Focal Clear Review (headphone)

[amirm]

There is some evidence that low-frequency stimuli for just 90 seconds at moderately perceived loudness can significantly affect cochlear physiology, which could make the ear more prone to damage at the higher frequencies it's more sensitive to. Take care of your ears people!

No one listens to 90 seconds of 30 Hz tone in music. The peaks last milliseconds let alone seconds or 90 seconds.

Just like you don't eat ice cream three times a day, no one sits there to only listen to music with 30 Hz tone all day long. I listen to pretty low level music most of the time but then a good track comes and I crank it up to enjoy -- whether it is my main system or headphones. Then back to normal level again. If you don't do this, then fine. But please don't confuse noise studies with music listening and try to scare people into some other argument.

 

[JIW]

Thanks for the max peak SPL calculation corrections, I wrote my comment in a bit of a rush. As for frequency distribution and perceived loudness, the latter is not necessarily a good indicator of NIHL risk. There is some evidence that low-frequency stimuli for just 90 seconds at moderately perceived loudness can significantly affect cochlear physiology, which could make the ear more prone to damage at the higher frequencies it's more sensitive to. Take care of your ears people!

I was not suggesting listening at those levels was harmless or even a good idea. Rather, I questioned whether it really was very loud independent of what one listens to.

For a little test of this, using HD600s, I tried listening to two different pieces of music at the same high level - around 100 dB SPL - aligned by track RMS. According to Sennheiser's specified sensitivity of 103 dB SPL at 0 dBV input, this would require around -3 dBV average level.

The first was 46:55 to 17:05 from the wav download of

played through iTunes at full volume.

For the entire track, RMS is -12.35 dBFS and peak is 0 dBFS, so the amplifier's output was set such that 0 dB FS corresponds to about ~9 dBV giving an RMS SPL around 100 dB and peak SPL around 112 dB. However, for the section, RMS is -9.9 dBFS and peak is 0 dBFS, so RMS SPL is around 102 dB. This was already somewhat uncomfortable but I could listen to it for a while.

The second was 1:47 to 1:57 from

played through Tidal Hi-Fi and controlling volume through macOS. At full volume, the transmission is bit perfect.

For the entire track, RMS is -11.2 dBFS and peak is 0 dBFS, so the amplifier's output was set such that 0 dB FS corresponds to about ~6 dBV giving an RMS SPL around 98 dB and peak SPL around 109 dB. For the section, RMS is -11.0 dBFS and peak is 0 dBFS, so RMS SPL is also around 98 dB. This was really uncomfortably loud and I wanted to turn it down immediately (and did once I was done testing).

Also, according to YouTube (right click -> Stats for nerds), the loudness of the first piece is 3.8 dB higher than the second one (content loudness of 2.3 dB compared to 6.1 dB). Since the section used from the first track has about 2 dB higher RMS level than the entire track and the volume was set 2.5 dB higher, they should have been equally loud by this measure.


Equipment used: Sennheiser HD600, Sabaj Da2, MacBook Pro (Retina, 13-inch, Early 2015) running macOS 10.15.7.

 

[pwjazz]

No one listens to 90 seconds of 30 Hz tone in music. The peaks last milliseconds let alone seconds or 90 seconds.

Just like you don't eat ice cream three times a day, no one sits there to only listen to music with 30 Hz tone all day long. I listen to pretty low level music most of the time but then a good track comes and I crank it up to enjoy -- whether it is my main system or headphones. Then back to normal level again. If you don't do this, then fine. But please don't confuse noise studies with music listening and try to scare people into some other argument.

I personally just go by the OSHA recommendations and use a cheap SPL meter occasionally to make sure I'm not going out of bounds. In my personal experience, the biggest problem is in long listening sessions where I gradually turn up the volume to compensate for fatigue and then end up listening louder than I should.

Anyway, the beauty of this is that it's measurable and somewhat standardized.

 

[solderdude]

I was not suggesting listening at those levels was harmless or even a good idea. Rather, I questioned whether it really was very loud independent of what one listens to.

For a little test of this, using HD600s, I tried listening to two different pieces of music at the same high level - around 100 dB SPL - aligned by track RMS. According to Sennheiser's specified sensitivity of 103 dB SPL at 0 dBV input, this would require around -3 dBV average level.

