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Fairly new here. Easy, inexpensive 'tube' sound addition?

Jim Shaw

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I have a playback system with Emotiva PT100 preamp, A-300 amp, Klipsch RP600M speakers, and a turntable, streaming arrangement, CD/DAC, etc. I'm not thrilled with the 'edginess' of the Klipsch's on all sources. Most of my listening is to classical, instrumental solo, and jazz. I would like to try 'tube' sound. I ordered a Schiit Vali 3+ today, but the lead time is 6-8 weeks, so I have lots of time to cancel, if it's the wrong path.

Is this a reasonable approach? The price was low enough to allow me to try it out. Any thoughts from like minded but learned users?
 

Jim Matthews

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If the HF response seems harsh om all sources, consider pointing the tweeter square into the room, or such that the "beam" crosses in front of your seating position.

This extreme "toe in" might help with the excess HF energy.

As to the Vali 3+ it's only $150?

I've spent more on dinner and a movie. (And it wasn't a great dinner.)
 

Blumlein 88

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https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/klipsch-rp-600m-speaker-review.12138/
Read Amir's review. Most likely is bright because they have such a huge mid-range suckout. A little tubey softness isn't going to fix this.

Try some sort of EQ like Amir suggests and see what happens before ordering anything else. If nothing else, even EQing a few tracks in free Audacity will let you see if this is a big help or not. EQ them in Audacity and save them as a different file (leaving the original untouched). Your best money is probably going to be selling the speakers you have and getting another set.
 

Chrispy

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Can't imagine trying an equipment change for such a "feature", but there are digital plugins to imitate the typical expectation of such a change/effect....
 

Inner Space

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Your best money is probably going to be selling the speakers you have and getting another set.

I agree with this completely. Reading between the lines on this site, experience seems to show it's always best to skip right ahead to the end. It saves money in the long run. You can choose between dozens of great speakers with responses that fall away in-room, as the frequencies rise, some of them notably. Any of the dozens would take away the aggressive peakiness of the Klipsch. Some of them are much cheaper. Try some, before trying a tube buffer. Way better. If what you want is a pair of great bookshelf speakers, there has never been a better time than now.
 

dfuller

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As others have said... Your speakers are the issue here, not your other gear. Klipsches in general are wildly hot on the top so everything sounds zingy and harsh through them.

You realistically have two (well, maybe 3) cures here:
1. Use an EQ to roll off some highs and add some back in the lower presence region (-3dB high shelf, corner frequency around 5k, Q around 1, +3dB bell centered around 2k, Q of around 1-1.5). The most cost-effective option and quite a bit more effective than option 2.
2. toe your speakers out some to cut the direct treble. This is probably going to be the least effective method, but it's not exactly time consuming to try.
3. replace the speakers with something a bit less bright and scooped. Normally I'd have recommended a pair of JBL Stage A130s at around $300/pr, but they're seemingly unavailable. As such, maybe a pair of Elac DBR62s could work? Not nearly so cheap as the Vali 2+, but it sure as hell would do more.
 
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Jim Shaw

Jim Shaw

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Thanks for all the replies. I took Amir's EQ's to heart using my existing Loki. It helped a lot, but it wasn't enough. I boosted 2k by about 4 dB, cut 8k by about 6 db, cut the 20 Hz by as much as possible (I have two subs, not in that circuit. I also used the preamp treble control to cut by 4 dB. AND, I installed 1 ohm 100 watt resistors on both legs of the tweeter bi-wiring (the woofer is still direct). All of this has helped A LOT.

But the best move was to aim the speakers about 15 degrees outside of my sweet seat. Now, that has helped a lot. My ears stay at tweeter level, approximately. Yes, I can NOW tolerate the Klipsch's without wanting to shotgun them both. (I'd have to buy a shotgun.)

The music (listening to a Chesky 'Symphonic' recording at the moment) is much more listenable. I know the tube stage won't help the response. I just thought I try some 'tube sound' to see if I might prefer it. If I don't like it, I'll return it. IF is ever gets here!

I've rejected the Maggies plan - there's too much glass behind where they'd have to be placed. Keeping my eye out for a replacement set of speakers. Currently, I'm sniffing around the new KLH 5's, but all the pundits who rave about them just listen to the likes of Led Zeppelin and Metallica. I listen to classical symphonic, solo acoustic, some vocal, and jazz. So, unless Amir, or maybe Erin tests them, I'm not sending in my order. I no longer trust any You Tube reviewers who don't listen to my kind of music -- or can test, objectively.

One burned is twice careful.
 
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Jim Shaw

Jim Shaw

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If the HF response seems harsh om all sources, consider pointing the tweeter square into the room, or such that the "beam" crosses in front of your seating position.

This extreme "toe in" might help with the excess HF energy.

As to the Vali 3+ it's only $150?

I've spent more on dinner and a movie. (And it wasn't a great dinner.)

Haha, good points. I ended up toeing them OUT about 15 degrees from my ears, and that helped A LOT. The Vali3+ may be fun to try out to add those even harmonics folks talk about. If I don't like it, it'll go back. That is, if I ever get it. Schiit says 6-8 weeks backordered.
 

tuga

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I have a playback system with Emotiva PT100 preamp, A-300 amp, Klipsch RP600M speakers, and a turntable, streaming arrangement, CD/DAC, etc. I'm not thrilled with the 'edginess' of the Klipsch's on all sources. Most of my listening is to classical, instrumental solo, and jazz. I would like to try 'tube' sound. I ordered a Schiit Vali 3+ today, but the lead time is 6-8 weeks, so I have lots of time to cancel, if it's the wrong path.

Is this a reasonable approach? The price was low enough to allow me to try it out. Any thoughts from like minded but learned users?

I don't think it makes sense to address a problem with the Klipsches by changing components upstream.
If the Klipsches are indeed the source of 'edginess' then they're the ones that should be replace.

In my view and experience, in audio two wrongs don't make a right...
 

PRL

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This might sound a bit of a strange idea but have you tried moving the speakers closer together and toeing then out? I can't say it's technically correct but sometimes it seems to work.
 
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Jim Shaw

Jim Shaw

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This might sound a bit of a strange idea but have you tried moving the speakers closer together and toeing then out? I can't say it's technically correct but sometimes it seems to work.
I did that, and it really helped. I didn't move them closer together, but I did toe them out, about 15 degrees from on-axis. Suddenly, they seemed to smooth out, and the sound stage became more accurate and stable.
Some of this may have to do with my room. Speakers are about 3' from the front and side walls, but the front wall is floor to ceiling glass. I wish I had an alternative layout, but I don't.
Incidentally I canceled the order to Schiit for the tube preamp. It didn't seem a good solution.
 
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