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Fix your RMA ADI 2 - FS DAC sound.

MC_RME

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I got a ESS version burned about 100 hours.

If this is a formerly used unit you should first do a complete reset (see manual) to factory settings. Else with all the endless possiblities in this DAC you will end up with an altered sound not finding out why it sounds different. The sound differences that you mention (if not pure imagination) would point to that.
 
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RamiellDeAnn

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Could you please put the edit at the top of your post?

If there's any truth being revealed here it is that you did not RTFM closely enough up front.

No offense at all. Could have happened to me too. But I think RME deserves a clear warning about this preceding this one:



Regardless your opinions on their technical design choices and subjective listening impressions.
I really would like to make those changes but unfortunatelly I dont have option to edit my thread anymore.

If this is a formerly used unit you should first do a complete reset (see manual) to factory settings. Else with all the endless possiblities in this DAC you will end up with an altered sound not finding out why it sounds different. The sound differences that you mention (if not pure imagination) would point to that.
Thank you for your input. Its a new unit... burned by myself. But I did factory reset indeed. I wanted to be sure that I didnt do any mistake by my claims about you equalizing sound as default setting. I didnt. I did full reset and your DC Protections settings were back to: Filter. I had a few DACs in my life, but no manufacturer was so brave to equalize my sound at reference settings. You could say ok, you should read manual. But I think, if you mess with sound through High Shelf filter eq at default, you should clearly state it somewhere so user knows. Not everybody enjoy tons of reading for no reason. Even hidden behind setting which normal customer dont touch and dont expect to find eq there.
I have lost 3 days of my life fidling around why my ADI sound so poor, online manual dont mention this setting (I checked it righ now by searching DC protection at online). Users here had to help me.
 
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RamiellDeAnn

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This is not true. Its thoroughly covered over to thick pages. p.68 and 69 in DAC manual. The same text is in PRO manual.
I dont know am I from Mars or what?

And If I made mistake of some kind with manual... it doesnt change a point in any way.
rme sit guide1.png
 

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VintageFlanker

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Also that would be a beutiful world if someone (Amir ;) ) will find a way to measure changes at sound. I dont understand why despite dacmagic and RME having the same frequency response (and phase); differences at bass reproduction are so huge. Dacmagic is gravitational heavy, RME is just airy, empty. If someone find a way how to measure even frequency reproduction itself... it would be a gamechanging I think :)
Found it: Uncontrolled sighted listening. ;)
 

BDWoody

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I really would like to make those changes but unfortunatelly I dont have option to edit my thread anymore.

Send a report for the first post, and state what you'd like to change it to. I'll take care of that.
 

jae

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After auditioning some Dan Clark Stealth today and using it with an ADI-2 DAC, couldn't help but smile at the usability and features of the product and how nice is it to use. I'm a very minimalist guy and thought I would prefer to get a Topping product, but even if I don't see myself using all of the features, I think the new RME ADI-2/4 PRO SE coming out is still going to be an instant purchase for me regardless.
I could see a very trained, acute, and young listener being able to do this in very low noise floor conditions, maybe with a quiet room and deep insertion iems with plenty of attenuation, at midrange or higher frequencies. And they probably couldn't AB with 95% confidence, maybe 50-80%, and it would require a recording that actually dipped appreciably below 20hz as a preamble. I am not saying you didn't hear what you did, but it seems like a stretch.
 

TK750

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If this is a formerly used unit you should first do a complete reset (see manual) to factory settings. Else with all the endless possiblities in this DAC you will end up with an altered sound not finding out why it sounds different. The sound differences that you mention (if not pure imagination) would point to that.

Unfortunately I think they meant they have a new device and spent 100 hours 'burning it in' :facepalm:
 

DonDish

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It would be very unlikely. Any digital DSP setting has an impact in the D/A domain. Negative dBs in EQ will affect SNR. The opposite would impact THD.
Im sorry I wasnt clear. Could the loudness and PEQ settings affect the DC filter curve in some way. Its alot of eq-curves combined right. Just a thought..
 
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RamiellDeAnn

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Found it: Uncontrolled sighted listening. ;)
Yeah you are science hero.

