Do you know English?

[killdozzer]

poor teaching methods were a big factor

Oh c'mon! Don't jump on the train of blaming the education system. If for no other reason then because the train is full and 80% of people don't deserve to be on it.

I'm learning French. It is very difficult. My teachers are out of their minds how satisfied they are with me and I'm completely disappointed with myself. After I aced the lvl1 with flying colours I could only speak simple sentences in something like 4 tenses all together and I was devastated. Then it was made clear to me that given the difficulty, people (especially my age) are not expected half of that even if they're very gifted. My expectations worked against me.

 

[FrantzM]

I would say I speak English at a level that's roughly equivalent to my Norwegian, perhaps somewhat worse (in terms of overall fluency, my pronounciation/accent is a different matter). The kitchen accessories task was interesting, because I realized there were utensils whose names I know neither in Norwegian nor English (and I do not speak any other languages!). For many people I think certain subjects are easier to discuss in a different language, assuming they are proficient at said language. As an example: discussing audio literature or IT is much easier to do in English, because most of the content itself is in English. This probably goes for many fields and professions where English is primarily used.

At the same time; I would have a much easier time discussing Norwegian politics in Norwegian, for obvious reasons.

Same with me... I have a mother tongue: Haitian Creole , was educated in French, then studied and lived in the USA. When it comes to my profession, IT, I prefer to discuss it (pun intended) in English but am often forced to do it in French ... I read mostly in English then French, speak mostly Creole and French. listen to Sports in English and movies if they're native European, in French with French Subtitles, for anything else it is English with English Subtitles. Of course American or movies shot in English are enjoyed in English... with whatever subtitles available. I mostly follow American sports, in American English. Big NFL fan here and NBA and a bit of MLB.
A mess.. Strangely. For technical writing, let's say I compose in English but the output is presented to the customer in French. Business letters are redacted in English then translated when (very often) needed

Some would call this a mess. i call it a blessing.

 

[Gorgonzola]

Oh c'mon! Don't jump on the train of blaming the education system. If for no other reason then because the train is full and 80% of people don't deserve to be on it.

I'm learning French. It is very difficult. My teachers are out of their minds how satisfied they are with me and I'm completely disappointed with myself. After I aced the lvl1 with flying colours I could only speak simple sentences in something like 4 tenses all together and I was devastated. Then it was made clear to me that given the difficulty, people (especially my age) are not expected half of that even if they're very gifted. My expectations worked against me.

Well you would hadda been there, (experiencing French instruction in the English system in Quebec in the '50s and early '60s). French was taught like Latin, all declensions and conjugations with practically no conversational emphasis. Also accents and usages were all cosmopolitan French, not the French Canadian vernacular as heard on the streets.

After university I began to take a practical French course with a French Canadian instructor. I was making great progress but, unfortunately, moved to Toronto and gave up French study.

 

[Timbo2]

Funny story related to this. When I worked for Sony and going to Japan, I wanted to learn Japanese. One day at lunch there I asked my Japanese counterpart the word for knife. He says, "knife-o!" I asked, how about fork? He said, "fork-o!" I said I wanted to learn the real Japanese names, not the adopted English ones. He said hardly anyone uses them! So I went ahead and used those English adopted words with the waitress and worked like a charm...

What you find in Japanese and I'm sure other languages are so called "false friends". English words in their adopted language that don't mean quite the same thing or are totally different. A common example in Japanese would be ジュース or "juusu". It's derived from "juice" in English, but can mean both juice and any sweetened non-alcoholic drink like a coca-cola.

There are more - Wasei-eigo: False Friends in Japanese and more still that are not included in the link.

What really painful is both figuring out the usage within Japanese and a proper Japanese accent. My brain, knowing the English meaning and English pronunciation, struggles mightily to "mispronounce" the word properly to a get the Japanese pronunciation and intonation.

 

[Matias]

So my problem is that I'm unilingual in English -- sad, really. I had 7 years of French in primary and high school but never really mastered it; I can't blame myself entirely because poor teaching methods were a big factor. I'm speaking of French instruction in the English language school system in Quebec a many years ago; hopefully things have changed there since.

