ESS THD ‘Hump’ Investigation

[gvl]

Yeah, let's first determine what the sound of the hump is before we start calling imaginary things it.

 

[andreasmaaan]

unfortunately, I own equal or higher humpless sinad dacs to know it's definitely audible. Sorry!

@confucius_zero I guess you have no problem passing this test then?

 

[BDWoody]

Is it audible after all? Should I be worried about buying Khadas Tone Board for example and use it with my Atom AMP?

No need to worry in the slightest.

Plenty of money to be won by the first person who can do more than make unsupported claims based on generally uncontrolled subjective opinions, strongly influenced by hearing the term and then almost NEEDING to hear that GLARE... Oh my GOD how do you live with that GLARE!!

Except, once they are asked to back it up they tend to disappear...usually showing up in another thread a day later saying the same thing.

If you believe you can tell the difference based purely on ESS vs AKM under controlled testing conditions, start a new post and include how much you are willing to bet on your golden ears when you can't peek.

For the rest of us, don't worry...

 

[BYRTT]

awesome, you saved money then! sadly I could so I had to resort to other things in the vast selection of humpless measured dacs of this website.

I didn't save so much : ( on that costly ADI thing but had to get it for use as audio analyzer and of course its good for subjective comparison too, if you ever cross a friend or place with that KTB give it a chance and listen, it could be you like it even its ESS based and low cost, i'm pretty shure even its not your cup of tea that its really not a anoying experience as you sadly had with Loxjie D10.

 

[gvl]

For what its worth I prefer the KTB over the DX3 Pro which doesn't have the hump, I don't know why but the KTB sounds a tad cleaner to my ears, but that's purely subjective and probably untrue.

 

[UAN]

[QUOTE = "Windofrce, post: 338924, member: 12839"] Это слышно в конце концов? .... [/ QUOTE]

When listening to music for a long time, this is similar to the brightness that is on different recordings. That is, coloring is present. This, of course, is my subjective opinion. Measurement of the THD spectrum at the hump levels showed the presence of only odd harmonics with a level of 70 ... 75 dB. This explains the brightness of the sound of all records. Of course, other components besides the DAC are also affected.

 

[Spocko]

Definitely the reason why I disliked the Loxjie D10 over the "humpless" Topping D10, D30, Sonata HD Pro, Meizu Pro DAC which I I bought thx to this website... so yes it's audible. The feeling of uncontrolled upper-mids to treble ringing through your skull despite the high clarity.

This is what Sabre glare is all about.

What headphones/speakers are you listening through?

 

[Spocko]

No need to worry in the slightest.

Plenty of money to be won by the first person who can do more than make unsupported claims based on generally uncontrolled subjective opinions, strongly influenced by hearing the term and then almost NEEDING to hear that GLARE... Oh my GOD how do you live with that GLARE!!

Except, once they are asked to back it up they tend to disappear...usually showing up in another thread a day later saying the same thing.

If you believe you can tell the difference based purely on ESS vs AKM under controlled testing conditions, start a new post and include how much you are willing to bet on your golden ears when you can't peek.

For the rest of us, don't worry...

I would like to proudly respond that I have failed every single one of these tests - I think I have ears of stone. Although I am sensitive to certain instruments/vocals in very very specific frequencies, but even then it would only be with material I am very familiar with.
Edit: and it's always in a quiet passage without louder adjacent frequencies masking the differences, in other words I would be unable to distinguish differences between 2 DACs playing Nirvana's "Smells Like Teen Spirit".

 

[BDWoody]

I would like to proudly respond that I have failed every single one of these tests - I think I have ears of stone.

No... Just flesh and blood...

Takes the stress out doesn't it...? Did for me...

 

[majingotan]

Definitely the reason why I disliked the Loxjie D10 over the "humpless" Topping D10, D30, Sonata HD Pro, Meizu Pro DAC which I I bought thx to this website... so yes it's audible. The feeling of uncontrolled upper-mids to treble ringing through your skull despite the high clarity.

This is what Sabre glare is all about.

