Fosi Audio ZD3 Balanced DAC Review

[mslim]

Looks like it is only a matter of time (hopefully short) before Fosi releases a matching headphone amp to pair with this in terms of looks. Probably the most improved brand in term of priceerformance:looks:function

 

[diaolodoro]

Does the RAW HA1 fit the bill for you diaolodoro? It only lacks a high pass filter on the sub out.

Shenzhen/SMSL RAW-HA1 Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Shenzhenaudio SMSL RAW-HA1 integrated amplifier with DAC and headphone output. It was sent to me by the Shenzhenaudio and is on sale for US $212.49. The user interface is much updated and more elegant than the older SMSL UI. It is easy to use...

www.audiosciencereview.com

The RAW HA1 doesn't have EQ though... (correct me if I'm wrong)

Wiim Ultra?
Has per input EQ and HDMI arc with CEC

More than just a DAC, the WiiM Ultra will give you HDMI ARC with multiple equalization options and room correction too.

WiiM Ultra seems very tempting, but I have no use of a music streamer so it seems wasteful.


It would be great if the Topping D50 III included HDMI ARC...

 

[LewisWaddo]

It’s pretty incredible how far DACs have come. This unit outperforms DACs 50x the price!

 

[Fosi Audio]

Looks like it is only a matter of time (hopefully short) before Fosi releases a matching headphone amp to pair with this in terms of looks. Probably the most improved brand in term of priceerformance:looks:function

Why not? It's on the way!

 

[JSmith]

It's on the way.

But will I need 5 different op-amps on hand, ready to swap depending on what genre I am about to listen to?


JSmith

 

[Fosi Audio]

Thank you all for your interest in the ZD3. The replaceable op-amp design is not meant to encourage everyone to swap op-amps, but rather a feature we designed in response to feedback from many audio DIY enthusiasts. Even with the default op-amps, the ZD3 delivers excellent performance and sound quality, so swapping op-amps is entirely optional.

As for the recommended music genres for different op-amp combinations, these are suggestions compiled based on input from our engineers, our fans, and some reviews, and are intended for reference only. Ultimately, we encourage everyone to trust their own listening experience.

 

[JakeK]

The RAW HA1 doesn't have EQ though... (correct me if I'm wrong)

My mistake, sorry. I'm not sure which one I was thinking/dreaming of now lol! I've deleted my incorrect post.

 

[CedarX]

The replaceable op-amp design is not meant to encourage everyone to swap op-amps, but rather a feature we designed in response to feedback from many audio DIY enthusiasts.

I have absolutely no issue with a feature. It’s always a plus, even if one doesn’t use it or value it that much.

That being said, could explain how your marketing description of the feature (website) is conveying this: it’s not meant to encourage swapping opamps? I read the marketing description as the exact opposite: a strong encouragement to swap opamps! I would even feel dumb and stupid if I don’t follow your recommendations—like “I am completely missing audio greatness if I don’t use opamp XYZ for the genre I’m listening…”

As for the recommended music genres for different op-amp combinations, these are suggestions compiled based on input from our engineers, our fans, and some reviews, and are intended for reference only.

Then don’t call them (FOSI’s) recommendations !!!
Describe it as what it is: “input from reputable audiophiles” or something like that.

And don’t forget to add this disclaimer:

Even with the default op-amps, the ZD3 delivers excellent performance and sound quality, so swapping op-amps is entirely optional.

The reasons I feel so strong about the ZD3 (I rated it “poor”) is that, on one hand Fosi is becoming known for their great value products, but on the other hand, you are ruining it by encouraging your customers to spend a great deal of money—some of these opamps ain’t cheap—on “audiophile chimera”.

Now, I may be wrong about Fosi, and perhaps this is exactly what you guys want: higher end “audiophile” products with much higher profits at less volume.
If it is where Fosi is heading, then why don’t you offer different button colors (a feature ) and recommend specific colors based on the musical genre? That’s probably as “valuable” (ridiculous!) than the opamps recommendations but you could double or triple the price of the ZD3 !!!

 

[CReeDeR]

I have absolutely no issue with a feature. It’s always a plus, even if one doesn’t use it or value it that much.

That being said, could explain how your marketing description of the feature (website) is conveying this: it’s not meant to encourage swapping opamps? I read the marketing description as the exact opposite: a strong encouragement to swap opamps! I would even feel dumb and stupid if I don’t follow your recommendations—like “I am completely missing audio greatness if I don’t use opamp XYZ for the genre I’m listening…”


Then don’t call them (FOSI’s) recommendations !!!
Describe it as what it is: “input from reputable audiophiles” or something like that.