One issue, (fairly minor), is different English usage in between Britain and North American: stupidly here in Canada we tend to use a blend. A few instances:

• USA & Canada: hood (as of a car); Britain: bonnet
• USA & Canada: trunk; Britain: boot
• USA & Canada: shock absorber; Britain: damper (which is more accurate)
• USA: color & flavor; Britain: colour & flavour; Canada: mostly colour & flavour
• Canada & Britain: cheque (as issued on a bank account); USA: check
• USA & Canada: fall (most often); Britain: autumn
• ... it gets even weirder when it comes to slang terms.

In particular I wish I spoke French, German, Spanish, and Mandarin. (My son speaks a fair bit of Mandarin. Our daughter-in-law was born in Beijing.)

There is always the free Duolingo app to train a few minutes a day on as many languages as you want.

 

[DanielT]

What you find in Japanese and I'm sure other languages are so called "false friends". English words in their adopted language that don't mean quite the same thing or are totally different. A common example in Japanese would be ジュース or "juusu". It's derived from "juice" in English, but can mean both juice and any sweetened non-alcoholic drink like a coca-cola.

There are more - Wasei-eigo: False Friends in Japanese and more still that are not included in the link.

What really painful is both figuring out the usage within Japanese and a proper Japanese accent. My brain, knowing the English meaning and English pronunciation, struggles mightily to "mispronounce" the word properly to a get the Japanese pronunciation and intonation.

Hi Timbo2.
Do you think my post no.40 racist? Or rather you will find that clip from the Austin Power movie,racist? In that case, I apologize. Not my intention.

 

[Timbo2]

Hi Timbo2.
Do you think my post no.40 racist? Or rather you will find that clip from the Austin Power movie,racist? In that case, I apologize. Not my intention.

I'm not especially politically correct, so no worries from me. I've always enjoyed the Austin Powers films.

 

[DanielT]

I'm not especially politically correct, so no worries from me. I've always enjoyed the Austin Powers films.

Good to hear. I counter and offer this:

Typical Youtube, seems to be blocked when I put the video on ASR.

 

[somebodyelse]

One issue, (fairly minor), is different English usage in between Britain and North American: stupidly here in Canada we tend to use a blend.

Or where the possible meanings are the same but the more common one is different, so may not be received as intended - patronise/patronize came up recently in another thread. The Australians and New Zealanders can probably add to the list.

 

[Timbo2]

Or where the possible meanings are the same but the more common one is different, so may not be received as intended - patronise/patronize came up recently in another thread. The Australians and New Zealanders can probably add to the list.

One of my favorites is "scheme". In US usage a scheme is never a good thing.

One schemes to take money from unsuspecting elderly people in the US. While in the UK they have a pension scheme. They may be taking money from young people and giving it to the elderly, but it simply denotes a process or system. The intent in British usage is neutral.

 

[oivavoi]

Interesting topic. I have long been aware of this concerning my own use of language, actually. English has been my (academic) working language for about 18 years. I never have any problem saying what I want. At the same time, I am under absolutely no illusion that I can express myself as well as I can in Norwegian. The utensil test doesn't really work for me, as I love to cook and have been using lots of English recipes where the utensil names are used. But when it comes to typical "garage tools" for example - then I really have no idea what most of the things are called! And for daily usage, I just ain't as smooth when it comes to expressing my thoughts spontaneously in English as in Norwegian. I might typically say things in a more cumbersome way in English than I will in Norwegian, because I don't know the language well enough to take good shortcuts.

I have otherwise become very interested in languages in my adult years. At school I always thought I sucked at languages, but it turned out it was only because I wasn't interested. With motivation and the right way of learning I find that learning a language can be really fun. Now I'm up to six - French, German, Hebrew and Arabic in addition to Norwegian and English. Next on the list is to become even better in Arabic, and to get started with Urdu and Spanish

 

[HammerSandwich]

Funny story related to this. When I worked for Sony and going to Japan, I wanted to learn Japanese. One day at lunch there I asked my Japanese counterpart the word for knife. He says, "knife-o!" I asked, how about fork? He said, "fork-o!" I said I wanted to learn the real Japanese names, not the adopted English ones. He said hardly anyone uses them! So I went ahead and used those English adopted words with the waitress and worked like a charm...

