Emotiva XMC-2 Review (AV Processor)

[RichB]

@amirm or the kind member that shipped the XMC-1, what firmware was it running?

I'll assume that Amir has the emails for Lonnie or others, did they respond?
It is reasonable to expect the RMC-1 and XMC-2 to behave similarly given the front 3 channels have the same DACs and architecture but that is clearly not the case.

Could it be that the cabling is poorly implemented, power supply hygiene, or the compact size has caused interference?
This is just bizarre to have this performance for a product the is 90% the same as its bigger brother.

I can say the RMC-1 sounds excellent and the Dolby upmixer is incredible with 2.0 sources.
My system is 5.2, I use bass management, and Direct mode most of the time and it is the best sounding processor I have owned.

I find everything about the Denon X3700 to be meh, it works but it is certainly noting to write home about from the menu system to the input switching time.

- Rich

 

[RichB]

That's not a question of accepting or not, we just don't have the choice. That's how the AV receiver/pre-pro market currently works. Main issues will get fixed based on customer feedback, in the form of firmware when it is possible. Hence my point of getting the latest firmware prior to measurements.

Agreed. Testing data should include the firmware revision used. This is the reality of the high-end processor marketplace.
I'd expect owners of the XMC-2 to be very interested in that data (or is it datum?)

- Rich

 

[respice finem]

That's not a question of accepting or not, we just don't have the choice. That's how the AV receiver/pre-pro market currently works. Main issues will get fixed based on customer feedback, in the form of firmware when it is possible. Hence my point of getting the latest firmware prior to measurements.

Getting the latest firmware is not wrong. The rest is, sorry. We certainly do have a choice, which is not rewarding such practices by buying half-baked stuff. It is not something our lives depend on. I never volunteered as anybody's beta tester for my own money.

 

[poopy]

.... We certainly do have a choice, which is not rewarding such practices by buying half-baked stuff. It is not something our lives depend on. I never volunteered as anybody's beta tester.

What are you advocating, abstinence? Buying 'full-baked' stuff, what are those?

 

[respice finem]

What are you advocating, abstinence? Buying 'full-baked' stuff, what are those?

Speaking of AV receivers, my humble Marantz NR1608 has no problems for now 5 or so years, not with the first firmware and not with the following ones - all more or less just cosmetic changes, seemingly. The RME ADI2-DAC ditto. The rest of my audio gear has no upgradeable firmware, everything works "out of the box" as it should. Maybe because I don't buy the latest stuff, but preferably "ver. 2.0" of things?
BTW temporary abstinence is a means to (maybe) force manufacturers to due diligence, knowingly buying flawed stuff is not.
If I had such troubles as you describe with my AVR, I'd probably say "scr€w it" and revert back to "oldschool" stereo.
While surround is nice, I'll survive without.

 

[AdamG]

Thread Notice: This is an Official Product Review Thread. Keep your comments and conversation anchored to the Subject review. Take all other unrelated conversations either to a new thread or pm. Yes I am talking to you!

Please and thank you.

 

[poopy]

[

Thread Notice: This is an Official Product Review Thread. Keep your comments and conversation anchored to the Subject review. Take all other unrelated conversations either to a new thread or pm. Yes I am talking to you!

Please and thank you.

Why when people see the word 'abstinence' they directly think it's related to sex or alcohol.... It can be related to AV processor. What that's unusual?

 

[ezra_s]

IIRC, not the first time amirm test a flawed unit from this brand. Emotiva ..

 

[GimeDsp]

Did everyone ignore the specifics that the thing wouldn't output video? Did I read the review right?

If that's the case then this thing isn't just "not fully baked" but it's burnt to a crisp. Toasty in the wrong way.

 

[sam_adams]

As we all saw with the RMC-1 review, firmware can cetainly change a device's performance from bad to excellent:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...av-processor-review.11673/page-46#post-344170

From a reference standpoint, the firmware version really should be mentioned in the review and like the RMC-1 review, if there is a new version available—at the time of testing—it should be applied with the owner's consent to see if it changes the device's performance. This is not only fair to the manufacturer, it is fair to readers here to have a point of comparison. I know this could make for a lot of extra work for @amirm to have to test the device twice, but data is data.

 

[sam_adams]

Did everyone ignore the specifics that the thing wouldn't output video? Did I read the review right? If that's the case then this thing isn't just "not fully baked" but it's burnt to a crisp. Toasty in the wrong way.

