End Game Speaker Quest - The Final Chapter

[RickS]

Ok, let’s cut the speculative chatter about the OP unless you have some proof. In that case, it should be reported to the staff for investigation.

Thanks for your cooperation.

 

[dpturner]

yeah, not again. i have seriously enjoyed both of the threads, and learned from them.

 

[Duke]

Ok, let’s cut the speculative chatter about the OP unless you have some proof. In that case, it should be reported to the staff for investigation.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Thank YOU!

 

[RickS]

Completed a round of thread clean up from trolling by a previously banned member.

Please excuse if you replied to the trolling and your post got deleted too.

 

[MattHooper]

@MKR

It’s been such a journey. I can’t remember if you’ve already given this information but:

1. What speakers will these new active speakers be replacing? I’d be curious about your speaker owning history.

2. Have you posted any pictures of your room where the speakers will be placed? Is your listening room otherwise complete and how you want it?

 

[MKR]

@MKR

It’s been such a journey. I can’t remember if you’ve already given this information but:

1. What speakers will these new active speakers be replacing? I’d be curious about your speaker owning history.

2. Have you posted any pictures of your room where the speakers will be placed? Is your listening room otherwise complete and how you want it?

Great thoughtful questions as always @MattHooper

As to my speaker history …. Aerial Acoustics 10T -> Talon Audio Khorus -> Linkwitz Orions (the original design) -> JBL Studio 590s … there was a large gap of many years between the Orions and 590s due to living situation and no decent listening room (a ton of business travel, plus living abroad for a time), and as of few years ago, I got back into the hobby due to finally having a living situation that would support (hence the “quest”), and here we are.

No pics of listening room, but it is 13’x15’x8’ over garage “bonus” room. Not large by any means (and not near as large as initially planned), but not necessarily small either. Someday I hope to have a larger room, but this will do for now. Room is finished/complete. And outside of typical home furnishings, zero room treatment. Once I have the final speakers in room will certainly be sure to post some pics. And a reminder as I have stated prior, this will be a dual purpose theater/music system, and will eventually have a front projection system. Was considering LED panel, and may still go that path, but front projection better for acoustics as I can run the front channel behind acoustically transparent screen, rather than having to mount a panel quite high to clear the floorstanding center channel.

 

[MattHooper]

As to my speaker history …. Aerial Acoustics 10T -> Talon Audio Khorus -> Linkwitz Orions (the original design) -> JBL Studio 590s …

Interesting! It’s been many years, but I remember being quite impressed with the Aerial Acoustics 10T. It sounded generally quite neutral, and as someone who grew up listening to KEF 105.2 speakers I recognized the form factor.

I’ve always wanted to hear a Linkwitz speaker.

Most interesting is that you had the Talons
That speaker was “the buzz” among the audiophiles for a brief time long ago. I actually ended up trying the bookshelf version of the Khorus in my home. (the less said about that the better). Did you like the Talons?

No pics of listening room, but it is 13’x15’x8’ over garage “bonus” room. Not large by any means (and not near as large as initially planned), but not necessarily small either. Someday I hope to have a larger room, but this will do for now. Room is finished/complete. And outside of typical home furnishings, zero room treatment. Once I have the final speakers in room will certainly be sure to post some pics. And a reminder as I have stated prior, this will be a dual purpose theater/music system, and will eventually have a front projection system. Was considering LED panel, and may still go that path, but front projection better for acoustics as I can run the front channel behind acoustically transparent screen, rather than having to mount a panel quite high to clear the floorstanding center channel.

By coincidence that’s the exact size of my own room where I combined my separate 2 channel system with my projection based Home theatre. Wasn’t easy to juggle all those balls, but it worked out for me perfectly in the end. With persistence and some ingenuity, you can have it all

 

[MKR]

Interesting! It’s been many years, but I remember being quite impressed with the Aerial Acoustics 10T. It sounded generally quite neutral, and as someone who grew up listening to KEF 105.2 speakers I recognized the form factor.