The first was 46:55 to 17:05 from the wav download of

played through iTunes at full volume.

For the entire track, RMS is -12.35 dBFS and peak is 0 dBFS, so the amplifier's output was set such that 0 dB FS corresponds to about ~9 dBV giving an RMS SPL around 100 dB and peak SPL around 112 dB. However, for the section, RMS is -9.9 dBFS and peak is 0 dBFS, so RMS SPL is around 102 dB. This was already somewhat uncomfortable but I could listen to it for a while.

The second was 1:47 to 1:57 from

played through Tidal Hi-Fi and controlling volume through macOS. At full volume, the transmission is bit perfect.

For the entire track, RMS is -11.2 dBFS and peak is 0 dBFS, so the amplifier's output was set such that 0 dB FS corresponds to about ~6 dBV giving an RMS SPL around 98 dB and peak SPL around 109 dB. For the section, RMS is -11.0 dBFS and peak is 0 dBFS, so RMS SPL is also around 98 dB. This was really uncomfortably loud and I wanted to turn it down immediately (and did once I was done testing).

Also, according to YouTube (right click -> Stats for nerds), the loudness of the first piece is 3.8 dB higher than the second one (content loudness of 2.3 dB compared to 6.1 dB). Since the section used from the first track has about 2 dB higher RMS level than the entire track and the volume was set 2.5 dB higher, they should have been equally loud by this measure.


Equipment used: Sennheiser HD600, Sabaj Da2, MacBook Pro (Retina, 13-inch, Early 2015) running macOS 10.15.7.

That coincides with my measurements on HD650 using a scope.

Here the music is playing at quite uncomfortably loud levels. One may use these levels for listening ‘in the recording’ for analytic purposes to check for distortions or find noise levels in the recording.
These levels are certainly NOT used for pleasantly enjoying music and one, for sure, cannot maintain to listen to these levels for the whole song.
It should be noted though that this is a DR13 recording and this particular part was ‘just’ 12dB DR.

When listening to DR20 recordings the average levels will be quite loud but the peak levels will reach about the same levels.
The used amplifier started clipping the highest peaks already which added a sharp ‘edge’ at certain peaks.
I would not call those peaks anywhere near ‘pain levels’ though but ‘very loud’ none the less.

This resulted in the following (rounded off) numbers:
RMS levels = 1.35V = 5.6mW = 105dB (average)
Peak levels = 15VPP = 5.3VRMS = 88mW = 117dB peak
calculated DR = 11.9dB for that 10 sec part of the song.

 

[JIW]

That coincides with my measurements on HD650 using a scope.

Here the music is playing at quite uncomfortably loud levels. One may use these levels for listening ‘in the recording’ for analytic purposes to check for distortions or find noise levels in the recording.
These levels are certainly NOT used for pleasantly enjoying music and one, for sure, cannot maintain to listen to these levels for the whole song.
It should be noted though that this is a DR13 recording and this particular part was ‘just’ 12dB DR.

When listening to DR20 recordings the average levels will be quite loud but the peak levels will reach about the same levels.
The used amplifier started clipping the highest peaks already which added a sharp ‘edge’ at certain peaks.
I would not call those peaks anywhere near ‘pain levels’ though but ‘very loud’ none the less.

This resulted in the following (rounded off) numbers:
RMS levels = 1.35V = 5.6mW = 105dB (average)
Peak levels = 15VPP = 5.3VRMS = 88mW = 117dB peak
calculated DR = 11.9dB for that 10 sec part of the song.

Here are the waveforms for the sections of the two tracks I used. First, Boris Brejcha and second, Wintersun.

For comparison, here is the waveform from your trial.

Source: https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/tutorials/power-impedance-etc/

It looks more like my first one. At the levels I had set, I could have probably listened to it for several minutes but not much more either.

Incidentally, I find both of them comfortably loud with 0 dBFS peaks corresponding to around -8.5 dBV, i.e. around 94 dB SPL and 83-84 dB SPL RMS according to Sennheiser's specs. I could listen at that level for hours.

 

[fieldcar]

Public service announcement: Please leave listing at these levels to qualified machines. It will impair your hearing within minutes.