I mentioned over here that the no video issue might be an HDCP 2.2 issue with @amirm's monitor. He didn't spec what he was using so we don't know the cause of the no video issue.

 

[GimeDsp]

I mentioned over here that the no video issue might be an HDCP 2.2 issue with @amirm's monitor. He didn't spec what he was using so we don't know the cause of the no video issue.

So you are saying that it can not do old HDCP specs, that it isn't backward compliant?

That would be crazy as every computer and TV and AV I have used has always been backward compliant. I just took for granted that was the case with USB and HDCP
Is that what you think the problem might be?

 

[sealman]

Why are there 2 instances of the Marantz AV7705 in the "Home Theater AVR/Processor SINAD list?

 

[RichB]

So you are saying that it can not do old HDCP specs, that it isn't backward compliant?

That would be crazy as every computer and TV and AV I have used has always been backward compliant. I just took for granted that was the case with USB and HDCP
Is that what you think the problem might be?

There is an HDMI 1.4 setting per input to accommodate older displays when there are compatibility uses. I think Denon/Marantz have these settings as well. HDMI is not the most robust of standards

- Rich

 

[sam_adams]

So you are saying that it can not do old HDCP specs, that it isn't backward compliant?

That would be crazy as every computer and TV and AV I have use has always been backward compliant.
Is that what you think the problem might be?

We don't know what the cause could be because we don't know what Samsung monitor @amirm was using for the video connection. It could be caused by some strange planetary alignment for all we know since he didn't spec the model and didn't troubleshoot the issue. It really isn't all that important because the review is for the audio performance of the device and not the video performance. We really do have to give him some slack with all the reviews he does.

 

[sarumbear]

That's not a question of accepting or not, we just don't have the choice. That's how the AV receiver/pre-pro market currently works. Main issues will get fixed based on customer feedback, in the form of firmware when it is possible. Hence my point of getting the latest firmware prior to measurements.

I don't accept that.

I have been a Denon AVR user and none of the units I purchased has been shipped with specifications that have improved with future upgrades. The updates had introduced functionality, which were advertised as "available with future updates".

You may be confusing functionality with quality.

 

[Koeitje]

As we all saw with the RMC-1 review, firmware can cetainly change a device's performance from bad to excellent:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...av-processor-review.11673/page-46#post-344170

From a reference standpoint, the firmware version really should be mentioned in the review and like the RMC-1 review, if there is a new version available—at the time of testing—it should be applied with the owner's consent to see if it changes the device's performance. This is not only fair to the manufacturer, it is fair to readers here to have a point of comparison. I know this could make for a lot of extra work for @amirm to have to test the device twice, but data is data.

The problem I have with these things is that it shouldn't have been sold with the old broken firmware. Basic performance levels should be good from the get go. You can have firmware upgrades to fix certain bugs or problems in edge use cases, but for a hifi product I at the very least expect it to perform up to a certain standard (maybe this does and Emotiva's standards are just low?).

Next time they should get their ducks in a row before releasing pre-release alpha level firmware in a $3000 commercial product.

 

[peanuts]

next time they should get their rucks in a row? this is typical emotiva. ALL of their processors have been buggy shit. they promise fixes for years but they rarely happen.

 

[sam_adams]

The problem I have with these things is that it shouldn't have been sold with the old broken firmware. Basic performance levels should be good from the get go. You can have firmware upgrades to fix certain bugs or problems in edge use cases, but for a hifi product I at the very least expect it to perform up to a certain standard (maybe this does and Emotiva's standards are just low?).

Next time they should get their ducks in a row before releasing pre-release alpha level firmware in a $3000 commercial product.

In a perfect world, everything would work all the time. Nothing would ever break or wear out. Every device would have perfect specs. There would be no need for ASR. We would all be writing poetry at high altitude.

However, the current state of affairs brings us to the reality that devices seem to ship before they are ready. They are full of bugs. Their performance lacks. Companies seem to have taken the Captain Kirk attitude of, "Test it in combat!" They are all too willing to trade consumer goodwill tomorrow for profit today.

If you guys think this device is unacceptable because of its performance from a small company like Emotiva—and I'm not defending them—it's a good thing that you didn't buy a Sony X900H, you'd be apoplectic by now.

 

[DWPress]

If someone is tossing their XMC-2 after this review - I'll buy the remote for $10. I'm a sucker for heavy metal encased remotes.