I’ve always wanted to hear a Linkwitz speaker.

Most interesting is that you had the Talons
That speaker was “the buzz” among the audiophiles for a brief time long ago. I actually ended up trying the bookshelf version of the Khorus in my home. (the less said about that the better). Did you like the Talons?



By coincidence that’s the exact size of my own room where I combined my separate 2 channel system with my projection based Home theatre. Wasn’t easy to juggle all those balls, but it worked out for me perfectly in the end. With persistence and some ingenuity, you can have it all

The Orion was a revelation. My first exposure to an active dipole, designed with real engineering principles of course, never heard a holographic presentation like that, loved them. And yes, I loved the Khorus. Though in those days I was drinking the HEA audiophoolery kool aid, you name it I was into it, all the snake oil. To this day my memories of the Khorus are positive, but knowing what I know now, and knowing what to listen for I expect my judgement would be different. I will say though the description you give below are definitely not the Talons I knew, and I heard them all. I have to believe there was something broken, but who knows. There was definitely a two camp opinion of Talon, seemed it was love or hate.

Your prior comments for others background:
“A pair of Talon Audio stand mount speaker (Peregrine IIRC). Talon had huge buzz back around 2000 with their big Khorus speakers and I ended up with a pair of their then-new stand mounted version in my place for a while. I could not believe the sound - the most colored speaker I'd ever heard - muffled, dark, weird dips here and there, bulging upper bass etc. I was sure they must have been broken in transit. Sent them back and...nope...that's how they were supposed to sound apparently.”

As to the room, I have seen pics of yours and it looks great! What front projection system are you using? And what are you using for a processor?

 

[MattHooper]

I will say though the description you give below are definitely not the Talons I knew, and I heard them all. I have to believe there was something broken, but who knows. There was definitely a two camp opinion of Talon, seemed it was love or hate.

Your prior comments for others background:
“A pair of Talon Audio stand mount speaker (Peregrine IIRC). Talon had huge buzz back around 2000 with their big Khorus speakers and I ended up with a pair of their then-new stand mounted version in my place for a while. I could not believe the sound - the most colored speaker I'd ever heard - muffled, dark, weird dips here and there, bulging upper bass etc. I was sure they must have been broken in transit. Sent them back and...nope...that's how they were supposed to sound apparently.”

Out of curiosity, have you ever looked at the NRC measurements of the Talon Khorus?

Here they are:

SoundStage! Measurements - Talon Audio Khorus Loudspeakers (11/2000)

And that’s pretty much how the smaller model sounded to me. It seems they had a certain house sound going at that point. (I’ve heard from more recent owners that they’ve updated their design to be more neutral).

As to the room, I have seen pics of yours and it looks great!

Much obliged

What front projection system are you using? And what are you using for a processor?

I’m using a JVC RS600 projector that I bought back around 2016. It was their first 4K capable projector - Eshift - and also I believe it’s still the highest native contrast projector they’ve produced. They’ve moved onto laser based projectors which are priced way out of my reach at this point. But those tend to have lower native contrast. I have a Lumagen Pro VP ready to do HDR processing for my projector, but I still need to upgrade my HDMI cable to be able to run 4K HDR.

I tried to keep my room as uncluttered as possible, so my projector is sitting on a lift hidden behind the sofa. When the home theatre mode is activated, the projector lifts up to over 6 feet turns on and is ready to project onto my screen.

I’m using a Stewart ST130 white screen - I generally find the screen artifacts on ALR screens to be intolerable, and so I chose a white screen along with controlling light reflection in the room to maintain high contrast.

The screen has a four-way automated black velvet masking system that I sort of put together from two different systems, so that it can change aspect ratio or size as I desire with the image area always perfectly masked (that might’ve been the best decision I made in my whole home theatre).

The screen goes up to 124" wide for CinemaScope, and up to around 128" or so diagonal for large format 16:9/1:85:1/IMAX material - seating distance is 10 to 11 feet at the sofa.

Probably more than you wanted to know… but ask a home theatre geek a question and...

