This joke becomes funnier as the TLC NAND cells fundamentally storing the bits are constantly in a state of bit errors, and they are only reliably read by robust error correcting mechanisms.
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Extreme Snake Oil
- Thread starter Spkrdctr
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This joke becomes funnier as the TLC NAND cells fundamentally storing the bits are constantly in a state of bit errors, and they are only reliably read by robust error correcting mechanisms.
From the snippets I read - site, interview - it isn't clear to me who manages to sell voodoo to whom there. It seems to be a network of guys, sites and recommendations.
But I very much love the little piece of wood with golden miniature teapot. If you manage to get 1600€+ for nonsense like that, you uncorked another source of effortless income.
But I very much love the little piece of wood with golden miniature teapot. If you manage to get 1600€+ for nonsense like that, you uncorked another source of effortless income.
Yeah, but not a million miles from a CD then....
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Ahh, but only if those errors are lovingly curated and shepherded towards the correct are the results sufficiently euphonic and sonorous. This is essential for jaw-dropping soundstage... and, might I add, the blackest possible background.
Nutul
Addicted to Fun and Learning
you forgot "and the last veil being lifted".
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Duly noted.
PS I was gonna add something about the fabled partner in the kitchen -- but I was typin' on my phone... which is, simply put, never pretty.
Aure
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The SSD discussion reminds me of something that was considered the ultimate solution back when I was on a French audiophile forum: optimizing the Mac mini.
Hi,
I noticed there is quite a large community of Mac mini users here, so I'd like to share the results of some experiments I carried out on a late-2012 Mac mini i7. These are, of course, based on what I heard on the system described below, so take the results with the necessary grain of salt... but they might still be of interest.
Listening conditions: Naim 82 / SuperCap / 250 / Dynaudio Contour S1.4
Then I switched to the Apacer 8 GB. Compared with the 4 GB Wide Temperature version, the standard 8 GB sounds smoother and has less impact. It's pleasant, but more "easy listening."
The 4 GB Wide Temperature module is more present, clearer, more engaging, more natural, and faster.
Estimated improvement of the Wide Temperature RAM: 10%.
The Crucial performs very well. It is clean, well-balanced, and offers a very good overall presentation. The difference compared with the Apacer Wide Temperature is therefore fairly small, but it does exist—especially in terms of speed (the perceived speed of the music, which affects precision and note attack) along with a little extra soul.
Estimated improvement of the Wide Temperature RAM: 3%.
Overall, I'm somewhat disappointed because I expected much larger differences between the different RAM modules. However, these results still seem to confirm the feedback suggesting the superiority of Apacer Wide Temperature RAM.
Anyway, back to the listening tests. Only the Lexar has been burned in. (Do SD cards need burn-in?)
The SanDisk boots in 1 minute 14 seconds. Sonically, the vocals seem more recessed, and overall the result is rather disappointing.
The Lexar boots in 43 seconds. Its presentation is cleaner; percussion skins sound tighter; it plays louder and with greater precision; there's a stronger sense of immersion in the music. Susanna (from Susanna and the Magical Orchestra, track Who Am I) whispers in my ear, giving me goosebumps. Every percussion roll on Tord Gustavsen's Journey of Life is perfectly intelligible.
Estimated improvement of the Lexar: 15%.
The Apacer Wide Temperature boots in 1 minute 2 seconds, although in everyday use it feels just as fast as the Lexar. It sounds very refined and composed—perhaps even more precise than the Lexar. The treble is more natural and better controlled, the presentation more clearly defined, with more air around the instruments.
However, it loses a little of the Lexar's magic. When Susanna whispers in my ear, I no longer get goosebumps.
I estimate the Apacer Wide Temperature's hi-fi improvement at 8% over the Lexar.
This Apacer leaves me somewhat unsatisfied. It outperforms the Lexar in almost every criterion I evaluated, yet it falls ever so slightly short when it comes to the magical quality of the presentation. I think it's worth investigating further by letting it burn in (!?) before another comparison with the Lexar 2000.
...
After 200 hours of burn-in, the trends are confirmed.
The Apacer is more detailed, with treble that extends higher and sounds more natural and refined. The bass is tighter and reaches lower.
The Lexar has softer note attacks and rounds off the edges a little more. On the other hand, it has a fuller lower midrange. It is less analytical, easier to listen to, more forgiving, and possesses a certain charm.
So I remain undecided between the two. For those who noticed, I'm currently not listening on my own system, so I'll wait for one final comparison on my complete setup once I'm back home.
Then I switched to the Ghent, which sounded more subdued while remaining precise, but with less scale and openness.