Might have mentioned this before, but...

I worked with a thickly accented Scot for a year. In Kansas. There was once a tense moment when Mac noticed dirty utensils & told the waitress, "I need a fork."

(Helpful tip, should you ever dine with a thickly accented Scot: "She doesn't understand. Show it to her," will not improve anything.)

 

[GDK]

Also accents and usages were all cosmopolitan French, not the French Canadian vernacular as heard on the streets.

I can confirm this. For some reason the French they taught the Anglos throughout Canada was (and still is judging from my son’s homework) very different from the French that is actually spoken in this country.

 

[Gorgonzola]

There is always the free Duolingo app to train a few minutes a day on as many languages as you want.

But I notice that Duolingo doesn't seem to offer differentiated courses for different locals for the particular languages.

I was complaining that my instruction in French, (many years ago), was in cosmopolitan French, (a.k.a. Parisian or "Île-de-France" French), not French Canadian. In fact differences between the too are comparatively minor compare to the variation in, say, Spanish in Spain and Mexico, or Arabic in Morocco and Saudi Arabia and the Qur'an. Doulingo offers "Chinese" by which it presumably means Mandarin, but Mandarin is as different from Cantonese, (Yue), as Italian is from Spanish.

 

[StuartC]

Two of the most interesting questions I ask people who are bi/multi-lingual, and whom live/work somewhere which prevents them using their native tongue regularly are these:

What language do you think in? and
What language do you count in?

 

[ZolaIII]

Two of the most interesting questions I ask people who are bi/multi-lingual, and whom live/work somewhere which prevents them using their native tongue regularly are these:

What language do you think in? and
What language do you count in?

I think on my own but logic is a guide line.
Account in that majority of us use Arabic numeric simbols but we don't count on any language.

 

[StuartC]

I think on my own but logic is a guide line.
Account in that majority of us use Arabic numeric simbols but we don't count on any language.

so when I asked these questions to a French ex-colleague who had lived in Sweden for 10 yrs, and was married to a Swedish lady, he answered that he thought in Swedish but counted in French.

Similarly, my wife is Bulgarian, thinks in both English and Bulgarian, but counts in Bulgarian.

 

[ZolaIII]

so when I asked these questions to a French ex-colleague who had lived in Sweden for 10 yrs, and was married to a Swedish lady, he answered that he thought in Swedish but counted in French.

Similarly, my wife is Bulgarian, thinks in both English and Bulgarian, but counts in Bulgarian.

Thing is when I think about numeric problem I see numbers not the words whit which I will express them. Decade system with Arab numbers as that's how I learned it originally. Never ever tried to do it on Roman system which I also know but as secondary. I just to use lot of now mostly not in active use any more languages (Latin, old Greek, Sankrit) and some of popular one's (English and German) during thinking and interpretations of original writings (during the studies and afterwards) but followed logic.

 

[killdozzer]

Two of the most interesting questions I ask people who are bi/multi-lingual, and whom live/work somewhere which prevents them using their native tongue regularly are these:

What language do you think in? and
What language do you count in?

Ah, you see, some languages you have to think in to be able to speak them. The specificity of numbers in French... You better learn numbers in French and not be thinking in your language and then translate them.

Putting a verb at the end of the sentence in German asks of you to compose it in advance, again, think it through in German, don't just translate. A critique of my language is usually that you can not think and just start a sentence and bend it 3-4 times towards the end.

 

[GeorgeWalk]

I came across this last year. As a native English speaker, I never thought about this. This seems to be natural with most native English speakers. It is never taught in school. There is no real rule, but it sounds "natural".

Adjective Order in English

“Every Sunday, my grandma makes an Italian big meal,” said no one ever. Why? It’s technically correct—it’s a big meal, it’s…

www.grammarly.com