And don’t forget to add this disclaimer:


The reasons I feel so strong about the ZD3 (I rated it “poor”) is that, on one hand Fosi is becoming known for their great value products, but on the other hand, you are ruining it by encouraging your customers to spend a great deal of money—some of these opamps ain’t cheap—on “audiophile chimera”.

Now, I may be wrong about Fosi, and perhaps this is exactly what you guys want: higher end “audiophile” products with much higher profits at less volume.
If it is where Fosi is heading, then why don’t you offer different button colors (a feature ) and recommend specific colors based on the musical genre? That’s probably as “valuable” (ridiculous!) than the opamps recommendations but you could double or triple the price of the ZD3 !!!

Because of people like you, I always lose the desire to read and browse forums. I'm sorry, but it's so exhausting. Criticising is perfectly fine. But meaningless debates like yours are just exhausting. You could well play a role in the series 'What we do in the shadows' as an energy vampire.

Fosi doesn't force anyone to spend money on any opamps. If someone wants to do that, they can. But nobody is forcing you to. I'm thrilled with the sound of the device, even without changing any opamps.

And to rate a product as 'poor' because of such far-fetched problems without having heard the product for yourself and analysing the quality is just ridiculous. Well done Kevin!

 

[AndreaT]

I received mine. Fit’n finish is superb. I connected it to my two dvd/Blu-ray players: one by optical, one by coax, (one DVD-only region free, the other a Blu-ray) to bring the audio digital signal Fosi-converted to the oldish Emotiva Bas-X and a 2.1 system. The TV is a 2004 XBR 16:9 34” with obviously no HDMI. I keep it because the B&W on old movies is unsurpassed. I bypass then the two disc players dacs (likely of orders of magnitude lower quality) to the Fosi. The DAC remote works flawlessly…the audio quality seems to me much improved at the low volume levels the system is usually played at. The Fosi remote allows me now to control the volume, as the amplifier has no remote.

The only question: the enclosed trigger cable is too short to connect the Fosi to the Emotiva, and the longer trigger cable I had is a 2-channel one (the enclosed short trigger cable is 3-channel). It does not trigger the Emotiva. I ordered a longer 3-channel one and I hope it will work with the Emotiva. Otherwise the amp will stay on auto signal detection mode.

Excellent product with excellent UI. Thank you Fosi!

 

[dlovesmusic]

Because of people like you, I always lose the desire to read and browse forums. I'm sorry, but it's so exhausting. Criticising is perfectly fine. But meaningless debates like yours are just exhausting. You could well play a role in the series 'What we do in the shadows' as an energy vampire.

Fosi doesn't force anyone to spend money on any opamps. If someone wants to do that, they can. But nobody is forcing you to. I'm thrilled with the sound of the device, even without changing any opamps.

And to rate a product as 'poor' because of such far-fetched problems without having heard the product for yourself and analysing the quality is just ridiculous. Well done Kevin!

Agreed 100%!!! I likely will not bother with swapping opamps but if dac A allows opamps swapping, measures identical, and has all the same features as dac B and sells for the same price, to me at least it’s a no brainer which dac I would choose. It’s great to see creativity in a highly competitive market.

Don’t bother with swapping with opamps if you are not interested. The device is not going to have an alarm/reminder/special color light to force you to open up the case to make a opamp swap

 

[Piotr]

Agreed 100%!!! I likely will not bother with swapping opamps but if dac A allows opamps swapping, measures identical, and has all the same features as dac B and sells for the same price, to me at least it’s a no brainer which dac I would choose. It’s great to see creativity in a highly competitive market.

Don’t bother with swapping with opamps if you are not interested. The device is not going to have an alarm/reminder/special color light to force you to open up the case to make a opamp swap

I see your point, and it would hold if the ZD3 were truly a perfect device. However, that is not the case:

• The power supply could be built-in.
• There are issues with HDMI ARC.
• Input volume levels are not being remembered.
• Dolby Digital is not supported.

So, tell me—why make the device more expensive and waste engineering time on features that objectively don’t change anything?

 

[NeLey169]

Thank you all for your interest in the ZD3. The replaceable op-amp design is not meant to encourage everyone to swap op-amps, but rather a feature we designed in response to feedback from many audio DIY enthusiasts. Even with the default op-amps, the ZD3 delivers excellent performance and sound quality, so swapping op-amps is entirely optional.

As for the recommended music genres for different op-amp combinations, these are suggestions compiled based on input from our engineers, our fans, and some reviews, and are intended for reference only. Ultimately, we encourage everyone to trust their own listening experience.

why not support LDAC and USB type C

 

[JSmith]

these are suggestions compiled based on input from our engineers, our fans, and some reviews

Based on what... feelings?

