the SR8015, though naturally it would be more comparable with the Denon AVR-X6700H. The SR8012 that the 8015 replaced, shared some pages in the service manual with the AVR-X6400H. Based on specs, the SR8012 is also more comparable to the AVR-X6400H, but obviously it has a slightly larger power supply. So again, it would appear that the SR8015 is comparable to the X6700H, and is half a notch below the replacement of the X8500H that apparently will be here next year.

 

[Dj7675]

Still hard to accept that Denon measures better than Marantz
Is there a comparison to SR8015? I see Gene's measure but do not see how they compare.

Here is what Sound United sent Amir. This is there measurement but with the same settings Amir uses. Basically it comes to a SINAD of 100 and the X8500 is 103. This appears to be one of the first Marantz that measure well. It is nice to see and hopefully Amir can get some of the new models to measure from members.

 

[peng]

Here is what Sound United sent Amir. This is there measurement but with the same settings Amir uses. Basically it comes to a SINAD of 100 and the X8500 is 103. This appears to be one of the first Marantz that measure well. It is nice to see and hopefully Amir can get some of the new models to measure from members.
View attachment 83975

I bet on Amir's bench, SINAD would show about 1 to 2 dB lower, based on some previous comparisons between Denon's and his, and assuming the Marantz was measured on the same bench they measure the Denon X6700H. Not really sure, just my bet, that's all..

 

[alik1006]

I got my Marantz in 2014 and back then it wasn't too much homework. I knew I wanted B&W (I actually wanted Monitor Audio but it was nearly impossible to find them in the US) and I simply tried everything they had in a showroom and made a pick by ear. Not that I am disappointed, on the contrary, but this time I want to be more meticulous.

Thanks everyone for recommendations.

It seems it makes sense to wait for detailed measurement of SR8015 and for the newer models from Marantz and then decide.
In an unlikely scenario I decide to go with Emotiva, what would be the reasonable amp to carry 11.1 (given that I will have dedicated Amp for LCR)?

 

[alik1006]

So, 1 year later it seems Denon is still the better option out there?
- With the X8500HA out of stock, would X6700H be a good option? I won't need 13.2 in any foreseeable future, 11.2 should be enough. Anything in X8500HA worth chasing?
- Marantz SR8015 got pretty good review. It seems it does not beat X8500HA but against X6700H would it be better choice?

Thank you.