• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Extreme Snake Oil

MarkS

Major Contributor
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
1,070
Likes
1,510
No one cares how they spend their money. What they care is when someone lies and makes up stuff about why their $28K cable is audibly superior and then works hard to convince people with less means to waste their money on expensive jewellery under the claim it is factually not just psychologically (short term) better. Ever noticed tweakers are never happy with their systems really?

I believe even rich people have a right to accurate and honest info too.
The accurate and honest info is readily available to them. All they have to do is listen blind.

So I don't have too much sympathy for them. Caveat emptor.
 

Aerith Gainsborough

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
May 4, 2020
Messages
853
Likes
1,280
You can pick up an audiophile’s wet dream system for £8k.
I would argue that you don't even need to spend 8K to get an excellent sound and hit diminishing returns pretty hard.
 

THW

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Nov 21, 2018
Messages
412
Likes
630
When you see an anti-tank warhead go off in air

actually what happens when shaped charges don't strike tanks? I actually am genuinely curious, lol

what I do know about shaped charges mostly comes from when they actually strike tanks at the right angle (fusing is extremely important and must balance between speed and safety, the distance the metal lining-turned-projectile must travel must be just right to ensure maximum penetration, the metal lining doesn't actually melt, the ductile metal lining just heavily deforms into a spear-like projectile due to the immense stresses of the explosion, etc)
 

egellings

Major Contributor
Joined
Feb 6, 2020
Messages
4,056
Likes
3,298
I have placed claymore mines will in Viet Nam. They are shaped charges, and one side of the device has the message "This side toward enemy" on it. Blowed[sic] their shite clean away. There it is.
 

ahofer

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jun 3, 2019
Messages
5,023
Likes
9,072
Location
New York City
I have placed claymore mines will in Viet Nam. They are shaped charges, and one side of the device has the message "This side toward enemy" on it. Blowed[sic] their shite clean away. There it is.
I had a good friend in ROTC (1980s) who told me about candidates who still placed mines like that backwards in training, provoking an epic chewing out.
 

aslan7

Active Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
Messages
212
Likes
242
If spending a fortune on superfluous cables makes someone happy so be it. It's good for the economy. I am always amazed when the people who buy such nonsense become angry when one points out that the science doesn't support the extravagant claims about cables. But, if one has the money that's fine.
 

Wes

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 5, 2019
Messages
3,843
Likes
3,790
spending a fortune on superfluous cables is bad for the economy - it cause inflation and takes people away from worthwihle jobs to work on meaningless resource wastage
 

egellings

Major Contributor
Joined
Feb 6, 2020
Messages
4,056
Likes
3,298
The claymore is a shaped charge, which means that it tends to put a lot more explosive forward rather than backward, 800 1/4" steel balls and all. What some, um, users did not understand that a large amount of explosive force went backwards as well. So one idiot strapped one on both front fenders of a supply truck and could detonate them from within while driving. He apparently thought that all the force would go forward. Well, he paid with his life to discover that it did not work that way at all. Blew the truck and himself to smithereens at the push of his button.
 

egellings

Major Contributor
Joined
Feb 6, 2020
Messages
4,056
Likes
3,298
I agree that the snake oil cables are a waste of money that could go elsewhere and do some good. No question there. Good cable performance is readily affordable, even to us chickens, bedawk! NASA engineers must laugh their heads of at that stuff. Thing is, so much other stuff is the same way, with homeopathy (NO active ingredient in the product) being an arch example of the genre. Then there's the whole health supplement industry that's beyond the boundary of potentially useful things like vitamins & minerals. Gotta have yer minerals, ya know!
 

aslan7

Active Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
Messages
212
Likes
242
spending a fortune on superfluous cables is bad for the economy - it cause inflation and takes people away from worthwihle jobs to work on meaningless resource wastage
What about hiring several witch doctors to recite magical incantations to enhance performance? You have to think big!
 

