FIIO Warmer R2R DAC (with tube buffer)

[solderdude]

He tries to make people think and elaborate on the how and why.
it is one thing to throw around words like 'part quality' but another thing to say which quality it is about and how that could matter for the signal.
Then he will ask for measurements (which there never is) or how that improvement was determined (which is always answered with.. I heard it).

 

[mhardy6647]

What defines part quality?

For capacitors? Physical size and price.
You're a good lad, but it's clear that you're not a boutique capacitor expert.
ahem.

 

[voodooless]

He tries to make people think

Imagine having to actually think

Then he will ask for measurements

Well, we can have several steps in between, like explaining how these properties influence the signal and the audibility. Then we can talk about a controlled test, and if they yield a positive result, we can verify the initial hypothesis by measuring.

If you don’t like this or a similar approach, this place is probably not for you.

 

[solderdude]

Imagine having to actually think

It's hard ... I think..

 

[Kapidemiri]

He tries to make people think and elaborate on the how and why.
it is one thing to throw around words like 'part quality' but another thing to say which quality it is about and how that could matter for the signal.
Then he will ask for measurements (which there never is) or how that improvement was determined (which is always answered with.. I heard it).

Your point is well received, but hearing is a sensor to determine if there is a sonic difference. I rather see your effort to explaine how this sonic change happens instead of saying I heard it. That would be worth to follow.

 

[voodooless]

Your point is well received, but hearing is a sensor to determine if there is a sonic difference.

That’s not how it works. You make the claim, you’ll have to provide the proof.

Hearing is fine, as long as it’s hearing only! And as it stand we haven’t had any of that here in this topic. In fact, it was dismissed multiple times.

 

[solderdude]

Your point is well received, but hearing is a sensor to determine if there is a sonic difference. I rather see your effort to explaine how this sonic change happens instead of saying I heard it. That would be worth to follow.

It is... but the hearing is notoriously easily fooled. This is extremely well documented by the way and known in the scientific world.

You CAN use the hearing to determine actual changes but to present this as 'real evidence' it needs to be done in a certain way that is very hard to do, takes great effort and is pretty exhausting and therefor only done in labs when scientific reports have to be presented and defended (peer reviewed).
Of course I can tell you how the sonic change you perceived happened. It has to do with perception (the brain) and is not necessarily related to the actual input into the ear canal.

 

[mhardy6647]

Dreamy.
I think one needs to use FFT analysis to measure dreaminess.

Here's a fair comparison:

31 mm long, 16 mm diameter, +/- 10% tolerance, 150 WV

(OK, not quite 6 uF, but in the ballpark)
length 33 mm, diameter 56 mm, +/- 2% tolerance, 800 WV

both from Madisound

High-End Loudspeaker Parts | DIY Speaker Components | Madisound

Premium loudspeaker parts from authorized dealers. Scan-Speak, Accuton, Mundorf, SEAS. Global shipping. Call (608) 831-3433 for free advice.

www.madisoundspeakerstore.com

price of the latter is tenfold (two orders of magnitude) higher... that's measurement enough!

 

[aendre]

What defines part quality?

Raw material quality, manufacturing technology, experience....

 

[Kapidemiri]

It is... but the hearing is notoriously easily fooled. This is extremely well documented by the way and known in the scientific world.

You CAN use the hearing to determine actual changes but to present this as 'real evidence' it needs to be done in a certain way that is very hard to do, takes great effort and is pretty exhausting and therefor only done in labs when scientific reports have to be presented and defended (peer reviewed).

I do agree. We have hearing result and don't know how to translate it scientifically or don't have the knowledge, so you may step in to this area to elaborate the fact if you like, instead of ,,,.

 

[voodooless]

Raw material quality, manufacturing technology, experience....

Those are just generalizations. What is that supposed to show?

 

[voodooless]

We have hearing result

Where?

 

[Kapidemiri]

Where?

Aendre's hearing

 

[voodooless]

Aendre's hearing

Once again: it’s not just his hearing, by a long shot! As long as that is the case, there is no point in finding any other scientific reason other than biases.

 

[Kapidemiri]

Once again: it’s not just his hearing, by a long shot! As long as that is the case, there is no point in finding any other scientific reason other than biases.

If the example size instead of 1, for example 100 or thousand would you think biases or twice?

 

[solderdude]

To understand hearing and why 'simply listening' is not accurate has everything to do with psycho-acoustics (perception) and is a very complex subject.
Books have been written about it.

Insights Into Sensory Integration, Sound Localization, and the Neuroscience of Thought

I recently watched a fascinating discussion between Dr. Jennifer Groh (Duke University, Psychology & Neuroscience) and Andrew Huberman that offers deep insights into how our brains encode and integrate sights and sounds, and what this means for perception, attention, and cognition. The...

www.audiosciencereview.com

and watch this video (or read his book). This guy knows AND more importantly is capable to explain the important aspects so mortals can understand it.

 

[Svend P]

If the example size instead of 1, for example 100 or thousand would you think biases or twice?

Please read the FAQ. We are toying with you

Audio Science Review FAQ #1

This is the first in a series of FAQs for Audio Science Review. 1. Who created Audio Science Review? The founder is Amir Majidimehr. You can find out more about me by clicking on my background link in my signature. Briefly, I have had a long career in computing, audio, video and imaging...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[mhardy6647]

I just realized the banner atop the Jupiter "Condenser" site is waxes poetic.

All of our products present life-like vibrance,
true presence, dreamy aural decay,
and detail to take your breath away.

That right there is worth at least $10 of the MSRP, I'd say.

Oh, and I forgot to provide a link to Jupiter's wares!

Jupiter Condenser

The finest capacitors, wire, and cable Copper Foil Paper Wax, Aluminum Foil Paper Wax, Cosmos Electrolytic, Bumblebee, Red Astron, Vintage Yellow Capacitors. Copper, Tinned Copper, & Silver Wire. Jupiters product present life-like vibrance, true presence, dreamy aural decay, & detail to take...

jupitercondenser.com

 

[Kapidemiri]

Nice to come across with Aendre here, after yesterday's rally. Peace.

 

[voodooless]

If the example size instead of 1, for example 100

A sample size of 1 can be enough if done correctly and the result is of statistical significance.