Thanks for posting. I should have left a disclaimer for high volumes. Here is that chart for reference.

 

[CtheArgie]

I feel very lucky to say that after testing all the bass heavy songs in these posts on my Focal Elegia on volume barely tolerable for a few seconds, i could NOT replicate the findings of the Clear. (SMSL-SU8v2 + Topping L30)

I also used the speakers as second "opinion" and I have to say that the bass in the first section recommended by @RME was just mind blowing! The whole house was shaking. My chest was pounding. (RME ADI-2 + Nord NC500 + Focal based DIY speakers)

So, I have to conclude that this is not an Elegia issue, unless mine is a lucky one too.

 

[Martin]

Not really related to the current discussion in this thread, but I finally registered for ASR after years of reading just to comment on this post. After seeing so many rave reviews of the Focal Clear, I was pretty convinced it was the right headphone for me. But when I tried it in-person, I just couldn't shake the feeling there was something very wrong around 1-3khz; the sound was, to me, quite simply grating. It gave me listening fatigue within minutes, and I had a feeling there was a big hump in this area. This review confirms that impression. I have since listened to the Focal Clear four or five more times at various stores and at Can Jam, every time I have the same impression and put them down within ten or twenty seconds. Not trying to dunk on people who own and like this headphone or anything, we all have preferences and personally I can't stand transducers with big emphasis around 1-3k, so it's largely a personal thing.

More broadly, I just want to say to Amir: thank you for everything you do. Your reviews have been very helpful in learning what kind of frequency response characteristics I like, because they allow me to match subjective impressions with the data and "calibrate" my hearing, so to speak. Now I can basically tell whether I'll like a speaker or headphone by looking at the f/r graph, which is a great skill to have, as it cuts down on 90% of useless auditioning. I can also identify issues with frequency response pretty quickly upon hearing a new speaker or headphone. This site is more valuable than 95% of the rest of the internet audio world combined.

Try listening to Boston’s More Than a Feeling without equalization at a reasonably loud volume and you’ll immediately want to take them off and throw them across the room. They do equalize quite nicely. Just don’t plan on listening to Billie Eilish’s Bad Guy at a decent volume once you have.

Martin

 

[AlexHempel]

Ok, so I deleted my earlier post because I completely forgot about the Harman curve and was reading the f/r graph like a speaker (it's been a while since I was into headphones or headphone measurements, hence the mental lapse). But you can still see my original comment quoted in Martin's post for reference. My question is as follows: these seem to follow the 3khz Harman hump pretty well, yet I hated the tonality of them. In fact, I dislike the tonality of most headphones; they all sound too energetic around 1-3khz for me, something I've tried solving with EQ. But my understanding is that the 3khz hump prescribed by the Harman curve has a pretty solid basis in physiology and should emulate good speakers in a treated room. So, am I just a weird deviation from the Harman preference curve? Do I have abnormal ear structure or something?

For reference, my preference for speakers is pretty ordinary. My daily system is an SMSL SU-8 into NC400s into B&W floorstanders with no sub and no EQ. I've always found headphones difficult to listen to and only like specific models from a few brands (Stax, HEDD, Abyss, Shure for IEMs), whereas for speakers I enjoy a solid 70% of what's out there. Curious if anyone with headphone knowledge has thoughts on this.

 

[thewas]

Ok, so I deleted my earlier post because I completely forgot about the Harman curve and was reading the f/r graph like a speaker (it's been a while since I was into headphones or headphone measurements, hence the mental lapse). But you can still see my original comment quoted in Martin's post for reference. My question is as follows: these seem to follow the 3khz Harman hump pretty well, yet I hated the tonality of them. In fact, I dislike the tonality of most headphones; they all sound too energetic around 1-3khz for me, something I've tried solving with EQ. But my understanding is that the 3khz hump prescribed by the Harman curve has a pretty solid basis in physiology and should emulate good speakers in a treated room. So, am I just a weird deviation from the Harman preference curve? Do I have abnormal ear structure or something?

For reference, my preference for speakers is pretty ordinary. My daily system is an SMSL SU-8 into NC400s into B&W floorstanders with no sub and no EQ. I've always found headphones difficult to listen to and only like specific models from a few brands (Stax, HEDD, Abyss, Shure for IEMs), whereas for speakers I enjoy a solid 70% of what's out there. Curious if anyone with headphone knowledge has thoughts on this.