aslan7

Active Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
Messages
212
Likes
242
I agree that the snake oil cables are a waste of money that could go elsewhere and do some good. No question there. Good cable performance is readily affordable, even to us chickens, bedawk! NASA engineers must laugh their heads of at that stuff. Thing is, so much other stuff is the same way, with homeopathy (NO active ingredient in the product) being an arch example of the genre. Then there's the whole health supplement industry that's beyond the boundary of potentially useful things like vitamins & minerals. Gotta have yer minerals, ya know!
My ex wife spent 500 a month on “dietary supplements” and plenty more on her health advisor, a whacky woman from Florida who thought she could speak to bears. Every time there was a bear attack in the news I was very hopeful…
 

Victor Martell

Active Member
Joined
Mar 9, 2018
Messages
189
Likes
223
spending a fortune on superfluous cables is bad for the economy - it cause inflation and takes people away from worthwihle jobs to work on meaningless resource wastage

That has always been my argument against, specially super expensive audiophile cables, and even more specifically super expensive digital audiophile cables. Doesn't matter

1) If you can afford them
2) If you have the freedom to buy whatever you want
3) If you are happy with them

Give that their benefit is not provable, It is still a waste of your resources. Only only hope that at least the employees of the audiophile cable company are making a living - however, I have always wondered, if they get paid according to the price and not according let's say, number of products manufacture (probably not that many) or sold (probably even less)... Given that there is a good chance that the price of the BOM is way less than the asking price for these things...

v
 

escksu

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Jul 16, 2020
Messages
965
Likes
397
That has always been my argument against, specially super expensive audiophile cables, and even more specifically super expensive digital audiophile cables. Doesn't matter

1) If you can afford them
2) If you have the freedom to buy whatever you want
3) If you are happy with them

Give that their benefit is not provable, It is still a waste of your resources. Only only hope that at least the employees of the audiophile cable company are making a living - however, I have always wondered, if they get paid according to the price and not according let's say, number of products manufacture (probably not that many) or sold (probably even less)... Given that there is a good chance that the price of the BOM is way less than the asking price for these things...

v

I don't agree. Getting these very rich pple to spend is actually good for economy. We have to understand that these people have so much money that 20-30K for a cable is nothing to them. Even 500K for a pair of speakers is trivial to them too.

At this level, its about brand name rather than value or performance. Just like luxury bags, do you think the BOM cost anywhere close to the bag's price tag? Even services they pay are on differen level from the rest of us. They could spend a few thousands just for a haircut that looks no different from one that cost $50.
 

escksu

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Jul 16, 2020
Messages
965
Likes
397
If spending a fortune on superfluous cables makes someone happy so be it. It's good for the economy. I am always amazed when the people who buy such nonsense become angry when one points out that the science doesn't support the extravagant claims about cables. But, if one has the money that's fine.

Yes, furthermore, its not even a fortune to these pple who can afford it. Its just loose change to them. Their spending means people get income and support jobs. These cable companies need to hire people to make and sell cables. These pple gets paid and they have money to spend, which goes back to these rich pple (their companies).

Its a cycle...Those who studied economics would know about this.
 

Wes

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 5, 2019
Messages
3,843
Likes
3,790
No, this crap damages our natural resources. Copper for example is harmful to mine and to smelt.

Our "economy" does not exist in a magical unicorn vacuum where products appear from nothingness, and it would be far better served if the rich used their money to buy something worthwhile.
 

escksu

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Jul 16, 2020
Messages
965
Likes
397
No, this crap damages our natural resources. Copper for example is harmful to mine and to smelt.

Our "economy" does not exist in a magical unicorn vacuum where products appear from nothingness, and it would be far better served if the rich used their money to buy something worthwhile.

Damage?? Maybe you should ask where most of the copper goes to. Worthwhile?? What is your definition of worthwhile? Do you know that hifi is actually a waste of resource as well? Look at how much resources is needed to make your amp, DAC, speakers etc... All it does is produce sound for personal entertainment. A cheap $20 speakers produces sound and use way lesser resources. Don't get me started on power consumption.....
 
  • Like
Reactions: trs
Top Bottom