Elac Debut Reference DBR-62 Speaker Review

[panther]

The boominess might be room-related. Did you measure and try to EQ or change the placement ? Because the ELAC have a lot of bass.

I played around with placement a bit and with the plugs in and out. Things sounded less boomy when I adjusted my sub and experimented with the amp sub settings. I guess I’ve maybe interpreted the ELACs wrong I thought they might be a bit more relaxing speaker, forgot to add I wouldn’t know how to measure and haven’t had any experience with using eq before.

 

[Gaboz]

Hallo, I wish to know how much are these speakers sensitive to position. Can these bookshelf speakers be placed in a bookshelf? Someone says front ported design allows this positioning, someone says that anyway soundstage suffers and the frequency response is modified.
I've seen others asking for this in the thread, I would be grateful if someone could give an opinion. Thanks

 

[hardisj]

Shameless plug in case anyone is looking to buy these speakers and wants to save a few bucks, I have listed mine for sale here:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-speakers-the-same-ones-tested-by-amir.14932/

 

[panther]

My order arrived today, great speed in shipping as I only ordered them Sunday night... but they sent the wrong speakers!

 

[bboris77]

My order arrived today, great speed in shipping as I only ordered them Sunday night... but they sent the wrong speakers!

That sucks...like wrong colour or wrong model?

 

[panther]

That sucks...like wrong colour or wrong model?

Yeah it was the wrong colour,not wrong speaker I guess. The funny thing is it doesn't even show as shipped when I check the order, I was shocked when it showed up at the door.

 

[panther]

Here we go with EQ attempt. I wouldn't expect as much improvement in the score as with Vanatoo as this speaker already measured well.

Corrected PIR:


View attachment 66369

Corrected LW, ER and SP:

View attachment 66370

Filter attached.

So I'll admit I am new to this, but trying to import this into the Peace GUI for Equalizer APO I just keep getting a no filters found error message.

 

[Beershaun]

Putting this in the correct thread.

I have a noob question on this. How do I calculate what amp would satisfy the needs of this speaker using the impedance curve? Specifically understanding Amir's callout that at ~110hz there is a phase angle of -50 with 8ohms resistance. How do I calculate the power demand at that point?

I currently have an Amp that outputs 100w/ channel RMS into 8Ohms 2 channels driven full range with no more than 0.08% THD. Dynamic power output is 2x130W at 8 Ohms (0.08% THD).

I did a little internet sleuthing for equations and pick up P = (V^2 / Z) * COS(Ф) from the audioholics site article on understanding speaker resistance and amplifier needs: https://www.audioholics.com/loudspeaker-design/understanding-impedance-electrical-phase

If I use V= 28.3 (maximum voltage) z=8ohms theta=-50
I get P=96.6w So should I consider this this maximum instantaneous wattage needed for this speaker or recommended continous wattage? Or did I get it wrong altogether? Or If I'm correct, Am I right in thinking I'm good to go with my current Amp and it's within the rated power at the 0.08% THD and I'm not moving into a higher distortion level?

 

[flipflop]

So I'll admit I am new to this, but trying to import this into the Peace GUI for Equalizer APO I just keep getting a no filters found error message.

Peace doesn't work with that kind of filters. You can try these:
Filter 1: ON PK Fc 345 Hz Gain 0.4 dB Q 12.000
Filter 2: ON PK Fc 429 Hz Gain 0.7 dB Q 12.000
Filter 3: ON PK Fc 493 Hz Gain 0.7 dB Q 17.000
Filter 4: ON PK Fc 575 Hz Gain 2.0 dB Q 10.000
Filter 5: ON PK Fc 624 Hz Gain -2.1 dB Q 10.000
Filter 6: ON PK Fc 790 Hz Gain -1.2 dB Q 9.000
Filter 7: ON PK Fc 902 Hz Gain -1.3 dB Q 5.000
Filter 8: ON PK Fc 1129 Hz Gain 0.7 dB Q 7.000
Filter 9: ON PK Fc 1400 Hz Gain 1.2 dB Q 9.000
Filter 10: ON PK Fc 1698 Hz Gain 1.5 dB Q 6.000
Filter 11: ON PK Fc 1940 Hz Gain 1.5 dB Q 20.000
Filter 12: ON PK Fc 2220 Hz Gain 0.9 dB Q 23.000
Filter 13: ON PK Fc 3140 Hz Gain -0.5 dB Q 5.000
Filter 14: ON PK Fc 5000 Hz Gain -1.7 dB Q 2.400
Filter 15: ON PK Fc 6940 Hz Gain -1.8 dB Q 2.800
Filter 16: ON PK Fc 8480 Hz Gain -1.0 dB Q 6.000
Filter 17: ON PK Fc 11000 Hz Gain -2.2 dB Q 1.800
Filter 18: ON PK Fc 13100 Hz Gain -1.2 dB Q 3.000
Filter 19: ON PK Fc 15290 Hz Gain -0.7 dB Q 5.000
Filter 20: ON PK Fc 17530 Hz Gain -1.9 dB Q 2.500
Preamp needs to be set to -2 dB.

