Focal Trio6ST6 vs PMC 6 for home studio listening room.

[Mysta]

For clarity ive update the post from atc to PMC.

Almost finished my man cave, which somehow got ammended to a mancave/sauna. Wifes had some health concerns since last year. So least I could do was oblige. This means my intended space has been reduced and construction format changed from brick to timber frame build in the back garden. Background info only...
So im left with a room 4.4mx3.2mx2.1m..height restrictions due to building regs.
The structure is cladding to timber, acoustic insulation/plasterboard 16mm(couldn't accomodate a further 12mm panel double barrier to aid soundbleeding) . 2m bifold one side, 1x76cm entry door both aluminium with acoustic glass double glazing. Unfortunately then two oak wooden ghost doors at the end.Wife!
For me its an expensive hobby in music production and dj mixing. Ive attached a very basic plan for perspetive.
I am looking at seeking acoustic treatment however on to speakers.

A friend has some ATC 25pros which ive listeb to, to powerful and problematic for my space reeulting in a waste of money.

I do like the idea of monitoring options whereby sound can be adjusted on the speakers to imitate smaller form speakers. The unforgiving ATCs are appealing but too much and been steered to pmc 6 not the 6-2 for auditioning.

Currently Im using Adams A7Xs alongside Audeze LCD-Xs with a Flux Mentor Amp.
The adams will be used likely for the dj mixing, refurbed my sl1210mk2's and use a xone96 mixer.
This will be integrared with the production set up using a RME Fureface800 soundcard.
Hit me with your thoughts before I start travelling to audition them both and any other speakers for monitoring come to mind?
Not the best layout but it is what it is until the builds finalised and my have a few extra centimeters i believ but negligible.

Thankyou.

 

[dfuller]

In my experience, the ATCs are the better speaker. Focals sound kind of messy by comparison.

 

[Mysta]

In my experience, the ATCs are the better speaker. Focals sound kind of messy by comparison.

Yes ive got to audition and was reading another thread re colour.
The thing is the room size for the ATCs and sound reproduction. Will it be wasted and simply to much.

 

[Mysta]

Ok so no point ive decided in the ATCs whilst the punch and sound is great after chatting with my friend, they're going to cause more issues due to room sizeand low end resonance.

Audition list Trio6ST6 and PMC 6.
Any other suggestions welcome.
Once done I'm going to get either GIK or a recommended local acoustic person in to recommend acoustic fixes and see if a subs worth it from there for the low end.
Any other contributions welcome. Thanks

 

[Rettica]

I suggest PSI A23m. Much much better than Focal

 

[dfuller]

Ok so no point ive decided in the ATCs whilst the punch and sound is great after chatting with my friend, they're going to cause more issues due to room sizeand low end resonance.

Audition list Trio6ST6 and PMC 6.
Any other suggestions welcome.
Once done I'm going to get either GIK or a recommended local acoustic person in to recommend acoustic fixes and see if a subs worth it from there for the low end.
Any other contributions welcome. Thanks

I would skip both of these in favor of KH310s

 

[Matt_Holland]

Neuman
Genelec
Ascilab

Nice little space you’re building. Are you in the UK? If so my brother might be selling his Barefoot 02.

 

[Mysta]

Yes uk based. Thanks.
Im a bit cautious second hand. Sounds daft, i feel second hand speakers are like buying second hand shoes.
However @dfuller im starting to lean towards those KH310s for the space and closed bass. Again auditioning will be important.
Whilst i could go to 10k speakers , i cant quantify it for the space and my use, i got carried away on the atcs till i spoke with my friend whilst auditioning the older 25as.. Add on acoustic treatment and those bifolds and door alone im learning will need around 1.5k of acoustic curtain to control reflections.
Those psis are great just cant justify the price my end. Im trying to reign myself in but get it as right as I can, kind of one shot in life at this stage

 

[Matt_Holland]

Yes uk based. Thanks.
Im a bit cautious second hand. Sounds daft, i feel second hand speakers are like buying second hand shoes.
However @dfuller im starting to lean towards those KH310s for the space and closed bass. Again auditioning will be important.
Whilst i could go to 10k speakers , i cant quantify it for the space and my use, i got carried away on the atcs till i spoke with my friend whilst auditioning the older 25as.. Add on acoustic treatment and those bifolds and door alone im learning will need around 1.5k of acoustic curtain to control reflections.
Those psis are great just cant justify the price my end. Im trying to reign myself in but get it as right as I can, kind of one shot in life at this stage

Fair enough.

We have KH310 where I work and they are very good. Insanely linear, deep bass and pin point imaging.

 

[Mysta]

Im leaning on paper and price for the space the kh310s until i listen to them in comparison to the Trio6ST6s. Will alao audition the pmc6 to see.i personally feel any above this price and sound wise could be overkill for my pocket and room.

 

[Matt_Holland]

Even KH150 would suit a room of this size.

 

[Mysta]

Even KH150 would suit a room of this size.

Id prefer 3 way thanks

 

[Mysta]

Thanks for all the posts qnd insights.
The rooms a challenge, whilst built not yet fullu complete internally but the structure, windows and doors in place.
Shortlist for audition so likley dribe to kmr in london later this year...
1. Barefoot Footprint02 Gen2
2. Neumann KH310
3. Focal Trio6 ST6
4. PMC6
No particular order. The focals on paper have interesting features.
Neumanns price and suitability for the room along woth closed bass.
Bareroot bass direction may suit layout and room size without going ro low end.
Pmc6 want to hear them and see.

