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Erin's Audio Corner reviews the Philharmonic Audio BMR Monitor V2 (May 30th)

Thanks, I appreciate the link and comments. Do you think they would be suited to a Keele CBT type array? Possibly an issue off-axis?
Getting off topic but for that application they do not have enough volume displacement and power handling to be used alone and a rising top end response works better. There are a few full range drivers that bridge that compromise better.

For example the SB65 used in Jim Griffin's CBT
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/tech-talk-forum/1348662-jim-s-new-cbt-arrays
 
I would say bmr only widen directivity at many kHz, at around 1 to 8 kHz or something the directivity is comparable to its size. If you only need it as mid, the directivity does not widen at those frequencies.

There are many mid range options if you are willing to find. I did quite a lot research in the past as I thought mid range should be more common as a standard driver.

Searched a lot of companies and measurement websites. Near complete list as follows : Dayton rs series, peerless t series and pls series, wavecor, fostex, sb acoustic dome or sb65, eastech if they have distributor, and quite a lot of Europe companies like Lavoce or ciare etc. Really their directivity are very similar, the only thing to differentiate would be distortion and price.

Most people due to price, performance and availability would probably end up with dayton rs series or peerless t and pls series, specially tc9fd, and also 46mm bmr because it still performs good at the price.
 
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I would say bmr only widen directivity at many kHz, at around 1 to 8 kHz or something the directivity is comparable to its size.
This isn't true, the directivity is wider than a comparably sized cone driver. It still narrows based on it's diaphragm size but to a lesser extent. Measurements linked above can be compared to other drivers to demonstrate.

For a speaker design targeting a higher crossover point to a ribbon this can become valuable. In a design with a 2 to 3K crossover to a dome tweeter that advantage wouldn't be so useful.
 
This isn't true, the directivity is wider than a comparably sized cone driver. It still narrows based on it's diaphragm size but to a lesser extent. Measurements linked above can be compared to other drivers to demonstrate.

For a speaker design targeting a higher crossover point to a ribbon this can become valuable. In a design with a 2 to 3K crossover to a dome tweeter that advantage wouldn't be so useful.
Exactly. What's interesting about the BMR is that its dispersion between 2 kHz and 4 kHz is actually wider than from 1 - 2 kHz. That's because it transitions to its first rocking mode slightly below 2 kHz. If you measure the BMR monitor fairly far off axis, say 45 degrees and wider, a sag develops in the 1-2 kHz region. That's just the inherent response of the little BMR moid.
 
I tested one of the BMR drivers about 6 years ago. Really cool design. Very low sensitivity but many have used it for car audio and I played around with them in an array configuration and had decent results.


Edit: to be clear, this is NOT the same one used in the Philharmonic speakers
 
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Interesting write-up. The BMR unit in the BMR monitor is much more sensitive (86+ dB) and smoother up to about 8 kHz. As your results show, the dispersion and THD performance is amazing for such an inexpensive driver. I've been urging Tectonic for years to come out with a more expensive design with greater power handling and maybe higher sensitivity, and they're finally doing it. I should have a sample unit in a month or so.
 
Interesting write-up. The BMR unit in the BMR monitor is much more sensitive (86+ dB) and smoother up to about 8 kHz. As your results show, the dispersion and THD performance is amazing for such an inexpensive driver. I've been urging Tectonic for years to come out with a more expensive design with greater power handling and maybe higher sensitivity, and they're finally doing it. I should have a sample unit in a month or so.
Can I triple like this? ;)

It wasn't that long ago when you had said they weren't interested in doing anything like that. I'm excited for the potential this could bring to the table.
 
Can I triple like this? ;)

It wasn't that long ago when you had said they weren't interested in doing anything like that. I'm excited for the potential this could bring to the table.
It surprised the heck out of me. It opens up the possibility of doing a truly high output design, but a suitable tweeter would still be a problem.
 
This isn't true, the directivity is wider than a comparably sized cone driver. It still narrows based on it's diaphragm size but to a lesser extent. Measurements linked above can be compared to other drivers to demonstrate.

For a speaker design targeting a higher crossover point to a ribbon this can become valuable. In a design with a 2 to 3K crossover to a dome tweeter that advantage wouldn't be so useful.
I based my observation from Hificompass website. There are BMR46, tc6 and tc9, BMR is just tiny bit more directive than tc6 and less directive then tc9. The sd for tc6 is 15.2 cm^2, for BMR is 19.6 cm^2, for tc9 is 36.3 cm^2. BMR does have better distortion and sensitivity then tc6, but hard to say better directivity then the other two.
 
The BMR are ok drivers not for the highest or lowest frequencies though, I have some for playing around and due to their compact size they can be used for example with a compact dome tweeter to get close to the requirements of D'Appolito, a friend of mine combined them with an AMT:
 

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I based my observation from Hificompass website. There are BMR46, tc6 and tc9, BMR is just tiny bit more directive than tc6 and less directive then tc9. The sd for tc6 is 15.2 cm^2, for BMR is 19.6 cm^2, for tc9 is 36.3 cm^2. BMR does have better distortion and sensitivity then tc6, but hard to say better directivity then the other two.
Hificompass only measures out to 60 degrees, while the lower directivity of the BMR will be most visible if you measure the entire frontal hemisphere. None of these drivers are particularly directive at the frequencies you'd use a dedicated midrange driver, though.
 
Exactly. What's interesting about the BMR is that its dispersion between 2 kHz and 4 kHz is actually wider than from 1 - 2 kHz. That's because it transitions to its first rocking mode slightly below 2 kHz. If you measure the BMR monitor fairly far off axis, say 45 degrees and wider, a sag develops in the 1-2 kHz region. That's just the inherent response of the little BMR moid.
Thank you for inform me on this, I have some thinkings after read the graphs. Directivity of a speaker is the hardest part to understand and design, the only way to really know is use simulation or build prototype, so my sayings as follows are just speculations.