Estimated advantage of the Mundorf: 8%.
The Uptone sits somewhere between the Mundorf and the Ghent. It is very well balanced, with beautiful vocals, an excellent midrange, and a charming presentation.
However, the Mundorf is more detailed and more natural.
Estimated advantage of the Mundorf: 4%.
The Elecaudio produces larger vocals and remains easy to follow, but lacks the depth and three-dimensionality of the Mundorf. It is therefore less convincing.
Estimated advantage of the Mundorf: 10%.
I then put the Ghent back in to compare it directly with the Elecaudio. The Ghent has more body, more attractive vocals, and a more natural midrange.
The DIY Neotech UP-OCC copper Starquad cable arrived later (which is why it isn't included in the group photo). I compared it with both the Uptone and the Mundorf.
It sits somewhere between the two, being faster and more detailed than the Uptone while sounding slightly more subdued.
Estimated difference compared with the Uptone: 3%.
It should be noted that only the Uptone cable has been burned in.
The all-copper Uptone, the DIY cable, and the Ghent are all excellent. They offer a rich midrange and a very balanced presentation, making them ideal for good source components.
The Elecaudio falls slightly behind.
The Mundorf outclasses the others thanks to its openness, detail, and natural presentation. It is best suited to those who want to extract the very last few percent of performance from their source.
The idea was simple: what's the point of installing a large external power supply with a high-quality DC cable if everything is spoiled by a tiny standard ribbon cable just before the motherboard?
With that in mind, I tested two prototypes: one made from Neotech UP-OCC copper stranded wire, and the other from Neotech UP-OCC silver stranded wire.
I first listened using the original ribbon cable to refresh my memory.
Then I switched to the Neotech copper ribbon.
The sound immediately seemed louder. The presentation was clearer and more detailed. It sounded natural, with more air, and the music felt more relaxed and fluid.
...But something wasn't quite right.
There was less body and less foundation. The bass was lighter.
I therefore decided to let it play for a while, just in case the lack of bass was due to burn-in. (Yes, cables need burn-in.)
After 200 hours, my conclusions remained the same, although the differences had become even more pronounced.
The original ribbon cable sounded more diffuse and slightly emphasized the lower midrange, bringing the vocals further forward.
The Neotech copper ribbon was clearly a step above. It was more balanced overall, despite the impression of slightly lighter bass.
The Neotech silver ribbon settled the matter once and for all.
It retained the bass weight while preserving all the detail of the copper version.
There was no lack of body. It was as if a veil had been lifted.
Percussion became faster and more impactful.
Everything was clean. The treble extended naturally, the bass reached deeper, and my immediate reaction was:
"Yes, that's it! That's right!"
I estimate the improvement provided by the Neotech silver ribbon at 20% over the original ribbon cable, and 10% over the Neotech copper version.
Apart from the comparison between the Lexar and Apacer SD cards, it was fairly easy to rank the different products.
With digital audio, every little detail matters. Unfortunately, achieving "just a tiny bit better" requires a great deal of effort.
But that's the price to pay for getting goosebumps when Susanna whispers in your ear...
—
If that isn't snake oil, I don't know what is…
Hi,
I noticed there is quite a large community of Mac mini users here, so I'd like to share the results of some experiments I carried out on a late-2012 Mac mini i7. These are, of course, based on what I heard on the system described below, so take the results with the necessary grain of salt... but they might still be of interest.
Listening conditions: Naim 82 / SuperCap / 250 / Dynaudio Contour S1.4
RAM
- Crucial 8 GB CT8G3S160BM for Mac (already installed when I bought the Mac second-hand) (2 × 8 GB = 16 GB)
- Apacer 4 GB Industrial Wide Temperature 75.B93E2.G040B (2 × 4 GB = 8 GB)
- Apacer 8 GB Standard DV.08G2K.KAM (2 × 8 GB = 16 GB)
Listening impressions
First, I listened to the Apacer 4 GB Wide Temperature.Then I switched to the Apacer 8 GB. Compared with the 4 GB Wide Temperature version, the standard 8 GB sounds smoother and has less impact. It's pleasant, but more "easy listening."
The 4 GB Wide Temperature module is more present, clearer, more engaging, more natural, and faster.
Estimated improvement of the Wide Temperature RAM: 10%.
The Crucial performs very well. It is clean, well-balanced, and offers a very good overall presentation. The difference compared with the Apacer Wide Temperature is therefore fairly small, but it does exist—especially in terms of speed (the perceived speed of the music, which affects precision and note attack) along with a little extra soul.
Estimated improvement of the Wide Temperature RAM: 3%.