 

[MKR]

Out of curiosity, have you ever looked at the NRC measurements of the Talon Khorus?

Here they are:

SoundStage! Measurements - Talon Audio Khorus Loudspeakers (11/2000)

And that’s pretty much how the smaller model sounded to me. It seems they had a certain house sound going at that point. (I’ve heard from more recent owners that they’ve updated their design to be more neutral).



Much obliged



I’m using a JVC RS600 projector that I bought back around 2016. It was their first 4K capable projector - Eshift - and also I believe it’s still the highest native contrast projector they’ve produced. They’ve moved onto laser based projectors which are priced way out of my reach at this point. But those tend to have lower native contrast. I have a Lumagen Pro VP ready to do HDR processing for my projector, but I still need to upgrade my HDMI cable to be able to run 4K HDR.

I tried to keep my room as uncluttered as possible, so my projector is sitting on a lift hidden behind the sofa. When the home theatre mode is activated, the projector lifts up to over 6 feet turns on and is ready to project onto my screen.

I’m using a Stewart ST130 white screen - I generally find the screen artifacts on ALR screens to be intolerable, and so I chose a white screen along with controlling light reflection in the room to maintain high contrast.

The screen has a four-way automated black velvet masking system that I sort of put together from two different systems, so that it can change aspect ratio or size as I desire with the image area always perfectly masked (that might’ve been the best decision I made in my whole home theatre).

The screen goes up to 124" wide for CinemaScope, and up to around 128" or so diagonal for large format 16:9/1:85:1/IMAX material - seating distance is 10 to 11 feet at the sofa.

Probably more than you wanted to know… but ask a home theatre geek a question and...

Indeed I am aware of those Khorus measurements and they aren’t good for sure. But, to provide the full story, when i first got my Khorus in fact I was not so impressed, with similar impressions to yours (though not quite that negative, i still enjoyed the speakers very much, but there were clear issues). Very long story short, there was a “rev 2” Khorus with different crossover and mine were upgraded with new crossover and it was then that I became quite smitten with them. Much improved. I don’t know for certain, but I don’t think a Khorus with this new crossover was ever measured by anyone. Anyway, they were a bit of a “first love”, we always seem to have positive memories of our first love, even if not true … these days I consider myself much more enlightened in this hobby and I suspect the Khorus might run me out of the room if I heard them today.

Wow, seems I asked the right fella about theater topic! Very slick setup you have there. I might pick your brain a bit going forward if you don’t mind. Note projector I am considering is the Valerion VisionMaster Pro 2. Seems tough to beat for the money. Know much about it? I plan to have a drop down acoustically transparent screen.

 

[MattHooper]

Indeed I am aware of those Khorus measurements and they aren’t good for sure. But, to provide the full story, when i first got my Khorus in fact I was not so impressed, with similar impressions to yours (though not quite that negative, i still enjoyed the speakers very much, but there were clear issues). Very long story short, there was a “rev 2” Khorus with different crossover and mine were upgraded with new crossover and it was then that I became quite smitten with them. Much improved. I don’t know for certain, but I don’t think a Khorus with this new crossover was ever measured by anyone. Anyway, they were a bit of a “first love”, we always seem to have positive memories of our first love, even if not true … these days I consider myself much more enlightened in this hobby and I suspect the Khorus might run me out of the room if I heard them today.

OK, that’s making more sense

Wow, seems I asked the right fella about theater topic! Very slick setup you have there. I might pick your brain a bit going forward if you don’t mind. Note projector I am considering is the Valerion VisionMaster Pro 2. Seems tough to beat for the money. Know much about it? I plan to have a drop down acoustically transparent screen.

I’m afraid I’m mostly running on fumes at this point in terms of my knowledge. I was an absolute obsessive about all things home theatre up until about 2010 when my room was finally completed. From then on, I kept up on projectors only really until I bought my last one in 2016. Now I only dip in occasionally to the AVSFforum.

I still retain some pretty decent knowledge of principles in terms of getting good performance from a projector system.

