Elac Debut Reference DBR-62 Speaker Review

[maxxone]

hi, I would like to know how you set these speakers with the subwoofer? (lowpass crossover)

I have mine set at 80hz. Once I upgrade the receiver I plan on 70hz however. My sub is Rythmik FV18.
The reason why I want it lower is some male vocals make my sub freak out. Some Eminem songs come to mind.

 

[oldmanhifi]

hi, I would like to know how you set these speakers with the subwoofer? (lowpass crossover)

I have an SVS SB2000 Pro. SVS recommends setting crossover at 60Hz with 24db/octave slope. That works pretty well for me.

 

[Beershaun]

for people asking about using a sub with these, my SVS sb-2000 is great with these. Crossover is 80hz but my current system only allows one setting so I can't play with it. The preference scoring in the beginning tells us the answer. Adding a good subwoofer is alway going to improve your enjoyment.

 

[NightFlight]

Hey all. First post.

Well, I bit on these - thank you Amirm for all the hard work. I found a demo pair on canuckaudiomart,com for ~$550CAD. Did a 2hr speed run and replaced the RP600M Anyone want to buy some Klipsch? -lol... no seriously - they really are for sale...

Source ->Freya ->Vidar. Wondering if a pair of Vidar will will really net any benefit. Not that I'm complaining, just wondering what sort of ceiling I'm looking at. Soon as I heard what these do, I want more. Its a sickness. I used to live with a lot better than these and I've been sticking my head in the sand for the last decade(s), because of the associated costs with feeding the need/hobby.

My room is a mess with modes and reflections too. The REL 5 Sub does okay - playing with the crossover point and power level. Ah the joys of subs...

Or would I get more benefit from a pair of Aegir mono blocks? I'm also looking to bypass or replace the caps with copper foil. Replace the resistors, etc.

Anyhow. Lots of things to play with. Wheeee.

 

[Denon545]

I think the ELAC DFR are fine speakers for their price point, but you do get what you pay for. When put up against higher-tier speakers with a more refined presentation like the Buchardts, even the Debut Reference will show its weaknesses. There is some harshness/peakiness in the treble, and the upper bass is not as full creating a thinner overall sound. The midbass however is just fine and I felt it exceeded the S400 there. I did not do a low bass comparison as you need to run them in stereo for that to hear how recorded material sums (IME) and this was a mono comparison.

The S400's are able to create a spooky realistic sound, especially in the female vocal range. The Debut Reference are very good for the price but still sound like a speaker so they don't really "take me there" or bring the singer into the room in the same way. There is a very noticeable difference in tweeter level. The ELACs are more energetic whereas the Buchardts are more intimate. Again this is all relative to a...$2100/pair (wow, they must have increased the price) speaker. It's easy to pick out differences when you can fast switch.

The S400's will remain in the main system with my subs but the ELACs will do well and look great in the living room

I am finding that the Elac DFR52's have some recession in the midrange. Seems as if the singer is behind the band on a lot of tracks. Do you notice this with your pair? I am running Audyssey XT32, but have it limited to 200hz and below. I might try running it full range to see if it can boost the mids a little.

 

[Chromatischism]

I can't say I've found that on the towers. Try increasing the toe in?

 

[Livnmuskoka]

I am finding that the Elac DFR52's have some recession in the midrange. Seems as if the singer is behind the band on a lot of tracks. Do you notice this with your pair? I am running Audyssey XT32, but have it limited to 200hz and below. I might try running it full range to see if it can boost the mids a little.

The only time I remember hearing the singer sound like he was behind the rest of the band was when I heard B&W 804D3's from a Bryston 4B3 amp in a well set up room at a dealer.
But looking at how those speakers measure isn't much of a surprise.
Don't know about the DFR52's but it doesn't happen with my DBR-62's.

 

[Denon545]

Thank you both! Yes, toe-in helped. I had them aimed past the outside of each shoulder. I aimed them a little more towards the main listening position and it bought the vocals forward. Never really experienced that with other speakers before.

 

[bboris77]

As I am using these in a near-field configuration, I found that it is absolutely essential to position them at the right height and have just a bit of toe-in. In may case, the point of focus is way behind my head. There is that sweet zone where the soundstage is really well balanced with the center image, and frequency response is just right. Too much toe-in, and the soundstage diminishes, and upper mids become more emphasized. Obviously, there is the issue of personal preference.

 

[taisho]

A few weeks ago I finally had time to rearrange my room and started using ELACs again, listening to a lot of calm instrumental soundtracks. Today I tried to improve the quality of sound and ran tests in REW with UMIK-1 to find the optimal positioning of speakers and then apply EQ.

