• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Emotiva Airmotiv B1+ Review (Bookshelf Speaker)

Bear123

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Nov 27, 2019
Messages
796
Likes
1,370
The crutch of the matter is, as I keep proving, there is no option on the “market” to allow using small speakers with a subwoofer other than the ubiquitous miniDSP (or a 5+ channel AVR) There seems to be a solution for a while but only in USA and even that no longer exists.
How about this?:
Anthem STR integrated amplifier

It's pricey, and lends some credibility to just using a Denon AVR instead, even if only for two channels. I suppose Denon could manufacture a 2 channel only device like this(with modern connectivity, Audyssey, SubEq HT, etc etc,) but the market for it would be so infinitesimally small that it probably wouldn't be lucrative, and the price wouldn't necessarily be low enough to justify vs their multi channel AVR's.

It seems as though maybe therein lies the problem. If Denon would produce such a device, it would not appeal at all to a huge percentage of the typical audiophile market, since it has eq, bass management, subwoofer outputs, etc. For those that it would appeal to, it seems like another big percentage of that group would simply just get an AVR in order to feed their center channel and surrounds speakers, or at least have the capability of adding them if they desired.
 

nathan

Senior Member
Joined
May 24, 2020
Messages
361
Likes
252
How about this?:
Anthem STR integrated amplifier

It's pricey, and lends some credibility to just using a Denon AVR instead, even if only for two channels. I suppose Denon could manufacture a 2 channel only device like this(with modern connectivity, Audyssey, SubEq HT, etc etc,) but the market for it would be so infinitesimally small that it probably wouldn't be lucrative, and the price wouldn't necessarily be low enough to justify vs their multi channel AVR's.

It seems as though maybe therein lies the problem. If Denon would produce such a device, it would not appeal at all to a huge percentage of the typical audiophile market, since it has eq, bass management, subwoofer outputs, etc. For those that it would appeal to, it seems like another big percentage of that group would simply just get an AVR in order to feed their center channel and surrounds speakers, or at least have the capability of adding them if they desired.

Good call out. I forgot about them when I was making my list of all the other two channel systems that offer bass management..... yet this Anthem piece of kit appears to have a sophisticated two sub output system that actually allows one do to (perhaps only via the ARC system?) much of what the miniDSP does.
 

nathan

Senior Member
Joined
May 24, 2020
Messages
361
Likes
252
There is the NAD Master Series that have Dirac and sub pre-outs, but they aren't exactly cheap.

Good note. I forgot to list them too!

Actually I guess I was listing "cheap" stuff (all under 1k) other than the Parasound of course ;)
 

richard12511

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 23, 2020
Messages
4,335
Likes
6,700
How about this?:
Anthem STR integrated amplifier

It's pricey, and lends some credibility to just using a Denon AVR instead, even if only for two channels. I suppose Denon could manufacture a 2 channel only device like this(with modern connectivity, Audyssey, SubEq HT, etc etc,) but the market for it would be so infinitesimally small that it probably wouldn't be lucrative, and the price wouldn't necessarily be low enough to justify vs their multi channel AVR's.

It seems as though maybe therein lies the problem. If Denon would produce such a device, it would not appeal at all to a huge percentage of the typical audiophile market, since it has eq, bass management, subwoofer outputs, etc. For those that it would appeal to, it seems like another big percentage of that group would simply just get an AVR in order to feed their center channel and surrounds speakers, or at least have the capability of adding them if they desired.

I believe he stated "no AVRs"?, though I'm not sure why. Decent AVRs are sonically indistinguishable from the best amps at spls they can handle, and if the load is too much, there are AVRs with good pre-outs for external amplification. Not only are good AVRs sonically indistinguishable, they usually come with many other features that are often an actual audible benefit for 2 channel. So, I don't get why an AVR would be unsuitable for 2 channel listening? Is it because the box is too large? You don't want to pay for features you won't use? The latter argument doesn't make sense, as those AVRs are usually less expensive than similar quality 2 channel dedicated components.
 

nathan

Senior Member
Joined
May 24, 2020
Messages
361
Likes
252
I believe he stated "no AVRs"?, though I'm not sure why. Decent AVRs are sonically indistinguishable from the best amps at spls they can handle, and if the load is too much, there are AVRs with good pre-outs for external amplification. Not only are good AVRs sonically indistinguishable, they usually come with many other features that are often an actual audible benefit. So, I don't get why an AVR would be unsuitable for 2 channel listening? Is it because the box is too large? You don't want to pay for features you won't use? The latter argument doesn't make sense, as those AVRs are usually less expensive than similar quality 2 channel dedicated components.

There are some bad AVRs and some people prefer to have no video circuitry in their kit. But even with those limitations -- no video gear allowed, no multichannel allowed -- I think there are lots of choices and the Anthem STR qualifies (no video features or pass through or connectivity and no multichanel).
 

sarumbear

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
7,604
Likes
7,313
Location
UK
I'm not sure I follow your line of thought. Sonos, Outlaw, Parasound, Heos (Denon) amp, Yamaha, and others I don't recall at the moment, are just some of the two channel amps/integrated amps that offer a subwoofer crossover/bass management system in the two channel realm.

I don’t have a line of thought. I’m trying to find amplifiers that can be used in a stereo plus subwoofer (2.1) configuration that can fir instance be used with this Emotiva speaker.

The two models so far suggested to me are no longer on the market where I live, in the UK. I have now investigated your suggestions.

Sonos Amp have wired inputs but you still need their app to use it.

Outlaw is a manufacturer I haven’t heard of before. Their RR2160MKII at US$999 is a decent solution. Thank you for information. However, they only sell to US, Canada and Mexico. Not a solution for me.