However, I simply haven’t kept up on the latest offerings, and so I’m not in a position to recommend or comment on newer gear.

 

[MKR]

Howdy all … just a quick update … system design finalized and now in build! Due to lead and ship times, likely won’t have everything until Octoberish (maybe later, maybe sooner). Plenty of time to find ULF sub, AVP, and front projection system so everything ready to go when they arrive.

 

[steve59]

Congrats!!! It has been an interesting journey and when you posted considering both planar and coax switchable I thought it was a recipe for misery. Spending the entire listening session listening to the speakers instead of the music.

I forget if they're fully powered or just the bass modules? Also being DSP based you'll need access, I've got some Meridians that offer limited control thru a tablet using their software. I am interested how Soundfield implements DSP. 2 years of earning interest on $20k likely covers the sales tax

 

[MKR]

Congrats!!! It has been an interesting journey and when you posted considering both planar and coax switchable I thought it was a recipe for misery. Spending the entire listening session listening to the speakers instead of the music.

I forget if they're fully powered or just the bass modules? Also being DSP based you'll need access, I've got some Meridians that offer limited control thru a tablet using their software. I am interested how Soundfield implements DSP. 2 years of earning interest on $20k likely covers the sales tax

Hey @steve59! Great to hear from you

Well, you aren’t far from the reality, the planar vs coax situation was a bit of misery … in that they sounded more similar than different, so took forever to make the choice. I got to a point of paralysis by analysis and forgot about the music. I eventually came to my senses, and pulled myself out of the rat hole. While again both drivers excellent, in the end the planar ticked off more of the boxes and simply made me happy. It is a testament to Soundfield's design ability that two very different drivers sounded more the same than different!

Speakers fully active via Hypex Fusion (which also includes the DSP). You can access the DSP via the Hypex HFD software (Windows based)

 

[MattHooper]

I eventually came to my senses, and pulled myself out of the rat hole. While again both drivers excellent, in the end the planar ticked off more of the boxes and simply made me happy.

I’ve been there occasionally.

For instance I had a similar experience but with my tube amps. I’ve had my Conrad Johnson premier 12 tube amps for over 20 years, and a few years ago I snagged a great deal on a pair of heavily modified premier 12s so I bought those to compare with my originals.

The modded ones seemed to have some distinct properties that I really liked, but overall the differences were subtle, and I went back-and-forth forever trying to decide which I liked better. The modded ones we’re beautifully restored, museum-quality, and certainly in better shape than my old ones so they had that going for them as well.

But in the end, I decided to stick with my originals and sell the modded CJs.

Sometimes I get out of it by asking myself: which (A or B) would I miss most if it went away? My original CJs had the sound that I was used to, and had certain qualities that I crave, and I knew I would miss that too much if I didn’t have it anymore. They also provoked in me less “ analysis.”

Glad you were able to find which one seemed to allow you to focus most on music.

 

[EPICURIOUS007]

it's October, i think i am more anxious for you to get these speakers then you are.
Congrats btw can't wait to see the final product set up and in your room.

 

[MKR]

it's October, i think i am more anxious for you to get these speakers then you are.
Congrats btw can't wait to see the final product set up and in your room.

LOL … thanks, I am going nuts. Well, it’s been about 3 years or so since I began this insanity, so I suppose another 1-2 months won’t be the death of me. Cabinets are complete, but made overseas, on their way to Soundfield for assembly and testing.

 

[ErVikingo]

LOL … thanks, I am going nuts. Well, it’s been about 3 years or so since I began this insanity, so I suppose another 1-2 months won’t be the death of me. Cabinets are complete, but made overseas, on their way to Soundfield for assembly and testing.

So when is the listening party?

 

[Mr. Widget]

So when is the listening party?

That is the $30,000 question, isn't it?

 

[MKR]

So when is the listening party?

As soon as I have them in my possession! Seriously, for those that are in the area (Boise,ID to be exact), or even those that are willing to travel, y’all are welcome to stop by for a listen any time.