During the tests, the left speaker showed horrible distortion in low frequencies. Something vibrated like crazy. I even had old REW measurements to confirm that previously the left speaker had the same low level of distortion as its right sibling. I didn't use grills previously, so I took the one from the left speaker off. It was a real facepalm moment because the grill was upside-down... Needless to say, the measurements with correctly placed grill showed almost no distortion and there were no audible vibrations.

 

[NightFlight]

Personally, I think (at least the black version) look awful with the tweeter grills on. And as the above points out, just one more thing to go wrong and completely unnecessary IMHO.

 

[ROOSKIE]

Has somebody thought about measuring the Thiele-Small parameters of the woofer? Since this is such a successful design it could be nice to do some reverse engineering of the low frequency load.

I can measure with DATS3. I will do it tonight or tmrw.

I measured one driver.
The drive unit has a nice cast basket and feels nice in the hand. It is pretty robust, with lots of venting and airflow. Visually it could be one of the $40-$80 drivers one buys at PE or Madisound. While it likely costs ELAC much less than that, I think most people would happy/satisfied to open up a speaker under $600 and see these woofers. Nice.
Measured with DATS3 using the added mass method which is not 100% accurate.

Unit weight 5.1 LBS
Piston Diameter 5.125"
SPL 88.2db @ 1w/1m
RE 4.47 ohms
FS 45.79hz
Qts .3511
Qes .3718
Qms 6.319
LE 0.4201
mms 18.09 g
Vas 0.5864 cu ft

 

[Beershaun]

Has anyone measured the port performance and resonance? @amirm do you have data in the individual driver performance like your more recent speaker measurements? I am interested to know if the 2-d slot port design built into the base is more resistant to mid range resonance then the typical plastic tube designs.

 

[Interference]

I measured one driver.
The drive unit has a nice cast basket and feels nice in the hand. It is pretty robust, with lots of venting and airflow. Visually it could be one of the $40-$80 drivers one buys at PE or Madisound. While it likely costs ELAC much less than that, I think most people would happy/satisfied to open up a speaker under $600 and see these woofers. Nice.
Measured with DATS3 using the added mass method which is not 100% accurate.

Unit weight 5.1 LBS
Piston Diameter 5.125"
SPL 88.2db @ 1w/1m
RE 4.47 ohms
FS 45.79hz
Qts .3511
Qes .3718
Qms 6.319
LE 0.4201
mms 18.09 g
Vas 0.5864 cu ft

Thanks! Yes, I had saw some pictures. It is a nicely crafted driver. I guess it does not come with the perks of more expensive series, such as shorting rings, but I guess it's right for the job.

 

[akarma]

The drive unit has a nice cast basket and feels nice in the hand. It is pretty robust, with lots of venting and airflow. Visually it could be one of the $40-$80 drivers one buys at PE or Madisound. While it likely costs ELAC much less than that, I think most people would happy/satisfied to open up a speaker under $600 and see these woofers. Nice.

Even Edifier has drivers with cast basket. Nothing special. A lot of drivers are available now from China

 

[ROOSKIE]

Even Edifier has drivers with cast basket. Nothing special. A lot of drivers are available now from China

Is there something confusing to you in what I said?

 

[hascherpur]

Quick question to all of you DBR owners. I just got my pair of DBRs and I hooked it up to my Denon AVR (x1600h). I am currently thinking about buying a second pair to replace my LSR305 desktop setup. When listening in front of the TV (to simulate a near field situation) I noticed that the music was definitely influenced by the AVR. I changed to "pure mode" but I noticed that especially (non-distorted) guitar solos were a tad recessed. What I am wondering is whether the speakers are tuned that way, or if my AVR is doing shenanigans.

Also, I am not sure whether I power amps allow me to apply a fine DSP curve (since I want to use the same DAC that I use for my headphone amp).

 

[Chromatischism]

Very hard to say without knowing how the AVR is set up. It could be your EQ (Audyssey) or other settings.

 

[hascherpur]

Thanks for the answers. I have not used the room correction yet (as I am waiting for more speakers to arrive) and I am running the DBRs in stereo. I will check for room modes.. maybe the AVR is devious. I could also buy a power amp to check, but that seems a bit over the top. I am really hoping that the issue stems from the AVR as I love the detail retrieval on the DBRs when compared to the LSR305s... I was super surprised when I was able to hear the timbre of the snare drum of a recording that I know super well. Kind of shocked me. Well, let me try more.

Are EQing the DBRs? Or is EQing generally something you need to for the DBRs?

 

[Chromatischism]

I think EQ helps in nearly all cases at least for the room. That means flattening the bass region up to at least 300 Hz in small rooms, maybe 200 Hz in large rooms. Beyond that, it depends on the speaker.

As to what could be causing the sound difference in pure direct, I'm not familiar with that mode since I don't use it (as it would disable my room EQ and subs), but maybe it zeros out level and distance settings? Did you have tone controls adjusted?