From what I can see both Parasound and Denon have fixed sub frequency xover, which will make them pretty limited.

Maybe you can begin to see from my point of view?
 

sarumbear

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
7,604
Likes
7,313
Location
UK
Indeed, there are tons of options, though I'm guessing some "fault" will be expressed with these that make them invalid for 2 channel listening.

I resent this comment.

I am trying to find amplifier suitable for stereo solution where two small amplifiers and a subwoofer is used (2.1). If the offered solution are not available to me in the UK is that a "fault" on my side???
 

richard12511

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 23, 2020
Messages
4,335
Likes
6,700
There are some bad AVRs and some people prefer to have no video circuitry in their kit. But even with those limitations -- no video gear allowed, no multichannel allowed -- I think there are lots of choices and the Anthem STR qualifies (no video features or pass through or connectivity and no multichanel).

Indeed. I know Denon and Marantz also make a good dedicated 2 channel rig with good pre-outs for $600 ish, as I almost bought it awhile back.

One argument for which I agree with @sarumbear is that these speakers should be judged as full range speakers. I also understand why Emotiva would compromise midrange fidelity for a bit better full range performance. Something I've noticed is that even people who will be using subwoofers tend to compare new speakers in a full range manner. It's also the way most reviews are done, so it makes good business sense.

For actual stereo usage with this speaker, though, I would definitely recommend people use subwoofers. As you've pointed out, there are many great and relatively cheap options. A truly full range system sounds so much better than a limited range system, and these just aren't great full range speakers. I own the T2+, and I wouldn't even use those without 2.1.

Really though, if you're wanting full range 2.0 performance, you're either gonna have to build it yourself, or spend a lot of money. Even if you can find a speaker that digs down to 20Hz with commendable volume at less than $10,000, the fidelity of that bass is still limited compared to what you could get with 2.1. Closest and cheapest production speaker I know of that gets somewhat close to full range performance is the BMR Tower(at $3,500?).

There are of course other legitimate reasons to avoid 2.1(aesthetics, ergonomics, etc.). If someone is in that boat, I would advise you to look at the Emotiva Towers instead. If price prohibits that, there are cheap active options that dig slightly deeper(JBL 308p) and also measure a bit better.
 

richard12511

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 23, 2020
Messages
4,335
Likes
6,700
I resent this comment.

I am trying to find amplifier suitable for stereo solution where two small amplifiers and a subwoofer is used (2.1). If the offered solution are not available to me in the UK is that a "fault" on my side???

Many options have been presented to you, but you've rejected them all for some reason that I don't understand. If you're saying none of these options are available in the UK, then that makes sense. Is that what you're saying?
 

sarumbear

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
7,604
Likes
7,313
Location
UK

Fixed xover frequency that makes matching very limited.

https://www.sonos.com/en-us/shop/amp.html


You need an app to use it.

https://www.sonos.com/en-us/shop/amp.html

Their RR2160MKII at US$999 is a decent solution. However, they only sell to US, Canada and Mexico. Not a solution for me.

Am I being fussy or stating facts that matter?
 
Last edited:

sarumbear

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
7,604
Likes
7,313
Location
UK

sarumbear

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
7,604
Likes
7,313
Location
UK
Many options have been presented to you, but you've rejected them all for some reason that I don't understand. If you're saying none of these options are available in the UK, then that makes sense. Is that what you're saying?
I am making clear explanations why I reject some units. Please read all my posts.
 

nathan

Senior Member
Joined
May 24, 2020
Messages
361
Likes
252
I don’t have a line of thought. I’m trying to find amplifiers that can be used in a stereo plus subwoofer (2.1) configuration that can fir instance be used with this Emotiva speaker.

The two models so far suggested to me are no longer on the market where I live, in the UK. I have now investigated your suggestions.

Sonos Amp have wired inputs but you still need their app to use it.

Outlaw is a manufacturer I haven’t heard of before. Their RR2160MKII at US$999 is a decent solution. Thank you for information. However, they only sell to US, Canada and Mexico. Not a solution for me.

From what I can see both Parasound and Denon have fixed sub frequency xover, which will make them pretty limited.

Maybe you can begin to see from my point of view?

Sorry, I dont get it.

What features exactly do you seek?

Two channel integrated amp with an adjustable crossover for subwoofer output? Didn't see the requirement to have an adjustable crossover until now.

No remote control? Or only a remote that is NOT a phone app? Didn't see the issue with using a phone app for control until now.

What is your budget? Didn't see any mention of price until now.

There are tons of options but which one you will like is tough to guess.

Note that the Parasound, the Anthem, from my list offer variable crossover choices. I am not sure about the others.

But for the Anthem, for example, you will want to use a computer to set it up. Is that a deal breaker? I dunno. You haven't specified either way.

I guess the conclusion is that while there are LOTS of options on the market at many price points and with various feature sets, and various levels of quality, whether there is an exact fit for your needs in your location at your budget is only something you can decide.

In general, systems that make it easy to add a subwoofer to a two channel setup are quite abundant these days, which was the original point of the discussion.

But I apologize if you don't find that any of the available options are a good fit for you. That's unfortunate.....and that's where the miniDSP comes in ;) If one has a specific need that all of the off the shelf options cannot fulfill, this is a great piece of kit to let you do just about anything you want to in terms of bass management and subwoofers.
 
Last edited:

sarumbear

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
7,604
Likes
7,313
Location
UK
I believe he stated "no AVRs"?, though I'm not sure why.

I sympathise that the meaning of "over-kill" is different in America where it is perfectly normal to use a truck to do grocery shopping or school drop offs :)
 
Top Bottom