Overall, I'm somewhat disappointed because I expected much larger differences between the different RAM modules. However, these results still seem to confirm the feedback suggesting the superiority of Apacer Wide Temperature RAM.
SD Cards
Previous experience had shown the superiority of high-speed SD cards, and the Lexar had become the must-have! Today, however, it seemed worthwhile to compare it against some newer contenders:- SanDisk Extreme Pro 64 GB SDHC UHS-II, capable of up to 300 MB/s read speed (whereas the Lexar tops out at 211 MB/s)
- Apacer CV110-SD 32 GB Wide Temperature, rated at 90 MB/s
Anyway, back to the listening tests. Only the Lexar has been burned in. (Do SD cards need burn-in?)
The SanDisk boots in 1 minute 14 seconds. Sonically, the vocals seem more recessed, and overall the result is rather disappointing.
The Lexar boots in 43 seconds. Its presentation is cleaner; percussion skins sound tighter; it plays louder and with greater precision; there's a stronger sense of immersion in the music. Susanna (from Susanna and the Magical Orchestra, track Who Am I) whispers in my ear, giving me goosebumps. Every percussion roll on Tord Gustavsen's Journey of Life is perfectly intelligible.
Estimated improvement of the Lexar: 15%.
The Apacer Wide Temperature boots in 1 minute 2 seconds, although in everyday use it feels just as fast as the Lexar. It sounds very refined and composed—perhaps even more precise than the Lexar. The treble is more natural and better controlled, the presentation more clearly defined, with more air around the instruments.
However, it loses a little of the Lexar's magic. When Susanna whispers in my ear, I no longer get goosebumps.
I estimate the Apacer Wide Temperature's hi-fi improvement at 8% over the Lexar.
This Apacer leaves me somewhat unsatisfied. It outperforms the Lexar in almost every criterion I evaluated, yet it falls ever so slightly short when it comes to the magical quality of the presentation. I think it's worth investigating further by letting it burn in (!?) before another comparison with the Lexar 2000.
...
After 200 hours of burn-in, the trends are confirmed.
The Apacer is more detailed, with treble that extends higher and sounds more natural and refined. The bass is tighter and reaches lower.
The Lexar has softer note attacks and rounds off the edges a little more. On the other hand, it has a fuller lower midrange. It is less analytical, easier to listen to, more forgiving, and possesses a certain charm.
So I remain undecided between the two. For those who noticed, I'm currently not listening on my own system, so I'll wait for one final comparison on my complete setup once I'm back home.
USB Cables
I first listened using the Mundorf.Then I switched to the Ghent, which sounded more subdued while remaining precise, but with less scale and openness.
Estimated advantage of the Mundorf: 8%.
The Uptone sits somewhere between the Mundorf and the Ghent. It is very well balanced, with beautiful vocals, an excellent midrange, and a charming presentation.
However, the Mundorf is more detailed and more natural.
Estimated advantage of the Mundorf: 4%.
The Elecaudio produces larger vocals and remains easy to follow, but lacks the depth and three-dimensionality of the Mundorf. It is therefore less convincing.
Estimated advantage of the Mundorf: 10%.
I then put the Ghent back in to compare it directly with the Elecaudio. The Ghent has more body, more attractive vocals, and a more natural midrange.
The DIY Neotech UP-OCC copper Starquad cable arrived later (which is why it isn't included in the group photo). I compared it with both the Uptone and the Mundorf.
It sits somewhere between the two, being faster and more detailed than the Uptone while sounding slightly more subdued.
Estimated difference compared with the Uptone: 3%.
It should be noted that only the Uptone cable has been burned in.
The all-copper Uptone, the DIY cable, and the Ghent are all excellent. They offer a rich midrange and a very balanced presentation, making them ideal for good source components.
The Elecaudio falls slightly behind.
The Mundorf outclasses the others thanks to its openness, detail, and natural presentation. It is best suited to those who want to extract the very last few percent of performance from their source.
Power Ribbon Cables
(The ribbon cable between the MMK power supply board and the motherboard.)The idea was simple: what's the point of installing a large external power supply with a high-quality DC cable if everything is spoiled by a tiny standard ribbon cable just before the motherboard?
With that in mind, I tested two prototypes: one made from Neotech UP-OCC copper stranded wire, and the other from Neotech UP-OCC silver stranded wire.
I first listened using the original ribbon cable to refresh my memory.
Then I switched to the Neotech copper ribbon.
The sound immediately seemed louder. The presentation was clearer and more detailed. It sounded natural, with more air, and the music felt more relaxed and fluid.