I dont know. I came here to explain why I was not satisfied with sound. I described what I heard, I gave you measures black and white to suport that. Problem wasnt the device but stupid manufacturer decision. There is objective truth you got turned on EQ on this device by default without obvious knowing; if you dont read whole manual completely. There is objective truth I measured it, you can or cannot believe me if I heard it. I dont care. You got eq at sound by default on and you dont care... what a scientific.


And thats it. I ll report BDWoody to change order at my post to be more acurate.

And I am done. I recomend keep this thread so if some new customers have feeling like their RMA doesnt sound good so they can find fix easier. Or delete it, I have better things than defending myself over and over against RME fanboys.

p.s. DonDish you are right, whole time I have opened older manual; but as I said, it doesnt change anything on my point.

Take care and all good to you
 

VintageFlanker

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There is objective truth I measured it, you can or cannot believe me if I heard it. I dont care. You got eq at sound by default on and you dont care... what a scientific.
First, you should watch your tone. Second, that was not what you were asking about. Your question was about audible differences, while both units measured the same:
I dont understand why despite dacmagic and RME having the same frequency response (and phase); differences at bass reproduction are so huge.
 
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DonDish

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@RamiellDeAnn Looks like you just gonna have to suck this one up. Lol No biggie. I dont even know if FILTER is default setting. I just leave mine "ON" for an extra measure of safety.

Congrats with your new DAC and sorry you had a rough start!
 

Rja4000

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I described what I heard, I gave you measures black and white to suport that. Problem wasnt the device but stupid manufacturer decision. There is objective truth
Well, I don't think that can be qualified as "truth", since it all starts from "what you heard".

The DC filter being the device default, and the (documented) fact that it alters the frequency response below 20Hz (with a negligible impact at 20Hz) are both facts.

The problem starts when you state you can hear an audible difference driven by that.

First, we all know subjective listening is very much subject to strong non conscient bias.
That's why the golden rule to scientifically validate such listening differences is repeated (double) blind test, under controlled conditions, checked for statistical significance.

Of course, there may be obvious changes that can be identified 100% of the time, and for which DBT would just be a waste of time.

But if that's the case here, we need to find the root cause of those differences, since, for sure, the cause is NOT the RME DC filter.
The only thing the DC filter can be is a CURE to a pre-existing problem. That's what it's designed for.

So, as I suggested, we should look at the music content you hear this difference with, and at the whole system, to find where the issue is.

When this will be understood better, you should be able to measure this effect and re-create it if you want, but on purpose, not by accident.

Because, what you hear, if there is actually something to be heard, is a component acting as an effect engine.
That's not "fidelity", like in HiFi.


Then comes the problem I have with your tone, from the beginning.
Why are you so aggressive ?

And you state something but don't mind to explain the context (music, rest of the system, howyou proceed to compare,...) that could help us understand and identify where your experience comes from.

Did you, as an example, at least match the output levels when comparing ?
We know that level difference is even more impacting the subjective impression than changes in frequency response.
Not to speak about change in FR below 20Hz...


It may seem cool to a newcomer to criticize a reputable manufacturer here to gain attention, but that's not what this site is about.
It's about learning, having fun, and collaborative effort to increase everyone's knowledge.

So, unless you're truely seeking for help to identify where all this comes from, without prejudice and in full respect, I think we should stop here.
 
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Rja4000

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By the way,

Not that it matters much, in my opinion, but...

if one is interested by a completely flat (+/- 0.1dB) Frequency response down to 20Hz with DC Protection on "Filter"
(which is usefull to protect against infra frequencies adverse effects)...


First, let's compare DC Protection set to "Filter" compared to DC Protection set to "ON"
"Filter" in Black
"ON" in Blue


Warning: Scale is +/- 5dB, so pretty heavily zoomed in

You see that with the Digital DC protection set to "Filter", you have a cut around 7Hz, which impact audible band at 20Hz by -0.6dB.

001023-001 - FFR_FFR_Snapshot.png



Then with some EQ to mitigate the -0.59dB at 20Hz
EQ type Shelf, F:20Hz, Q:0.6, G:1.0

You still have the effect of the HP filter,
but response is now within +/- 0.1dB between 20Hz and 20kHz

2022-08-30 14_32_24-RME ADI-2 Pro fs R DC filter EQ Shelf 20Hz Q0.6 G1.0.png



Those measurements were performed with the ADI-2 Pro fs R, not with the ADI-2 DAC (I don't have one)
But I expect results to be pretty similar with the DAC.
 
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