Endgame headphones amp

[Doodski]

They absolutely do have soundstage and differences in stereo imaging. I can swap connectors between two DACs on my desk right now and tell exactly which is which in the dark because one has a more spacious sound than the other, and one has vocals that sound more in the middle of my head than in front and projected wide like in a live lounge bar type setting.

Some folks need to stop focusing solely on what a graph tells them, graphs are great but they don't tell the whole story.

DACs have a output voltage for the output signal. You can't simply switch from one DAC to another and expect them to have the same output voltage. The higher output voltage DAC will sound better and have better imaging.

 

[robbiekhan]

DACs have a output voltage for the output signal. You can't simply switch from one DAC to another and expect them to have the same output voltage. The higher output voltage DAC will sound better and have better imaging.

No. My M15i sounds better with the Ananda Nano than my Topping DX3 Pro+ and Fiio K7. I'm not on about loudness, the actual sound, it's just outright better than both of those headphone amps. It is current drive though of course so power output isn't comparable in relation to the sound being heard to other regular headphone amps.

 

[Doodski]

I'm not on about loudness, the actual sound

The difference will not be about a much louder volume in many situations. The difference is very subtle but enough to trick your ears and mind. Do you have a digital multimeter with AC volts? If you do then use a sine wave generator set at 100Hz and then use the multimeter on AC Volts to meter out the voltage level. Do this for all the DACs and you will see the output voltage of each is different.

Online Tone Generator - generate pure tones of any frequency

szynalski.com

 

[WalterW]

They absolutely do have soundstage and differences in stereo imaging. I can swap connectors between two DACs on my desk right now and tell exactly which is which in the dark because one has a more spacious sound than the other, and one has vocals that sound more in the middle of my head than in front and projected wide like in a live lounge bar type setting.

Some folks need to stop focusing solely on what a graph tells them, graphs are great but they don't tell the whole story.

I don't believe this and there is also no evidence for this or any kind of argument, why and how should that be happening.

 

[FrantzM]

They absolutely do have soundstage and differences in stereo imaging. I can swap connectors between two DACs on my desk right now and tell exactly which is which in the dark because one has a more spacious sound than the other, and one has vocals that sound more in the middle of my head than in front and projected wide like in a live lounge bar type setting.

Some folks need to stop focusing solely on what a graph tells them, graphs are great but they don't tell the whole story.

A bit of levity but this is what comes to my mind when I saw your comment.. here, in ASR

Peace.

 

[Zoide]

So... Any other amp recommendations for a Dan Clark E3, ideally one with discrete volume control?

I'd been thinking of an A70 Pro or A90 Discrete, but all the horror stories about Topping QC make me hesitate.

The HPA4 looks very nice, but unfortunately way out of my budget.

Thanks

 

[LoFiAudiophile]

So... Any other amp recommendations for a Dan Clark E3, ideally one with discrete volume control?

I'd been thinking of an A70 Pro or A90 Discrete, but all the horror stories about Topping QC make me hesitate.

The HPA4 looks very nice, but unfortunately way out of my budget.

Thanks

JDS Labs Atom is a powerhouse and JDS Labs support is legendary. If you want something from Topping, then L30-II has all the power you’d need. Both have state of the art performance.

 

[Zoide]

JDS Labs Atom is a powerhouse and JDS Labs support is legendary. If you want something from Topping, then L30-II has all the power you’d need. Both have state of the art performance.

Thanks, but the Atom output isn't balanced, and my upcoming E3 are.

 

[Doodski]

JDS Labs Atom is a powerhouse and JDS Labs support is legendary. If you want something from Topping, then L30-II has all the power you’d need. Both have state of the art performance.

The Schiit Magni is USD $119 and is a little more powerful that a ATOM AMP+ and has a 3 year warranty.

Sorry I did not know you need balanced......

 

[LoFiAudiophile]

Thanks, but the Atom output isn't balanced, and my upcoming E3 are.

Ah, sorry I didn’t know that. The only benefit of a balanced/differential amplifier is that you /could/ get more power (upto 4x more) but the single ended ones I mentioned already have more power than needed. I would recommend an adapter (balanced headphones can always be connected to single ended amps with an adapter). Benchmark had a whole section on why balanced/differential output doesn’t make sense for headphones.

If you indeed want to get an amp with differential output, I can recommend Fiio K13 - it’s beautiful and powerful.

 

[Loomynarty]

So... Any other amp recommendations for a Dan Clark E3, ideally one with discrete volume control?

I'd been thinking of an A70 Pro or A90 Discrete, but all the horror stories about Topping QC make me hesitate.

The HPA4 looks very nice, but unfortunately way out of my budget.

Thanks

Topping DX9 is great. I'd say it's the best piece of audio equipment I've owned in the 6 or so years I've been messing around with this stuff.
I can't speak to the QC issues as the only other Topping device I've owned is an A50s amp. That thing had zero issues and in the 1 month I've had the DX9 it also works flawlessly.

 

[Zibi]

Ah, sorry I didn’t know that. The only benefit of a balanced/differential amplifier is that you /could/ get more power (upto 4x more) but the single ended ones I mentioned already have more power than needed. I would recommend an adapter (balanced headphones can always be connected to single ended amps with an adapter). Benchmark had a whole section on why balanced/differential output doesn’t make sense for headphones.

If you indeed want to get an amp with differential output, I can recommend Fiio K13 - it’s beautiful and powerful.

"Benchmark had a whole section on why balanced/differential output doesn’t make sense for headphones." Can you point us to this Benchmark section? There is no such a thing as "balanced headphones" . All are passive devices that can be connected to the amp with either single ended or pull/push cable from 4 pin amp output. Unfortunately, that 4pin output is commonly called "balanced" and frequently interpreted as balanced in the interconnector sense, which is completely different. All this is confusing many people. I am curious to see how Benchmark has explained that pull/push doesn't make sense. BTW, pull/push connector is not about getting more power, it is about how the power is delivered (time function) to the HPs.

 

[zonk]

"Benchmark had a whole section on why balanced/differential output doesn’t make sense for headphones." Can you point us to this Benchmark section? There is no such a thing as "balanced headphones" . All are passive devices that can be connected to the amp with either single ended or pull/push cable from 4 pin amp output. Unfortunately, that 4pin output is commonly called "balanced" and frequently interpreted as balanced in the interconnector sense, which is completely different. All this is confusing many people. I am curious to see how Benchmark has explained that pull/push doesn't make sense. BTW, pull/push connector is not about getting more power, it is about how the power is delivered (time function) to the HPs.

Here is a link to Benchmark Media Systems:
https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/application_notes/audio-myth-balanced-headphone-outputs-are-better

Don't know if this is the information that you were looking for.

Some of the best measured headphone amps like Topping L50, A30PRO have a 4-pin XLR headphone connector mainly for convenience reasons.

 

[RoA]

Is anything here ever 'endgame'?

Human nature is such that we always want better, different ... . You may as well get something cheap and change/add in a few months (as most do regardless of the equipment cost) because you will when you see the 'next best youtube thing' or review on Headfi. Even here folks change stuff almost as frequent as underwear, at least I hope so in the latter's case.

 

[Zoide]

Even here folks change stuff almost as frequent as underwear

In that case, I think changing stuff every month or so is not so bad...