FIIO Warmer R2R DAC (with tube buffer)

[4Real]

@robbiekhan, you're going to have to start to substantiate your claims with evidence... or cease the unsubstantiated claims. If you can provide even some basic evidence to support your assertions, we will all find it very interesting.


JSmith

LMAO. Send him your address. He'll ship you his ears.

 

[4Real]

So you're saying that what it is is cheap?
Got it.

I think he said that it is great value for the money. But you do you.

 

[4Real]

Ignorance is truly bliss

Projection

 

[4Real]

And on ASR, we do. Whatever you hear with your "ears" is only evidence that you have zero experience doing any kind of serious critical listening.

Your graphs are right next to meaningless. There are multiple factors when it comes to sound. Every piece of equipment affects the sound. Are you listening on headphones or speakers. If you're listening on speakers, the room that you're listening in matters. What is on the walls and the floor of the room matters. The placement of the speakers matter. Are you listening in the near field or not? Whatever graph you're looking at is measured by a machine at a certain distance.

 

[oleg87]

Your graphs are right next to meaningless. There are multiple factors when it comes to sound. Every piece of equipment affects the sound. Are you listening on headphones or speakers. If you're listening on speakers, the room that you're listening in matters. What is on the walls and the floor of the room matters. The placement of the speakers matter. Are you listening in the near field or not? Whatever graph you're looking at is measured by a machine at a certain distance.

What on earth are you going on about? We are talking about a DAC.

 

[4Real]

What on earth are you going on about? We are talking about a DAC.

Yeah. That would fall under the piece of equipment part.

 

[voodooless]

Yeah. That would fall under the piece of equipment part.

The room is there regardlesss of the DAC. The influence it has does not depend on the DAC. Therefore the room is irrelevant in determining the “sound” of a DAC, and no variable we need to consider when measuring a DAC.

 

[4Real]

The room is there regardlesss of the DAC. The influence it has does not depend on the DAC. Therefore the room is irrelevant in determining the “sound” of a DAC, and no variable we need to consider when measuring a DAC.

Really? I didn't realize that a DAC could produce sound on its own

 

[SMen]

I can't upload videos here but here is an animated Gif:

View attachment 495731

But this link should be the short video with better quality and music (with a bit of Miles Davis) to give you a better idea:

https://jeromeof.github.io/videos/fiio-warmer-r2r-vu-meters.mp4

While I do love how it looks (for the price), I would also not have it as my only DAC, listening with some headphones earlier it definitely isn't as 'analytical' sounding as say the Topping DX5 II I have next to it (or the FiiO K17), both of which have LCD 'screens' with VU Meter displays.

I really wonder how close your listening to this Warmer R2R is to my K13 R2R playing through the Aiyima T20 pre. I'm using this alongside and SMSL Raw and, yes, the latter is fractionally more detailed ... and I would not be at all surprised if there was measurable distortion coming through in the K13...

But the thing is the Raw Dac's incredible dynamic range kind of reveals the lack of dynamic range (or something) of my 70s Supertramp, or Fleetwood Mac or Stevie Wonder or ...

Here is my wishlist for FiiO ...

Warmer R2R Pro ...

• switch on back for R2R mode vs AKM / ESS / DS mode
• switch on back for valve mode vs solid state
• Chuck in a balanced/RCA analog ins with stepped attenuator (or maybe do a matching pre ...)
• more colour options for those lovely 'true mechanical' vu meters

I just find myself slightly rebelling against the SMSL Raw's 'perfection' for some reason.

 

[mhardy6647]

The influence it [the room] has does not depend on the DAC.

Not to mention vice versa!

 

[CuriousAli]

Really? I didn't realize that a DAC could produce sound on its own

‌But DACs are not measured via listening to a speaker in the room, they are measured by capturing the line out of the DAC device, so the only effect a room can have in this situation is a ground loop in the power or something like that, without such issues, it doesn't matter in which room you measure a DAC.

 

[oleg87]

Really? I didn't realize that a DAC could produce sound on its own

You've been a member here for too long to be posting such trollish inanity.

There's a reason we measure DACs at the output of the DAC, not the speakers.

 

[4Real]

‌But DACs are not measured via listening to a speaker in the room, they are measured by capturing the line out of the DAC device, so the only effect a room can have in this situation is a ground loop in the power or something like that, without such issues, it doesn't matter in which room you measure a DAC.

My point is that people don't buy a DAC to measure it. They buy it to listen to music through it. So the measurement is only a part of it and in my opinion a small part of it because there are going to be many other pieces in the system and there is going to be a room where the music will be listened to. Yes, equipment should measure reasonably well. But more importantly, it should sound good to the person who is listening to it.

 

[4Real]

You've been a member here for too long to be posting such trollish inanity.

There's a reason we measure DACs at the output of the DAC, not the speakers.

Maybe if you read the entirety of the posts you would understand. That is unless comprehension is an issue for you.

 

[4Real]

You've been a member here for too long to be posting such trollish inanity.

There's a reason we measure DACs at the output of the DAC, not the speakers.

People don't buy dax to measure them. They buy dax to listen to music through them

 

[CuriousAli]

My point is that people don't buy a DAC to measure it. They buy it to listen to music through it. So the measurement is only a part of it and in my opinion a small part of it because there are going to be many other pieces in the system and there is going to be a room where the music will be listened to. Yes, equipment should measure reasonably well. But more importantly, it should sound good to the person who is listening to it.

But isn't it the job of speaker, room treatment and room correction EQ to make a better listening experience for the user's taste and room? The DAC itself (without EQ and DSP features added) should be just faithful/accurate/transparent to its source audio.

 

[oleg87]

People don't buy dax to measure them. They buy dax to listen to music through them

DACs are measured precisely for the purpose of characterizing their ability to reproduce audio, and to gauge how they will interact with downstream components, etc.
If you think the numbers are "next to meaningless", you quite simply don't understand what they're telling you (and like most audiophiles, greatly overestimate your ears' objectivity). And when subjectivity is untethered to objective reality, you get absolutely ridiculous discourse like the one guy I was addressing in the post you quoted accusing AKM dacs of "unbearable harshness", while other people think they are overly warm and smooth (meanwhile, in reality, there is zero evidence of well-implemented AKM converters doing anything but reproducing the sampled signal with gratuitous levels of fidelity).

 

[JSmith]

LMAO. Send him your address. He'll ship you his ears.

Are you 4 real? (user name checks out)

That is unless comprehension is an issue for you.

Indeed.


JSmith

 

[T&T]

Facts...The music from 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s was created with electronic components using tubes or opamps. And recorded with tubes or opamps... Lovely Noisy.

A lots of people on ASR have or work for high end hifi company, so they has to justify their salary and the expensive products they sell. Buddies

Not everyone has the same capabilities to ear the difference, there are a lot moving part on your ears

 

[solderdude]

The moving parts in the ear, ear canal and outer ear are not the biggest issues.
The brain that uses input of all 'bodily sensors' and how it processes all the incoming data is where the secret lies.

Facts...The music from 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s was created with electronic components using tubes or opamps. And recorded with tubes or opamps... Lovely Noisy.

Facts from today: Music, up till this day, is created with using acoustic/electronics instruments and could be using tubes and/or solid state using either analog and/or digital recording techniques.

It has nothing to do with ASR though nor with its inhabitants nor what they do for a living in this industry or not nor with pricing/profits.
This also has no relation to the FiiO DAC in question.