...But something wasn't quite right.
There was less body and less foundation. The bass was lighter.
I therefore decided to let it play for a while, just in case the lack of bass was due to burn-in. (Yes, cables need burn-in.)
After 200 hours, my conclusions remained the same, although the differences had become even more pronounced.
The original ribbon cable sounded more diffuse and slightly emphasized the lower midrange, bringing the vocals further forward.
The Neotech copper ribbon was clearly a step above. It was more balanced overall, despite the impression of slightly lighter bass.
The Neotech silver ribbon settled the matter once and for all.
It retained the bass weight while preserving all the detail of the copper version.
There was no lack of body. It was as if a veil had been lifted.
Percussion became faster and more impactful.
Everything was clean. The treble extended naturally, the bass reached deeper, and my immediate reaction was:
"Yes, that's it! That's right!"
I estimate the improvement provided by the Neotech silver ribbon at 20% over the original ribbon cable, and 10% over the Neotech copper version.
Overall conclusion
Overall, the results were consistent with what I had expected (and with the feedback from other forums).Apart from the comparison between the Lexar and Apacer SD cards, it was fairly easy to rank the different products.
With digital audio, every little detail matters. Unfortunately, achieving "just a tiny bit better" requires a great deal of effort.
But that's the price to pay for getting goosebumps when Susanna whispers in your ear...
—
If that isn't snake oil, I don't know what is…
Nutul
Addicted to Fun and Learning
This is becoming the new podcast-evening for me... so much fun you don't want it to end... and the better part is: you never know what comes next. Literally.
This is off-topic, but I an not sure where to place this comment. I logged onto Audiokarma, an audio hobbyist website I regularly frequented just recently to find that it now requires me to view an advertisement before the content will be displayed. I deleted Audiokarma from my reading list after that. Ads were not audio-related, otherwise I might have tolerated it.
The consistent, complete ignorance of audiophiles of how computers, digital audio or our auditory perception work never ceases to amaze me. Even the most basic understanding of any of these would prevent one from coming up with something as utterly wrong and ridiculously deluded as that quoted post on computer "tuning".
Buck_Rogers
Member
Never seen ad's on AK or most other sites including Youtube.
Guess my AdBlock is catching them, But I was in Home Depot today using their web site on my phone to find some PVC flanges and the ad's are overwhelming, Taking the site down. Useless!
I'm already in your store, I'm trying to buy something but you have to Hawk your business like Pirates of the Caribbean character.
Got my flanges, But gave up on buying some plants...
Fortunately I still have my "Brilliant Pebbles" from Machina Dynamica. So I don't have to add more Snake Oil to my system.
Too bad the picture links are broken this site is a total hoot!
Brilliant Pebbles
Guess my AdBlock is catching them, But I was in Home Depot today using their web site on my phone to find some PVC flanges and the ad's are overwhelming, Taking the site down. Useless!
I'm already in your store, I'm trying to buy something but you have to Hawk your business like Pirates of the Caribbean character.
Got my flanges, But gave up on buying some plants...
Fortunately I still have my "Brilliant Pebbles" from Machina Dynamica. So I don't have to add more Snake Oil to my system.
Too bad the picture links are broken this site is a total hoot!
Brilliant Pebbles
Hapo
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Truth Ness
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The (sad) thing is, that's not only true for those but also for many other people these days like conspiracy theorists, deniers of this or that etc who think they know a thing about what they say but in reality they have no clue. Most of them also seem to be immune against facts and science. It's just ridiculous (but also scary). Claiming the even most ridiculous things without providing robust evidence or data.
Difference is, audio snake oil often is a great amusement and has provided me with countless hilarious moments. We're living in the golden age of audio snake oil!
I was shocked the first time I encountered an anti-vaxxer, an engineer for a major German automotive supplier. There are no rational arguments for that position. You don't have to do statistics on the data to see the effectiveness for illnesses such as measles, smallpox or polio. Yet we now have measles outbreaks again in Western countries despite easy vaccine availability.
CDMC
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And to think all these years I thought burning in ram and motherboards was to help eliminate field failure and unexplained crashing.
painful to read
No need from my perspective! Thank you for sharing.
Morbid_Florist
Member
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it fixes "hi-fi veterans" hearing loss caused by age and enviroment too I presume
World of audiophile accessories is alien to me but then I do have a sweet spot for actual audio eccentrics which may, sometimes, indulge in things esoteric - like this gentleman showcasting his system in rather old video posted on non audio related channel. I find it rather charming and genuinly interesting (and I want his CD player). Which makes me wonder where the line between hobby and madness lies
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