It's 100% BS. I own 4 different DACs with 4 different DAC chips (Cirrus Logic from Apple dongle, ESS Sabre 9218 from FiiO BTR5, Xilinx FPGA from Chord Mojo and Analog Devices AD5781 from Schiit Bifrost 2) and none of them have that glare. In fact, all four DACs sound so similar that I would NOT pass a proper DBT ABX test if I do

 

[Spocko]

I didn't save so much : ( on that costly ADI thing but had to get it for use as audio analyzer and of course its good for subjective comparison too, if you ever cross a friend or place with that KTB give it a chance and listen, it could be you like it even its ESS based and low cost, i'm pretty shure even its not your cup of tea that its really not a anoying experience as you sadly had with Loxjie D10.

I have the ADI2, and it's the equalizer that makes it costly: play with it and tune it to match your headphones/speakers - it's all about your enjoyment, remember your headphones/speakers are coloring the music more than the DAC itself, so use the equalizer!

 

[Spocko]

No... Just flesh and blood...

Takes the stress out doesn't it...? Did for me...

YES, it was a relief to realize that I didn't have golden ears - it took the pressure off of "buying the right product"

 

[BYRTT]

I have the ADI2, and it's the equalizer that makes it costly: play with it and tune it to match your headphones/speakers - it's all about your enjoyment, remember your headphones/speakers are coloring the music more than the DAC itself, so use the equalizer!

Thanks and agree varius signatures of head phones can need equalizer help and what i didn't tell there in previous post was i have SW Reference 4 VST plugin loaded in Jriver for my two set of cans in HD650 and DT770 Pro 250Ω so EQ is covered and therefor Khadas Tone board in my ears perform as well as ADI-2 Pro fs and use of that costly ADI unit is most for analyzer and reference use.

 

[confucius_zero]

ESS Sabre 9218

d10 is the ES9038Q2M which has well documented hump on this website plz consult the page.

 

[confucius_zero]

What headphones/speakers are you listening through?

You can see a small part of daily driver listening setup in my signature!

 

[Spocko]

Thanks and agree varius signatures of head phones can need equalizer help and what i didn't tell there in previous post was i have SW Reference 4 VST plugin loaded in Jriver for my two set of cans in HD650 and DT770 Pro 250Ω so EQ is covered and therefor Khadas Tone board in my ears perform as well as ADI-2 Pro fs and use of that costly ADI unit is most for analyzer and reference use.

Likewise, I have the highly detailed DT1990Pro and need the ADI2's equalizer to adjust its high frequency for difference tracks - I also don't have to have a bunch of different HPs for pro use or casual enjoyment, just tune the EQ depending on my needs.

 

[gvl]

d10 is the ES9038Q2M which has well documented hump on this website plz consult the page.

You should try Topping D50 vs. D50s, same chip but the S has no hump, then tell us if there's any difference in "glare" your sensitive ears can detect.

 

[BYRTT]

Likewise, I have the highly detailed DT1990Pro and need the ADI2's equalizer to adjust its high frequency for difference tracks - I also don't have to have a bunch of different HPs for pro use or casual enjoyment, just tune the EQ depending on my needs.

Nice i can see the avarage profiles they suggest for DT1990Pro in SW Reference 4 as below, there is two DT1990 model to pick about as seen most upper into below visual and then come their avarage measured response including correction and predicted new curve, as reference my HD650 and DT770 is below, if you interested and have a convolution engine in your player then technically i can support you a impulse wav-file of the below suggested EQ curve or you could try the one month trial version of SW package, for my DT770 Pro 250Ω i'm not using the avarage profile correction as listed below but have a dedicated correction per L/R channel for those cans in SW recently had a discount sale on four different models of BeierDynamic including dedicated correction.

 

[Windofrce]

John from JDS Labs. And I totally agree with him

 

[exaudio]

d10 is the ES9038Q2M which has well documented hump on this website plz consult the page.

I believe the DAC chip in the Topping D10 is actually an ESS9018K2M. Amir's measurements of the D10 do not show the ESS hump: