Exciting news from Onkyo and Pioneer: TX-RZ70/ VSX-LX705, TX-RZ9/VSX-LX905 = Auro 3D + DLBC!

[cdwillis]

An Hungary web site also proposes the RZ70.
Following the listed characteristics it is a 9 channels amplifier.
Perfect.

https://www.deltahifi.hu/termeklap/...alozatkepes-av-erosito-dirac-live-8k-h_725923

Saw that! I really hope the description there is accurate, and that it will process 13 channels. That and Auro3D (and that it comes in at a decent price point after the Dirac license upgrade for DLBC) will likely make it the option I've been looking for!

 

[dlaloum]

Saw that! I really hope the description there is accurate, and that it will process 13 channels. That and Auro3D (and that it comes in at a decent price point after the Dirac license upgrade for DLBC) will likely make it the option I've been looking for!

I look at the recent postings with some suspicion - they are too different from the Pio and Integra...

 

[ArturoKiwi]

An Hungary web site also proposes the RZ70.
Following the listed characteristics it is a 9 channels amplifier.
Perfect.

https://www.deltahifi.hu/termeklap/...alozatkepes-av-erosito-dirac-live-8k-h_725923

Same price, about 3200/3300€
There is nothing between the 1700€ of the RZ50 and the 3200€ of the RZ70?

 

[ivo.f.doma]

I look at the recent postings with some suspicion - they are too different from the Pio and Integra...

I also don't like the differences in the number and performance of amplifiers and 13 channels of processing, zone 2 is probably meant.

 

[CyrusTheGreat_600BC]

An Hungary web site also proposes the RZ70.
Following the listed characteristics it is a 9 channels amplifier.
Perfect.

https://www.deltahifi.hu/termeklap/...alozatkepes-av-erosito-dirac-live-8k-h_725923

+$3600?? That’s pretty steep!

 

[cdwillis]

+$3600?? That’s pretty steep!

I agree - at that price point (even if that somehow included a multi-sub DLBC license) it's not a compelling product. I wasn't putting much stock in the prices listed because a) I know essentially nothing about the relative cost of AVRs in other countries and b) since the product hasn't actually been announced anywhere, it seemed like these sites were essentially throwing out a number to see if someone would pay it for pre-order, and then they'd pocket a nice little profit when the product actually ships.

By the same logic, I'm not putting much stock in any of the listed specs (since some list it as a 9 channel amp, others an 11 channel, and they can't both be right). The pictures are intriguing, though, as they don't seem to be obvious fakes, and if they are faked, someone took some time to make them believable (like lining up the RCA subwoofer outputs on the "RZ70" to be in the same corresponding spot as the DRX 8.4, minus the "B" outputs of the Integra, etc.)

 

[dlaloum]

Same price, about 3200/3300€
There is nothing between the 1700€ of the RZ50 and the 3200€ of the RZ70?

It is roughly right for those market segments - keep in mind the RZ50 competes with the X3800 and X4800 both of which are more expensive (they do have 4 sub outs...) - the RZ70 will be a competitor to the yet to be released X6800.

I wouldn't be expecting an RZ60.... it would simply canibalise the 70

 

[techsamurai]

+$3600?? That’s pretty steep!

I doubt it - the Integra is $3,300 and the Pioneer is $3,000. It's going to fall somewhere in that range as everyone is pricing their flagship AVRs in that ballpark with the Aventage RXA8A exceeding that at $3,550.

I also doubt it will exceed 11 channels as the Yamaha is the only 13 channel AVR. With Marantz and Anthem processing and amplified channels seem to vary.

 

[cdwillis]

If the TX-RZ70 comes in at close to three grand, that's going to be a tough sell for me, even if it has 11 amplified channels and will process 13 channels.

Considering you can get a refurbished Denon AVR-X6700h for two grand, and it will process 13 channels, you spend another grand on an external amp to power the L/C/R, you've got yourself a hell of a setup. You wouldn't have Dirac on your 13 channels, but if you spend enough time playing around with Audyssey MultEQ XT32 + REW, and run the subs through a miniDSP, am I really going to be missing out much?

DENON AVR-X6700H 11.2-Ch x 140 Watts 8K A/V Receiver w/HEOS

Denon Factory Refurbished

www.accessories4less.com

 

[ban25]

If the TX-RZ70 comes in at close to three grand, that's going to be a tough sell for me, even if it has 11 amplified channels and will process 13 channels.

Considering you can get a refurbished Denon AVR-X6700h for two grand, and it will process 13 channels, you spend another grand on an external amp to power the L/C/R, you've got yourself a hell of a setup. You wouldn't have Dirac on your 13 channels, but if you spend enough time playing around with Audyssey MultEQ XT32 + REW, and run the subs through a miniDSP, am I really going to be missing out much?

DENON AVR-X6700H 11.2-Ch x 140 Watts 8K A/V Receiver w/HEOS

Denon Factory Refurbished

www.accessories4less.com

I would not mess with the minidsp or the external amp for that matter. The X6700H is a great option. What you do miss out on is Dirac, as you mentioned, and you only get a single HDMI 2.1 port. This could be important if you are into gaming (4K120) or intend to keep the receiver for many years.

