ESS THD ‘Hump’ Investigation

[JohnYang1997]

I should be getting the first DAC with ESS hump fixed in a couple of weeks.....

Still 9038q2m? That will be really interesting. Be sure to use the two test files as well.

 

[IVX]

If I remember correctly, topping dx5 and dx7 were with and without hump ESS based DACs?

 

[JohnYang1997]

If I remember correctly, topping dx5 and dx7 were with and without hump ESS based DACs?

First generation 9018s has a different problem from 9038q2m. 9018s has noise floor modulation but doesn't cause serious imd and thd. The newer generations don't have noise floor modulation, but can cause extra imd thd easily.

 

[IVX]

BTW, my experiments with ES9038Q2M shows me the best THD result with Xtal(that DAC has an internal generator with variable bias) instead of an external oscillator. I investigated that topic a little and found that low phase noise is rather about the oscillator implementation than Xtal quality i.e. high precision oscillator does an excellent job with average Xtal and beats low ph-noise grade oscillator. The only problem is 100MHz Xtal in a compact footprint, I got one in 7050 case but with ES9038Q2M it behaves like 33.333MHz yet, so my experiments were performed with 50MHz Xtal.

 

[amirm]

If I remember correctly, topping dx5 and dx7 were with and without hump ESS based DACs?

Correct. That is when I first discovered the regression in intermodulation distortion.

 

[Music1969]

I should be getting the first DAC with ESS hump fixed in a couple of weeks.....

But you didn't make any mention of any ESS hump in this review?

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...matrix-audio-element-x-dac-streamer-amp.7782/

You said: "Intermodulation distortion is likewise excellent"

 

[JohnYang1997]

But you didn't make any mention of any ESS hump in this review?

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...matrix-audio-element-x-dac-streamer-amp.7782/

You said: "Intermodulation distortion is likewise excellent"

I guess non pro versions?

 

[Music1969]

I guess non pro versions?

Maybe, all he said was "I should be getting the first DAC with ESS hump fixed in a couple of weeks....."

 

[Veri]

I guess non pro versions?

But you didn't make any mention of any ESS hump in this review?

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...matrix-audio-element-x-dac-streamer-amp.7782/

You said: "Intermodulation distortion is likewise excellent"

It has 9038Pro. It has the slightest hint of 'hump' but it is so reduced you wouldn't use it as an example of the 'problem' for sure.

Maybe, all he said was "I should be getting the first DAC with ESS hump fixed in a couple of weeks....."

Yes, I think he means an ESS DAC with a 'revision'.

 

[Music1969]

It has 9038Pro. It has the slightest hint of "hump" but it is so reduced you wouldn't use it as an example of the 'problem' for sure.


Yes, I think he means an ESS DAC with a 'revision'.

Noted. I saw someone else mention this hint of ESS hump but amir only mentioned "Intermodulation distortion is likewise excellent"

 

[Music1969]

Yes, I think he means an ESS DAC with a 'revision'.

This would make sense.

 

[Music1969]

I remember Allo @johan said they were looking into it, so maybe it's a revised Katana?

#328

 

[Veri]

Noted. I saw someone else mention this hint of ESS hump but amir only mentioned "Intermodulation distortion is likewise excellent"

Well, it is truly excellent. Okto DAC8 already got incredible IMD performance, and Matrix got it lower even further, by painstakingly experimenting and keep pushing the performance I'm sure. Very respectable engineering has been done here.

Of course, would be even better if ESS removes the symptom altogether. Then preferring chip manufacturer ie. AKM over ESS would be a moot point more than ever

 

[JohnYang1997]

Well, it is truly excellent. Okto DAC8 already got incredible IMD performance, and Matrix got it lower even further, by painstakingly experimenting and keep pushing the performance I'm sure. Very respectable engineering has been done here.

Of course, would be even better if ESS removes the symptom altogether. Then preferring AKM over ESS would be a moot point more than ever PS, you can edit your posts too btw.

Ak4499......i can't imagine what kind of beast would that be.

 

[IVX]

Ak4499 is bloody expensive chip $55/pcs for MOQ 900pcs, if buy 1-2 pcs it would be up to $100/pcs. However, I personally trust AKM better than ESS.

 

[mgmate]

I should be getting the first DAC with ESS hump fixed in a couple of weeks.....

That's great! Let's see the improvements!.

 

[johan]

I remember Allo @johan said they were looking into it, so maybe it's a revised Katana?

#328

Not ours .

 

[zermak]

I should be getting the first DAC with ESS hump fixed in a couple of weeks.....

Is that the Khadas TB with the balanced outputs also?

 

[amirm]

Here is the DAC with IMD hump fixed: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...nts-of-new-topping-d50s-dac.7914/#post-191447

 

[gvl]

Same ESS part?