That can be also your individual ear canal resonance which might differ substantially from the average but it could be also you getting used to the B&W tonality which on most models shows a presence dip around 3 kHz or a combination of both.

 

[ShiZo]

It’s interesting that they’ve fixed a problem that they also claimed was a “feature”. Which one is it, problem or feature?

I have to admit to being disappointed in the way they’ve handled this. I‘ve owned various Focal headphones and have been generally satisfied, but would be hesitant to invest further in their products given the less than transparent communication around this driver issue.

Yeah, I didn't like that very much either. It's just too bad it's my favorite sounding headphone.

 

[CtheArgie]

@AlexHempel , we are all a little weird if we actively spend time here.... Just saying....

 

[MC_RME]

I'll suggest another track to pump out tons of sub bass.

There is zero (!) 'sub bass' in that track. No LFE effects either. The bassline consists of a boring low frequency sine, just a bit too loud in the mix. It does not go deeper than the lowest string on a bass guitar (44 Hz). The samples that I posted play two octaves lower. THAT is sub bass.

Bass can sound fat and deep although it isn't. Check your music with a spectral analyzer and you won't be fooled again.

 

[MC_RME]

. There is some evidence that low-frequency stimuli for just 90 seconds at moderately perceived loudness can significantly affect cochlear physiology, which could make the ear more prone to damage at the higher frequencies it's more sensitive to. Take care of your ears people!

Reading that article made me laugh. Scientists sitting in a glasshouse examining wind-turbine effects, while they could simpy gather all they need from the big crowd of car audio - which they obviously never heard of. BTW, I really love this guy:

Too MUCH BASS for a TAHOE!?!? Playing Kyle's BIGGEST Car Audio Subwoofer Sound System Ever! - YouTube

 

[fieldcar]

There is zero (!) 'sub bass' in that track. No LFE effects either. The bassline consists of a boring low frequency sine, just a bit too loud in the mix. It does not go deeper than the lowest string on a bass guitar (44 Hz). The samples that I posted play two octaves lower. THAT is sub bass.

Bass can sound fat and deep although it isn't. Check your music with a spectral analyzer and you won't be fooled again.

You sound like a subjectivist who just lost a BASS off. Damn son. You got hella served. Aight!

In all seriousness, it's still in the LFE region of 3-120Hz and sub bass is anything below 60Hz, so. Yes. It falls into the correct range of frequencies. I didn't promise a substantially better track with deeper sub bass. I figured I would share a fun track that I use to test headphones. Shrug.

 

[Deleted member 5035]

Amir, it appears you are using the newest Harman curve as your reference. Listeners who are serious about headphones do not use that curve. It calls for way too much bass emphasis. Most serious listeners prefer the older curve, or a combination of the older and newer curves. Both those curves call for a bass shelf of about 3 decibels, rather than the 6 dB the new curve calls for.

 

[bigjacko]

Wow who is this Deleted member 5035? What did he said result a ban? Oh just saw it, never mind.

 

[amirm]

Wow who is this Deleted member 5035? What did he said result a ban? Oh just saw it, never mind.

Nothing. I told him to not start an argument about MQA and "who needs this DAC" in a review thread, he got upset and demanded that I delete his account (publicly and privately) Thought I give him time to cool off but he started to delete his posts. So I reluctantly deleted his account and renamed it to what you see.

 

[fieldcar]

I dedicate this song to @MC_RME

 

[Daaadou]

So even if you can play music directly from iPhones and laptops into these HPs, this is not a proper way to listen to them, flat, bass almost inexistant.
Otherwise, the Rotel pre amp handles them very nicely so now, I need to test them thoroughly, wasn't able to get them clipping even with a considerable bass boost (pre amp tone control) but I need to do it with APO/Peace from the PC hooked in the pre amp.

Overall, satisfied with this pair of HPs as when I auditioned them a week ago. Let's see how I like them on the long run.
I really fancy this black and red pro version

(For anyone in Europe, I can tell you auditorium.de is a very reliable seller, competitive, fast, package was neat and they even wrote a dedicated very thoughtful note in french!).