 

[cdwillis]

I would not mess with the minidsp or the external amp for that matter. The X6700H is a great option. What you do miss out on is Dirac, as you mentioned, and you only get a single HDMI 2.1 port. This could be important if you are into gaming (4K120) or intend to keep the receiver for many years.

I am not at all into gaming, but I am definitely someone who errs on the side of going a bit in the direction of getting more than I strictly need now so that I can use the product longer. My current receiver is 10 years old. It's an Onkyo TX-NR709. It was a couple of models up from what I was originally planning on buying at the time, but I got a good open-box deal on it. I've been so happy that I ended up with it. The plan is that this will go into our home gym which we just built out this year, and it will do literally everything I need for that. It even has ARC, which was bizarre "future" feature at the time that I got it, and now will let me use the native apps in the TV in our gym without having to fuss with an HDMI audio extractor.

I'm genuinely curious to hear your thought on why you'd advise against using a miniDSP to correct the subs, and why you'd advise against an external amp.

Regarding the external amp, I'm not concerned about the internal amp's ability to drive the L/C/R on the X6700H, but would need at least two channels of external amplification to run a 13 channel setup. By way of explanation, my home theater build will be a rectangle with the screen across the short wall (11 feet wide) and the viewing/listening area being 24 feet deep (though not likely to have seats in the back quarter of that). I would like to be able to run six overhead channels in an Auro3D configuration (3 behind that acoustically transparent screen in front, aligned above the L/C/R) two above the rears, and the "voice of God" channel overhead in the center of the listening area. From my own research it sounds like a lot of people prefer Auro3D upmixing of a lot of Atmos content (where the Atmos mix is pretty half assed), and that even a good Atmos mix sounds good with an Auro3D speaker layout, whereas the obverse is not also true (i.e. Auro3D mixing doesn't sound good on Dolby's recommended positioning of the Atmos height speakers).

 

[ban25]

I'm genuinely curious to hear your thought on why you'd advise against using a miniDSP to correct the subs, and why you'd advise against an external amp.

Regarding the external amp, I'm not concerned about the internal amp's ability to drive the L/C/R on the X6700H, but would need at least two channels of external amplification to run a 13 channel setup. By way of explanation, my home theater build will be a rectangle with the screen across the short wall (11 feet wide) and the viewing/listening area being 24 feet deep (though not likely to have seats in the back quarter of that). I would like to be able to run six overhead channels in an Auro3D configuration (3 behind that acoustically transparent screen in front, aligned above the L/C/R) two above the rears, and the "voice of God" channel overhead in the center of the listening area. From my own research it sounds like a lot of people prefer Auro3D upmixing of a lot of Atmos content (where the Atmos mix is pretty half assed), and that even a good Atmos mix sounds good with an Auro3D speaker layout, whereas the obverse is not also true (i.e. Auro3D mixing doesn't sound good on Dolby's recommended positioning of the Atmos height speakers).

Yeah that makes sense, I forgot that the X6700H only has 11-channels of amplification. With the Denon receivers, if you use MultEQ-X ($200) with Sub EQ HT, you should get equivalent performance to mini-DSP without the extra cables and hassle of miniDSP, likewise with Dirac if you were to go with a newer D+M AVR or the recently announced Integra and Pioneer receivers (which support DLBC).

 

[dlaloum]

Yeah that makes sense, I forgot that the X6700H only has 11-channels of amplification. With the Denon receivers, if you use MultEQ-X ($200) with Sub EQ HT, you should get equivalent performance to mini-DSP without the extra cables and hassle of miniDSP, likewise with Dirac if you were to go with a newer D+M AVR or the recently announced Integra and Pioneer receivers (which support DLBC).

Dirac (without DLBC) still does time alignment / distance alignment of multiple subs (on hardware having multiple sub channesl)- as well as adjusting the target EQ & levels for each sub individually - so it's a pretty close match to SubEQ HT

 

[hmt]

The point is: EQing the subs individually to flatten their response is not the best strategy.

 

[ivo.f.doma]

 

[ivo.f.doma]

I don't know what to think about those parameters. In each source of information there are different...

Onkyo TX-RZ70 THX

Mit dem Onkyo TX-RZ70 präsentiert der japanische Spezialist einen funktionsreichen 11.2 Kanal A/V Receiver mit ordentlicher Leistung zu einem ...

heimkinowelten.de

 

[DrStranger]

So, RZ90 and SC-LX905 , will be Class D then? Do we agree? *AVR thirsty and desperate*

 

[ban25]

So, RZ90 and SC-LX905 , will be Class D then? Do we agree? *AVR thirsty and desperate*

I would not bet on them changing amplifier topology for one product.

 

[NeedForSpeed73]

The news I was waiting for arrived before I expected: the Onkyo branded Integra DRX-8.4 is soon to be launched (provided Integra isn’t sold in my country, I had no choice but wait for Onkyo/Pioneer).
The Dirac online store already lists the two Pioneer models and, to my surprise, they have the possibility to get a DLBC multi-sub license (by far the cheapest devices on the market with this feature). Guess/hope that Onkyo, that is supposed to sit in the middle between Integra and Pioneer, then gets the same options too. We will see! Long live Onkyo/Pioneer!

 

[DrStranger]

I would not bet on them changing amplifier topology for one product.

Haven't they before? just one line from Pio, at least, SC-LXxx models. Have no history of Onky tho.