Normally when woofer cross to tweeter, the directivity will narrows, hit lowest point at crossover frequency, then climb. For this speaker it is not the case, so saying BMR actually widen after 2 kHz is a good point. But at 3 kHz there is a 2.5 dB dip range from a bit over 2 kHz to 4 kHz, it is a diffraction of cabinet. I have looked at BMR measurement from Hificompass, the directivity behave like a normal driver without any widening of directivity at low treble. Erin used normalized direcitivity graph, which means the directivity will be compared against on axis that has a 2.5 dB dip. So now here are two hypothesis, one is there is a diffraction which may increase directivity after 2 kHz. The other is the normalization against on axis, from the color contour plot the darkest red will become 0 to 5.5 dB rather then 0 to 3 dB. Both are due to diffraction, but different reasons.

I think a better way of representing graph for color contour plot may look like this:
bmr directivity analysis.PNG


We can see that if we artificially remove the dip in a smart way that there is no diffraction at any angle, the direcitivity will be flatter. That blue line shows the directivity line when diffraction removed, but only valid from 2 kHz to 4 kHz. I know there is still widening even the directivity looks like blue line, the green line is horizontal line, the small white line represents the widening of directivity. I think maybe it is because the diffraction that widens the directivity.

In the end if you followed to here and can understand the point I made, thank you for following along. One thing I want to say to Erin @hardisj is definetly add 3 to 0 dB color in the graph to remind people there is a dip on axis. The other one is when there is diffraction, what can we do to make the contour plot represent a better directivity? Maybe add a few graphs at off axis like 10, 30 or 50 degree where there is no on axis dip. When measurements gets more technical people start to forget what they are looking and what it means, showing them the limitation and odd behavior of measurement will make them understand the speaker and measurement in a more complete and smarter way.
 
For comparison here is the difference is predicted polar response of a 15cm2 Piston and a 19cm2 Piston. The difference of 6mm in diameter.

Sd15vs19.gif


This is the normalized curves for 19cm2 with the 60 degree off axis line being the black one.

Sd19Curves.png
 

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Are you saying klippel does not allow that? That is unfortunate.....:(

Currently. I keep meaning to email them about it but always forget.

However, there is the horizontal spl graphic on my site which also clearly shows diffraction - when it occurs - as well.

1654000993206.png
 
... it still narrows based on it's diaphragm size but ...

Could You show data, because I've not seen it that way?

bmr 46: https://hificompass.com/sites/default/files/zamer/noaxis/tebm46c20n-4b_offaxis_normalized_5-30db.png
peerless T: https://hificompass.com/sites/default/files/zamer/noaxis/tc9fd18-08_offaxis_normalized_5-30db.png

3kHz@60° there is just one tiny little dB, or 4kHz@60° one and a half dB of a difference.

Forgot the HD performance, which shows (some) inferiority of the BMR. Amplitude (half space) is very much the same @96dB:

bmr 46: https://hificompass.com/sites/default/files/zamer/afc315/tebm46c20n-4b_315mm_8v_hpf2-200.png
peerless T: https://hificompass.com/sites/default/files/zamer/afc315/tc9fd18-08_315mm_11v2_hpf2-150.png

The BMR generates a whole lot more higher harmonics, even higher HD2. That is why the
box in question
cannot take full advantage of its complicated three-way design. X/over has to lie somewhere between 800Hz to 1kHz, but not lower. That leaves the problem of intermodulation in the mids untouched.

When the "Philharmonic BMR" once was released it posed that charming potpourri of "Scan Speak" and "ribbon" seasoned with some mysterious new technology, the BMR driver namely. From a more sober engineer's perspective, there are wonders over wonders indeed. Some good can be found in everything.
 
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I did a version with the Purifi in the same .75 cu ft cabinet and ran into port noise difficulties due to the drivers immense travel capability. Recently, I did a design in a larger cabinet with an aggressively flared Precision Port, along with two BMR mids and the RAAL tweet in an MTM layout like the BMR Tower...I'll probably be offering the ported design on a per-order basis using a domestically built cabinet.
T: 0 seconds :eek: OMG it's happening!

T: 60 seconds :D This is going to be amazing especially with this potentially improved BMR driver out of left field

T: 61 seconds :facepalm: I just got the curved rosewood's though

If someone is willing to buy a (slightly dusty from spring cleaning) mint pair of curved rosewood BMR V2 I'll happily re-route the money to place a pre-order sight unseen on these to further fund development.

Given the state of class D amp development in general (especially the the budget market), the burgeoning high-power/low-cost used market for the last generation of purifi/ncore/whatever-that-one-with-the-p-is, and the aging but still powerful class a/b used market that will get a boost from people making the switch to the newest gen class-D I don't think overall sensitivity should really be high on the design list anymore.

Power is cheap and only going to get cheaper. I'd trade a mid-70s DB sensitivity for increased power handling capabilities. That means you could run them in a 'normal' room on 125W (1%@4ohm PA5) at 3m and hit ~86dbSPL and that's before you even use subwoofers to handle the most energy intensive part of the range.
 
Just posted my pair for sale actually:
 
It surprised the heck out of me. It opens up the possibility of doing a truly high output design, but a suitable tweeter would still be a problem.
Will be interesting to see the options for higher power handlings ribbons. It seems major manufacturers that use ribbons fabricate their own (Elac, Dali), while some smaller companies have them built to spec (Concident), where it may not be obvious who their builder is. Then there are the common ones available for custom builds like the Dayton, Fostex, and HiVi, plus the RAAL and apparently a few others. Apparently if you spend enough $ Raal has models that can handle higher power levels?
 
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