 

[daftcombo]

Anyone blindtested those EQs successfully showing improvement?

 

[wje]

Anyone blindtested those EQs successfully showing improvement?

Very good question. Though, from looking at the adjustments applied, it would appear that the bumps made at the reflected frequencies, might just be enough to add a bit of "excitement" to the speakers. After a few months of using my pair of Debut Reference, and dealing with my 56 year old ears, a little excitement to the sound by the adjustments might be in order. While I don't use the Peace EQ app, I do have the MiniDSP and could easily apply those filters to be handled by that device as the signal goes between my IOTAVX SA3 and Crown amplifier.

 

[Honken]

Since my setup is in theory programmable via shellscript, I could attempt to blind test myself this weekend if I find the time for it. I could also try to include the EQ made by @flipflop and not only the EQ made by @QMuse.

Speaking of which, do you have a picture of what the response looks like with your EQ @flipflop? Not that it matters more than the sound itself, I'm merely curious.

 

[flipflop]

Speaking of which, do you have a picture of what the response looks like with your EQ @flipflop? Not that it matters more than the sound itself, I'm merely curious.

Before (dark red) and after (regular red) EQ on-axis:

Before and after EQ PIR:

As you can see, the EQ is based on PIR and although it might not be completely obvious, it also improves the on-axis response.

I also made an EQ for a flat LW, but it has an on-axis response that's more inaccurate than the one shown above due to the ON-LW mismatch that's inherent in this speaker.

 

[Honken]

Very interesting, thanks for the pictures (and EQ, of course)! Looking forward to try it out.

 

[Foxxy]

Well, now you did it, amirm. I just went and ordered those blind. I didn't even plan on spending on speakers right now but with this strong recommendation.... argh.
But then again, same ears. Loved the original Debut, had a sound exactly like the Focal Aria we tested it against, just less detailed. Amazing. Then came the Debut 2 and... ech. Not good.
And then there is the small Artist Cafe where the owner is a sound engineer. And what is playing at the bar? A pair of nice Genelec monitors. I just love sitting there with a coffee listening to the Jazz coming out of them.

So really stoked, should have them early next week.

 

[Southall-1998]

Are the DBR-62 relatively easy to drive?

Will something like the 44w Onkyo A-9010 be sufficient enough for small/medium rooms?

S.

 

[wje]

According to the review, they are not easy to drive despite meeting rating.

"However, note the area I have circled. Impedance is high at about 8 ohms but the phase angle is quite acute at nearly 50 degrees. This means the speaker will ask for current when the output voltage is very low. So you better have a beefy amplifier to drive this speaker."

True. I couldn't imagine trying to drive them with a small receiver or integrated amp. While I don't listen to mine at ear bleeding levels, I do have the Crown XLS1502 amp with plenty of reserves. But, the Elac Debut Reference isn't nearly as hard to drive as some of the speakers from 10+ years ago that had relative low efficiency (e.g. 82, etc.)

 

[wje]

Ugh! Just realized my current plug-in for the MiniDSP only has 10 PEQ configuration slots. I couldn't fully implement all the settings. I'll have to look for a plug-in with more slots in order to carry this out with the MiniDSP.

 

[Benedium]

Are the DBR-62 relatively easy to drive?

Will something like the 44w Onkyo A-9010 be sufficient enough for small/medium rooms?

S.

Not sure if this is useful but, after auto calibration, my denon x3600h av receiver sets my new dbr62 levels to about -2db where previously it set my old mission lx2 levels to about -4db. Both speakers in same position.

 

[Foxxy]

Are the DBR-62 relatively easy to drive?

Will something like the 44w Onkyo A-9010 be sufficient enough for small/medium rooms?

S.

It all depends on how loud you want to go. A difficult load like the Elac will effectively cut your safe AMP output in half (strong simplification), which is -3dB of max volume.

Not sure if this is useful but, after auto calibration, my denon x3600h av receiver sets my new dbr62 levels to about -2db where previously it set my old mission lx2 levels to about -4db. Both speakers in same position.

No, this has nothing to do with it, it merely means the Elac is 2dB more efficient than your old speakers.
edit: misread and thought Elac was 2dB less efficient but nope, it's more.