 

[Matt_Holland]

Thanks for all the posts qnd insights.
The rooms a challenge, whilst built not yet fullu complete internally but the structure, windows and doors in place.
Shortlist for audition so likley dribe to kmr in london later this year...
1. Barefoot Footprint02 Gen2
2. Neumann KH310
3. Focal Trio6 ST6
4. PMC6
No particular order. The focals on paper have interesting features.
Neumanns price and suitability for the room along woth closed bass.
Bareroot bass direction may suit layout and room size without going ro low end.
Pmc6 want to hear them and see.

If you can find measurements for any of these it could really help you make an informed decision. As far as I have seen only brands 1 and 2 have accuracy and optimal room interaction as their primary goal.

 

[Puddingbuks]

PMC review on ASR: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/pmc-result6-monitor-review.60937/

Skip that speaker.

The room will ALWAYS be a problem, reverb and standing waves will mess up that nice linear input to the speakers, at your ears it will be a mess. I don’t believe the atc scm 25 will be too much for your room, no speaker will be imo. It only has to be tamed and flattened in the low end. The atc’s don’t have much subbass.

Use some room treatment (absorption panels) and DSP. I use sonarworks soundID which gives me great results on a set of focal Solo st6 and focal cms sub in my work/study room. Switching between corrected and original sound is massive.

 

[Mysta]

PMC review on ASR: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/pmc-result6-monitor-review.60937/

The room will ALWAYS be a problem, reverb and standing waves will mess up that nice linear input to the speakers, at your ears it will be a mess. I don’t believe the atc scm 25 will be too much for your room, no speaker will be imo. It only has to be tamed and flattened in the low end. The atc’s don’t have much subbass.

Use some room treatment (absorption panels) and DSP. I use sonarworks soundID which gives me great results on a set of focal Solo st6 in my work/study room. Switching between corrected and original sound is massive.

Yes im looking at an array of options from acoustic curtains, bass traps, ceiling clouds, wall panels.
I think my friend with the atcs has a contact for measurement and recommendations. Until i decide on the room layout and speakers im a little stuck.
Thanks re the pmc6s they out. Saves me time thank you.

 

[Matt_Holland]

PMC review on ASR: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/pmc-result6-monitor-review.60937/

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Skip that speaker.

Agree. PMC are a great brand but their claims about accuracy of response have never been backed up by their own data and the few products of theirs that have been independently measured have been shown to be bad in many areas of performance. Personally from what I’ve heard from their speakers, they make a nice “showroom” kind of sound. Exciting and hyped, but not accurate.

The room will ALWAYS be a problem, reverb and standing waves will mess up that nice linear input to the speakers, at your ears it will be a mess.

I don’t entirely agree because in a nearfield setup the direct sound should massively dominate the heard experience. So you want a speaker with flat on axis response as this is pretty much what you will hear, unlike with a mid/far field (hifi) setup where the room will contribute a lot more.

Use some room treatment (absorption panels) and DSP. I use sonarworks soundID which gives me great results on a set of focal Solo st6 and focal cms sub in my work/study room. Switching between corrected and original sound is massive.

Choose accurate speakers, absorb flutter echoes and bring the overall reverb time down. Room should still sound natural to have a conversation in. Very important is to use EQ to reduce any large SPL peaks due to standing waves.

Edit to add: with a room your size I wouldn’t expect to be using EQ higher than about 400-500Hz as below this the room will dominate. Above this the direct sound will dominate in a nearfield setup.

 

[Mysta]

Im in a broad range for a demo a few months from now and honestly in circles, so I neef to demo.
Barefoot gen2 situating with acoustic pads on a 2m desk with 2x27imcj monitors betwern close to the wall could ne challenging.. Basstraps also need to be accomodated regardless of speaker.

Neumann KH310 are in my head from research a box tick.

The ATC25a s could work and then im into interest free budget realm

PSI 25s!

What i would like to ask, blank canvas and working a 2mx.8m desk and a 1.6m x. 6m dj console into the room bearing in mind the 2 oak ghost doors both 0.76m, aluminium door 1m and the 2m bifold.

Setup ideas? Cause im struggling.

 

[Mysta]

Im shortlisted the following after digging
Focal Trio6ST6
Neuman KH310
Genelics 8341a see below re dsp
Top end psi a25ms... Not sure on room suitability.

Im going to get in touch with GIK acoustics uk for advice. Im going to strugglw with a bass cloud trap due to height restrictions and exisitng lights.

So pending this im looking at hardware DSP to place between the daws RME Fireface 800 soundcard and the final speaker choice.

Thoughts on the DiracDSP 2in 4out TRS with the UMIK2.
I cant honestly justify the price of a Trinnov Nova for my needs. On paper wish i could.
This is where the Genelics came in, however I seemed to have gone full circle to the Focals which consistently pop up on my radar and dedicated dsp hardwarw appears more versatile and can also be used with my older existing Adams A7xs.

Once all in place considering an active bass trap ie

Active Bass Trap by Bag End, Tunable Electronic Bass Trap

Active Bass Trap by Bag End, Tunable Electronic Bass Trap for Low frequency room acoustics, precise powerful tool for acoustical design

bagend.com

Speakers will be mounted on the desk with using 4 iso76 pucks for each speaker.

Thoughts as Ive picked up and read a lot of theory on kit and not being an audio engineer expert etc. Could do with some insights...

Or Im I simpky fighting a losing battle with the room