Wow, that escalated quickly, and then veered into Bose. I now know I'm truly on an audiophile page!!
So, to cut through all the wild speculation and mis-quotes about how I go direct from computer to production, or don't measure in production etc, and to get straight to the issue;
Summary-A potential fault was observed in one sample of a product shipped in non-standard packing, from a source other than the manufacturer. As a result of this observation, made with no attempt to identify the cause of the issue, a stop the test and stop the presses and an announcement is made that this product cannot be recommended. Pages of comment ensue. Lots of people chime in that do not have the product themselves and so cannot properly contribute to identifying the cause. Some people that do have the product chime in that say they cannot hear this issue. Then some further statement is made that it can only be heard under certain circumstances. Then the solution is apparently that the faulty product is going to be returned to the source to be sent back to Amazon and lost forever to further investigation.
Did I get that summary close?
Do I sound miffed?
Have I ever sounded miffed before, EVER?
OK, having got that off my chest, let me step back and sound like my usual more reasonable self
First, I am not going to comment on issues of frequency balance or issues with the measured frequency response curves. I don't generally comment on a reviewers subjective findings. You like them, you don't like them. Not everyone likes what I do. That's OK. What you like to listen to is clearly subjective. Interpretation of measure responses is subjective. I don't get upset if folks don't like my speakers. Although to qualify that. I guess I would be very upset if NO-ONE liked my speakers.... LOL
Second, and more to the issue at hand, this sounds like a mechanical issue. It appears to be very narrow bandwidth which is why I say this. Something is resonating and vibrating.
There are cabinet vibrations in this frequency range. There are in any speaker at this price point. My speculation is something that is mechanically coupled is vibrating. I took a sample from my lab and did a slow sweep with a good old fashioned analog oscillator, so I could sweep slowly back and forth around 600Hz. Yes, the cabinet is lively in that range, and what I first heard was rattling of the binding posts on the terminal panel (I was using banana plugs to connect to the speaker). Once I tightened them the problem went away. The interesting thing is, that result of the rattle could be heard on every panel of the speaker when I put my ear close. I've had this happen before, once on a TAD speaker where I traced it to the speaker cable plug cover, and another time to a loose spiked foot on the speaker stand. Based on these experiences and extrapolating to the descriptions given, leads me to my assumptions that it is a mechanical issue. Especially as it seems to be level dependent. It's particularly interesting that the effect seemed to be different the next day, and was only detectable at high levels.
The fact that there seemed to be a large negative, momentary, near DC component immediately proceeding the noise is possibly a red herring, but it is mere conjecture at this point.
Now I have not yet listened at the level I think that was used in the test. I still have to continue investigating, but I have rarely played at levels where I see any significant movement of the midrange cone. This fact does surprise me.
So, what is the solution. Sending back the speaker from whence it came seems the worst option. Lost forever, never to be investigated. Leaving an odd question mark about ELAC quality control or my ability to design and manufacture a product? Indeed if I remember correctly, it was stated that the original owner could not hear the sound from the other speaker of the pair? If so, did that owner ever hear any issue the speaker sample that is under investigation?
It seems that my best option is to purchase the pair of speakers from the original owner, and pay to have them shipped to me for a throrough investigation.
I will be in direct contact to determine if this can be agreed upon.
Best regards
Andrew Jones
ELAC
p.s. "miffed" is being polite.....
So, to cut through all the wild speculation and mis-quotes about how I go direct from computer to production, or don't measure in production etc, and to get straight to the issue;
Summary-A potential fault was observed in one sample of a product shipped in non-standard packing, from a source other than the manufacturer. As a result of this observation, made with no attempt to identify the cause of the issue, a stop the test and stop the presses and an announcement is made that this product cannot be recommended. Pages of comment ensue. Lots of people chime in that do not have the product themselves and so cannot properly contribute to identifying the cause. Some people that do have the product chime in that say they cannot hear this issue. Then some further statement is made that it can only be heard under certain circumstances. Then the solution is apparently that the faulty product is going to be returned to the source to be sent back to Amazon and lost forever to further investigation.
Did I get that summary close?
Do I sound miffed?
Have I ever sounded miffed before, EVER?
OK, having got that off my chest, let me step back and sound like my usual more reasonable self
First, I am not going to comment on issues of frequency balance or issues with the measured frequency response curves. I don't generally comment on a reviewers subjective findings. You like them, you don't like them. Not everyone likes what I do. That's OK. What you like to listen to is clearly subjective. Interpretation of measure responses is subjective. I don't get upset if folks don't like my speakers. Although to qualify that. I guess I would be very upset if NO-ONE liked my speakers.... LOL
Second, and more to the issue at hand, this sounds like a mechanical issue. It appears to be very narrow bandwidth which is why I say this. Something is resonating and vibrating.
There are cabinet vibrations in this frequency range. There are in any speaker at this price point. My speculation is something that is mechanically coupled is vibrating. I took a sample from my lab and did a slow sweep with a good old fashioned analog oscillator, so I could sweep slowly back and forth around 600Hz. Yes, the cabinet is lively in that range, and what I first heard was rattling of the binding posts on the terminal panel (I was using banana plugs to connect to the speaker). Once I tightened them the problem went away. The interesting thing is, that result of the rattle could be heard on every panel of the speaker when I put my ear close. I've had this happen before, once on a TAD speaker where I traced it to the speaker cable plug cover, and another time to a loose spiked foot on the speaker stand. Based on these experiences and extrapolating to the descriptions given, leads me to my assumptions that it is a mechanical issue. Especially as it seems to be level dependent. It's particularly interesting that the effect seemed to be different the next day, and was only detectable at high levels.
The fact that there seemed to be a large negative, momentary, near DC component immediately proceeding the noise is possibly a red herring, but it is mere conjecture at this point.
Now I have not yet listened at the level I think that was used in the test. I still have to continue investigating, but I have rarely played at levels where I see any significant movement of the midrange cone. This fact does surprise me.
So, what is the solution. Sending back the speaker from whence it came seems the worst option. Lost forever, never to be investigated. Leaving an odd question mark about ELAC quality control or my ability to design and manufacture a product? Indeed if I remember correctly, it was stated that the original owner could not hear the sound from the other speaker of the pair? If so, did that owner ever hear any issue the speaker sample that is under investigation?
It seems that my best option is to purchase the pair of speakers from the original owner, and pay to have them shipped to me for a throrough investigation.
I will be in direct contact to determine if this can be agreed upon.
Best regards
Andrew Jones
ELAC
p.s. "miffed" is being polite.....