Seriously, your company doesn't need to do this or go down this path.

Also to me it doesn't look good building your initial customer base on great measurements, well priced products and decent customer service to then turn around and start pandering to the audiophool crowd. But hey, Fosi do Fosi (you do you)... best to listen to all fans and not just some though.


JSmith

 

[TonyJZX]

well this is the old Robocop argument

does the ED209 work? who cares

we have long term service contracts we have high skilled workers in voting states who need their jobs

and so if they are making extra money from pandering to the op amp crowd then that's fine

i'm guessing the china market is big on this shit

i dont expect companies to pander to us where we are the 1% that doesnt matter

 

[dlovesmusic]

@Fosi Audio - wonder if this is easy solution. Make a special limited ASR edition of the same dac, solder the opamp slot so it won’t allow swapping of opamps and sell at the same price. That should satisfy both camps

 

[phoenixsong]

@Fosi Audio - wonder if this is easy solution. Make a special limited ASR edition of the same dac, solder the opamp slot so it won’t allow swapping of opamps and sell at the same price. That should satisfy both camps

That would actually increase costs, which leads us back to the question: Does it really matter? Is it about objective gains, or has it become something subjective like pride, ideals/personal beliefs or identity?

 

[Neftun]

I have absolutely no issue with a feature. It’s always a plus, even if one doesn’t use it or value it that much.

That being said, could explain how your marketing description of the feature (website) is conveying this: it’s not meant to encourage swapping opamps? I read the marketing description as the exact opposite: a strong encouragement to swap opamps! I would even feel dumb and stupid if I don’t follow your recommendations—like “I am completely missing audio greatness if I don’t use opamp XYZ for the genre I’m listening…”


Then don’t call them (FOSI’s) recommendations !!!
Describe it as what it is: “input from reputable audiophiles” or something like that.

And don’t forget to add this disclaimer:


The reasons I feel so strong about the ZD3 (I rated it “poor”) is that, on one hand Fosi is becoming known for their great value products, but on the other hand, you are ruining it by encouraging your customers to spend a great deal of money—some of these opamps ain’t cheap—on “audiophile chimera”.

Now, I may be wrong about Fosi, and perhaps this is exactly what you guys want: higher end “audiophile” products with much higher profits at less volume.
If it is where Fosi is heading, then why don’t you offer different button colors (a feature ) and recommend specific colors based on the musical genre? That’s probably as “valuable” (ridiculous!) than the opamps recommendations but you could double or triple the price of the ZD3 !!!

Your reply there comes across as quite… Dunno the word. In my native language we have a saying:

«Lage storm i vannglass»

Translates to making a storm in a glass of water. I’m guessing you pick up on the meaning.

I bought the unit, swapped the op-amps; it came with an extra set. Swapped the ones in my V3 monos as well. It is a fun little exercise, and I might just check out other as well. For the fun of it. Makes more sense than different power cables and usb-cables, and it doesn’t have to be expensive. So why the grief?

 

[dlovesmusic]

That would actually increase costs, which leads us back to the question: Does it really matter? Is it about objective gains, or has it become something subjective like pride, ideals/personal beliefs or identity?

A number of Topping dacs now include i2s as a digital input that has no objective gains compared to using USB, i would classify that as something for audiophiles, subjective like pride......

Does it mean Topping should stop including that as a feature or everyone should vote "poor" on all its dacs that has it?

What about digital filter choices? objectively no one can reliably tell a difference between them. Does it mean if a dac comes equipped with choices of filters instead of just one filter I should vote "poor" on the dac.

It is there if you want to use it, you don't have to touch it if you don't want it.

 

[phoenixsong]

A number of Topping dacs now include i2s as a digital input that has no objective gains compared to using USB, i would classify that as something for audiophiles, subjective like pride......

Does it mean Topping should stop including that as a feature or everyone should vote "poor" on all its dacs that has it?

What about digital filter choices? objectively no one can reliably tell a difference between them. Does it mean if a dac comes equipped with choices of filters instead of just one filter I should vote "poor" on the dac.

It is there if you want to use it, you don't have to touch it if you don't want it.

Sounds like what you're advocating for (more choices without degrading performance) is the exact state of the current product though- opamps can be swapped, but not mandatorily so. So why did you suggest something as extra as "Make a special limited ASR edition of the same dac, solder the opamp slot so it won’t allow swapping of opamps" especially when it goes against what you're defending in the first place?